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Tiger Predation

United States Pckts Offline
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( This post was last modified: 08-13-2018, 09:57 PM by Pckts )

(08-12-2018, 11:09 AM)Wolverine Wrote:
(08-11-2018, 04:55 AM)peter Wrote:  
 c - Elephants


A century ago, in the northern part of India, elephant herds often had a tusker guarding the calves. According to Knowles (see above), male tigers and tuskers clashed at times. In his book, some of these were described.

I could confirm by personal experience that elephants do afraid of tigers. In Palamau (Betla) national park in 1993 our riding tourist elephant faced a tiger who was resting in a cave in distance 10-15 meters from us. Since I'm a bit short sighted I was not able to see the eyes of tiger in the cave darkness despite my fellow and the mahout several times told me that tiger is watching us. I asked the mahout to move elephant closer to the cave. When we approached in distance 10-15 meters from cave entrance suddenly the elephant started to tremble violently, with shake waves through all the animal's body from trunk to the tail. The animal was quite scared or at least very nervous in the presence of the big cat. This violent vibrations continued several minutes. I started to offer to mahout money to move the elephant even closer but he refused. Than I got mad to him because I didn't succeed to see the burning eyes of the tiger despite my other tourist fellow clearly saw.
But we have to take into account that Asiatic elephants in general are bit coward animals, they easily panic. There are cases when only a close roar of panther could cause whole elephant heard to flee away or start panic.
Here as pointed Rishi the important question is how tiger kill a giant herbivore (bovines excluded because they are not so gigantic). As we can see from this videos even for big prides of lions consisting of 14-20 cats is quite difficult to hunt subadult elephant and kick it down even when the lions in big numbers like grapes cover the victim's body:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxgx8Ah-hNE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4nG4JsAyKY


 For solitary cat as tiger this should be very-very-very difficult...

Nice story @Wolverine 

I think it also has to do with the captive Elephants that are used by the mahouts are not accustomed to Tigers compared to their wild cousins, they do have many encounters with Tigers obviously but it's always with a Mahout atop of them, even so, I've seen captive Elephants charge at Tigers as well but usually after the Tiger charges first maybe if they lived in their wild herds and had developed the natural hatred that comes from the natural circumstances, they'd probably be more like the one below.


Aswath Saravanan M
That's the power of elephant 

The largest land mammal showing it’s supremacy over strongest big cats.


*This image is copyright of its original author
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
-Oscar Wilde
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United States paul cooper Online
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(08-13-2018, 09:00 PM)Pckts Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 11:09 AM)Wolverine Wrote:
(08-11-2018, 04:55 AM)peter Wrote:  
 c - Elephants


A century ago, in the northern part of India, elephant herds often had a tusker guarding the calves. According to Knowles (see above), male tigers and tuskers clashed at times. In his book, some of these were described.

I could confirm by personal experience that elephants do afraid of tigers. In Palamau (Betla) national park in 1993 our riding tourist elephant faced a tiger who was resting in a cave in distance 10-15 meters from us. Since I'm a bit short sighted I was not able to see the eyes of tiger in the cave darkness despite my fellow and the mahout several times told me that tiger is watching us. I asked the mahout to move elephant closer to the cave. When we approached in distance 10-15 meters from cave entrance suddenly the elephant started to tremble violently, with shake waves through all the animal's body from trunk to the tail. The animal was quite scared or at least very nervous in the presence of the big cat. This violent vibrations continued several minutes. I started to offer to mahout money to move the elephant even closer but he refused. Than I got mad to him because I didn't succeed to see the burning eyes of the tiger despite my other tourist fellow clearly saw.
But we have to take into account that Asiatic elephants in general are bit coward animals, they easily panic. There are cases when only a close roar of panther could cause whole elephant heard to flee away or start panic.
Here as pointed Rishi the important question is how tiger kill a giant herbivore (bovines excluded because they are not so gigantic). As we can see from this videos even for big prides of lions consisting of 14-20 cats is quite difficult to hunt subadult elephant and kick it down even when the lions in big numbers like grapes cover the victim's body:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxgx8Ah-hNE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4nG4JsAyKY


 For solitary cat as tiger this should be very-very-very difficult...

Nice story @Wolverine 

I think it also has to do with the captive Elephants that are used by the mahouts are not accustomed to Tigers compared to their wild cousins, they do have many encounters with Tigers obviously but it's always with a Mahout atop of them, even so, I've seen captive Elephants charge at Tigers as well but usually after the Tiger charges first maybe if they lived in their wild herds and had developed the natural hatred that comes from the natural circumstances, they'd probably be more like the one below.


Aswath Saravanan M
That's the power of elephant 

The largest land mammal showing it’s supremacy over strongest big cats.


*This image is copyright of its original author

Whos that male tiger with his cubs?
Show your worth by what you seek!
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United States Pckts Offline
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( This post was last modified: 08-14-2018, 12:25 AM by Pckts )

(08-13-2018, 11:27 PM)paul cooper Wrote:
(08-13-2018, 09:00 PM)Pckts Wrote:
(08-12-2018, 11:09 AM)Wolverine Wrote:
(08-11-2018, 04:55 AM)peter Wrote:  
 c - Elephants


A century ago, in the northern part of India, elephant herds often had a tusker guarding the calves. According to Knowles (see above), male tigers and tuskers clashed at times. In his book, some of these were described.

I could confirm by personal experience that elephants do afraid of tigers. In Palamau (Betla) national park in 1993 our riding tourist elephant faced a tiger who was resting in a cave in distance 10-15 meters from us. Since I'm a bit short sighted I was not able to see the eyes of tiger in the cave darkness despite my fellow and the mahout several times told me that tiger is watching us. I asked the mahout to move elephant closer to the cave. When we approached in distance 10-15 meters from cave entrance suddenly the elephant started to tremble violently, with shake waves through all the animal's body from trunk to the tail. The animal was quite scared or at least very nervous in the presence of the big cat. This violent vibrations continued several minutes. I started to offer to mahout money to move the elephant even closer but he refused. Than I got mad to him because I didn't succeed to see the burning eyes of the tiger despite my other tourist fellow clearly saw.
But we have to take into account that Asiatic elephants in general are bit coward animals, they easily panic. There are cases when only a close roar of panther could cause whole elephant heard to flee away or start panic.
Here as pointed Rishi the important question is how tiger kill a giant herbivore (bovines excluded because they are not so gigantic). As we can see from this videos even for big prides of lions consisting of 14-20 cats is quite difficult to hunt subadult elephant and kick it down even when the lions in big numbers like grapes cover the victim's body:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxgx8Ah-hNE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4nG4JsAyKY


 For solitary cat as tiger this should be very-very-very difficult...

Nice story @Wolverine 

I think it also has to do with the captive Elephants that are used by the mahouts are not accustomed to Tigers compared to their wild cousins, they do have many encounters with Tigers obviously but it's always with a Mahout atop of them, even so, I've seen captive Elephants charge at Tigers as well but usually after the Tiger charges first maybe if they lived in their wild herds and had developed the natural hatred that comes from the natural circumstances, they'd probably be more like the one below.


Aswath Saravanan M
That's the power of elephant 

The largest land mammal showing it’s supremacy over strongest big cats.


*This image is copyright of its original author

Whos that male tiger with his cubs?
One of the dominant males of Bandipur,  Basavankatte male I believe. 


Older video of Matkasur male with a Gaur kill, I don't think I've actually seen this one before.



"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
-Oscar Wilde
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Sri Lanka Apollo Offline
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Tiger hunts deer in Pench (full hunt).




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Maya tigress kills a stag at a waterhole.




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Sri Lanka Apollo Offline
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Awesome video of tiger taking down a big chital stag in Corbett 




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Switzerland Spalea Online
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@Apollo :

Sorry to object that the #1371 and #1372 videos are the same, the former being the extended latter for one minute. And this tiger, if I don't make a mistake, kills an axis deer.
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( This post was last modified: 08-25-2018, 11:11 AM by Rage2277 )


*This image is copyright of its original author
Arrowhead with chital kill at RTR Rajsthan April 2018 Inderjit Singh
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Sri Lanka Apollo Offline
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(08-25-2018, 01:10 AM)Spalea Wrote: @Apollo :

Sorry to object that the #1371 and #1372 videos are the same, the former being the extended latter for one minute. And this tiger, if I don't make a mistake, kills an axis deer.

Thanks for bringing it up.
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Rage2277 Offline
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( This post was last modified: 08-28-2018, 01:04 AM by Rage2277 )

t8 ladli with cow kill
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India Rishi Online
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( This post was last modified: 08-30-2018, 06:54 AM by Rishi )

(08-29-2018, 12:58 PM)paul cooper Wrote: @peter, on carnivora was going on a debate about gaur and buffaloes versus tigers. Do you know anything about this specific subject? What chance a tiger has a against a buffalo face to face?, and interactions between the two?

If you learn any interesting facts, do share it with us too.

Any tiger in the wild will try its best to not end up "face to face" against full grown animals five times its weight.  
Dhamangaon male was photographed doing it once...
(05-16-2017, 10:59 PM)Rishi Wrote:
*This image is copyright of its original author

Pic. Courtesy: Jai Paranjpe
https://m.facebook.com/story.php? )

"We sighted a tiger known as Dhaman Gaon Male killing a gaur. This image was made seconds before the tiger made the kill!!!.."
...but an experienced hunter would try to get behind the animal & hamstring it.  
On being successful it might become safe enough for mothers to even give their cubs some schooling. 
©Aishwarya Sridhar, Flickr  (<Link to full story)

*This image is copyright of its original author

If it comes to that, then tigers rarely have a reason to not simply back away, instead of risking fatal injuries. Many of the (adult) gaur hunts consist of a tiger injuring the animal & tracking it down later to kill it in much weakened condition. 

Water buffalo are now restricted to mostly Assam & much less documented. But earlier they were found in good numbers in the Chotanagpur Plateau region, when back in the '50s-'60s those were India's prime hunting areas (partially responsible for those forests being empty today).

From contemporary accounts, water buffalo were the most feared animals of the forests they were found in, still are. Unlike the shy gaurs, they're aggressive & vindictive, known to chase down tigers trying to call it a day. There are videos of tigers & lions of india against domestic/feral buffalos. Imagine how their larger & more vengeful wild cousins are like.

Also theirs long, curved horns make frontal attack to the neck unsafe. A sideways jerk of the head would skewer any big-cat & disembowel it or puncture a lung. 

*This image is copyright of its original author

Both species are hunted regularly by tigers. They are making buffalo reintroduction in Chitwan difficult by killing off the inexperienced newcomers.
(@Jimmy it's probably the subcontinent's only tiger habitat with both gaurs & buffalos. Keep us updated.)

But gaurs & water buffalos are big, dangerous prey by whom a tiger or two gets killed every year too. You could find reports on various Indian newspapers if you search.  
Even Wagdoh male's facial scar was from a gaur's horn. Had it caught him a few inches further, it could have been his throat & we would have never known him.
"Everything not saved will be lost."

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(09-05-2018, 02:37 PM)parvez Wrote: Guys I had a good conversation with an onfield expert. He told me tigers regularly feed on gaurs. Sometimes they bring down gaurs in less than a minute by getting hold of their upper neck by jumping on their bodies. In forests with good densities of garu, they were known to learn to bring down gaurs in less than 5 minutes. There may be some exceptional cases from the past where less weighted tigers may have taken almost half a day and some ill fated tigers may have been killed in fights but in most of cases the tiger successfully predates on gaurs.
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India Rishi Online
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Atul Dhamankar's post on indiawilds.com.

*This image is copyright of its original author
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India parvez Offline
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( This post was last modified: 09-06-2018, 08:14 AM by Rishi )

Though rare, tigers do take down rhinos and elephants. This has been confirmed by quite a number of onfield experts who are the best judges on these topics. If they take down gaurs in less than 5 minutes in high density gaur areas, then in further prolonged fights or even smaller duration fights in which they succeed in quickly breaking the neck of the prey they seem to predate successfully on rhinos and elephants. In my honest opinion they seem to have primary target of breaking the bones of neck (when attacking top portion of neck) rather than inflicting severe physical bloody injury to their necks. They seem to have developed a new technique.
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Tiger carries it's kill in Corbett




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