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The Cave Lion (Panthera spelaea and Panthera fossilis)

United States Smilodon-Rex Offline
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(06-19-2018, 06:13 AM)Pantherinae Wrote: Some males from Okavango, seems to have some characteristics from cave lions just look at this magnificent specimens mane! 

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Prehistoric Lions may not have huge mane,  most of the Prehistoric Lions such as American Lions may looks like modern Tsavo Lions, but American Lions have more powerful muscles and skeletons than modern pantheras a lot. The Cave Lion are have the same features too, but meanwhile they may  more likely to closed to tigers which in later pleistocence. 

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New Version of Mosbach Lion's art-work by Roman.Uchytel 

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Old Version of American Lion&Smilodon fatalis 

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New Version of American Lion

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Cave Lion

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Panthera youngi
@GrizzlyClaws , @tigerluver
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United States tigerluver Offline
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( This post was last modified: 09-23-2018, 05:50 AM by tigerluver )

(12-04-2017, 12:26 AM)tigerluver Wrote: Panthera atrox in South America?

A new paper was just published stating that a fossil pantherine of South America, known as P. onca mesembrina, has been misidentified at least a few times. The true identity of this cat they assert is Panthera atrox. Their assertion is based on morphological similarities of the specimen to P. atrox rather than the jaguar. The skull they reference is the best example of their point. The paper.

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Take a look at the above photos. Which species does the skull in the top photo looks most similar too? Based on visibility of the incisive foramina and the nasal shape, the authors conclude that the skull is actually of P. atrox.

At first take, the logic looks good. However, Dr. Ross Barnett disagrees, mentioning on twitter that cats of these areas have been DNA tested and shown to be jaguar. He cited this paper

The authors in a way already had a response built into the paper to such a rebuttal, stating that the ancient jaguar and American lion would have shared the domain. So what does everyone think? Is this skull of a jaguar or an American lion?


Here is a followup on the controversial skull from South America. I measured the skull's GSL (c. 340 mm) and ZW (c. 249.5 mm) from the reconstructed figure. I then ran a principal component analysis with the skull (in green, labeled P. o. m.), P. atrox (in blue), and P. onca (in dark pink). Here is the result:


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The controversial skull falls just inside the statistical range of P. atrox while also falling well out of the range for (modern) P. onca. Such can mean two things. One, the skull groups in P. atrox, and is thus a member of P. atrox. Two, with the skull falling at the edge of the range of P. atrox, it is from a different, unknown species/group (perhaps an archaic P. onca ancestor?). In either scenario, the skull falls out of the possibility of at least a modern P. onca.
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Venezuela epaiva Offline
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( This post was last modified: 10-01-2018, 12:08 AM by epaiva )

Lions in the Carpathians
https://synapsida.blogspot.com/2018/09/l...ref=fb&m=1
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*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author
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Canada GrizzlyClaws Offline
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(10-03-2018, 03:31 AM)epaiva Wrote:
*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

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Notice the two Cave lion subspecies had been diverged much longer between themselves than the distance between the modern tiger/lion subspecies.



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United States Smilodon-Rex Offline
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(10-03-2018, 05:17 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(10-03-2018, 03:31 AM)epaiva Wrote:
*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author


Notice the two Cave lion subspecies had been diverged much longer between themselves than the distance between the modern tiger/lion subspecies.



*This image is copyright of its original author


*This image is copyright of its original author

The new version of cave lion by Roman-uchytel 

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The Beringian cave lion

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Venezuela epaiva Offline
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( This post was last modified: 10-03-2018, 06:23 AM by epaiva )

(10-03-2018, 05:17 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(10-03-2018, 03:31 AM)epaiva Wrote:
*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author


Notice the two Cave lion subspecies had been diverged much longer between themselves than the distance between the modern tiger/lion subspecies.



*This image is copyright of its original author

@GrizzlyClaws
What was the size of the Beringia Lion?
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Canada GrizzlyClaws Offline
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(10-03-2018, 06:22 AM)epaiva Wrote:
(10-03-2018, 05:17 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(10-03-2018, 03:31 AM)epaiva Wrote:
*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author


Notice the two Cave lion subspecies had been diverged much longer between themselves than the distance between the modern tiger/lion subspecies.



*This image is copyright of its original author

@GrizzlyClaws
What was the size of the Beringia Lion?


About the size of the modern African lion, and the chart above is pretty accurate.
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Panthera leo spelaea skull discovered in Francehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of...3%A8ne.jpg
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(10-08-2018, 05:00 PM)Smilodon-Rex Wrote:
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Panthera leo spelaea skull discovered in Francehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of...3%A8ne.jpg

The canine shape looks almost identical to those from China.



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United States tigerluver Offline
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A new skull from Argentina was reported this year (see attached paper). It is attributed to P. onca and measures 271.00 mm as it is. The skull's estimated age is about the same to a few thousand years younger than the controversial South American P. atrox skull. Here's a comparison:


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What differences and similarities does everyone see?

Attached Files
.pdf   PoncaLatePleistocene.pdf (Size: 1.88 MB / Downloads: 8)
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