There is a world somewhere between reality and fiction. Although ignored by many, it is very real and so are those living in it. This forum is about the natural world. Here, wild animals will be heard and respected. The forum offers a glimpse into an unknown world as well as a room with a view on the present and the future. Anyone able to speak on behalf of those living in the emerald forest and the deep blue sea is invited to join.
I have interesting news! I think I've finally come to the moment where we can clear up all confusion surrounding the Persian record leopard.
I finally contacted Iman Memarian, whom I highly thank for being available to answer me and here I have his voice messages,I recorded the screen and shared all of it on YouTube on my private channel
Before continuing the read of this post, watch the video completely :
As far as we can see, the fact that that leopard weighed 115 kg is the truth! But was that on an empty stomach? Well no.
Iman told me in the last message as you can see that the leopard had initially been captured on a carcass and was full when initially weighed, that's why this big male weighed almost 120 kg (115 kg).
Finally we know the cause of this very high weight, I guess that no-one who ever contacted Iman was able to get this particular but important detail.
The real weight?
However he told me that this leopard the day of the euthanasia, after days in very bad conditions and not eating (He was shot in his spine, couldn't walk, refused to eat after the capture, was overstressed and even started eating its own limbs! ), weighed about 98 kg, but before he even mentioned 105 kg in the voice message so I don't know if when it was 105 kg it was still with stomach content ... Maybe yes maybe not.
^^What do you guys think about this part mentioning 105 kg? Let me know.
At the end of the day, to be safe, I would say that 95-98 kg would be a fair estimate of the weight of this huge male, being the largest verified Persian leopard in history. @ "Guategojira" it would be interesting now if you updated your sample and finally added this 95- 98 kg male (mean: 96.5 kg) in the sample to see how the averages fairs up now.
The official veterinary record stated his weight as 95 kg, which is the vet record shown to Dr. Farhadina
Probably the change will be minimal, but remember that even just 1 or 1.5 kg more could change something important, for a simple reason I'll list in the future.
*This image is copyright of its original author
To conclude, here is a photo of the poor soul during euthanasia, the day he was said to have weighed 95 - 98 kg.
Look at the eyes of this poor little creature, just imagine surviving several rifle shots to fight anyway even when completely paralyzed, entering a state of stress so high that you start eating your own limbs.
Many people speak of peace in the world and of coexisting all while still bringing respect towards others but never in life will I ever accept to endure the existence of people who cause this pain and stress to animals (I mean who shot the leopard in this case).
So whatever happens in the future, I officially declare the state of "war" and hostility between me and all the kinds of people that fall in these categories : poachers, trophy hunters or anyone who practices these barbarisms illegally.
As long as you're able, clean the world from the vermin.
We know, this is the same information. Unfortunately there's no update with measurements, which we've all been waiting for. Regardless you know where I stand on this claim, I don't see it and the cat doesn't look particularly large regardless. My opinion is a faulty scale or error in the weighing process.
Faulty scale? Is this because there were several weights given or because you think the leopard looks smaller? 1. We have an explanation for the many different weights given and that is potential stomach content as well as poor condition later on. 2. You are trying to estimate the weight of an animal whose full body is never in view in any picture and even then it looked bulky to me
Take your pick.
No I’m just confused as to why you would say that even after all the voice messages we’ve been sent
Pckts seems to be a bit in disbelief since a major argument of his was that it would be impossible for a Leopard to reach and surpass the 100 kg mark.
I do agree in the sense that this Leopard may be an anomaly. However, I am still hopeful for other possible 100+ kg Leopards waiting to be discovered in the near future.
Anyway, here is a Leopard from Chitral Gol National Park, Pakistan. The place is close to the Afghanistan border, so this could be the eastern extent for the Persian Leopard.
Pckts seems to be a bit in disbelief since a major argument of his was that it would be impossible for a Leopard to reach and surpass the 100 kg mark.
I do agree in the sense that this Leopard may be an anomaly. However, I am still hopeful for other possible 100+ kg Leopards waiting to be discovered in the near future.
Anyway, here is a Leopard from Chitral Gol National Park, Pakistan. The place is close to the Afghanistan border, so this could be the eastern extent for the Persian Leopard.
This claim of his was only based on there being no good records of 100kg leopards and not because this would be in any way impossible or far fetched as there have been several leopards recorded in scientific litreature that have come close to this weight. Pckts knows leopards can reach the 100kg mark obviously
I have interesting news! I think I've finally come to the moment where we can clear up all confusion surrounding the Persian record leopard.
I finally contacted Iman Memarian, whom I highly thank for being available to answer me and here I have his voice messages,I recorded the screen and shared all of it on YouTube on my private channel
Before continuing the read of this post, watch the video completely :
As far as we can see, the fact that that leopard weighed 115 kg is the truth! But was that on an empty stomach? Well no.
Iman told me in the last message as you can see that the leopard had initially been captured on a carcass and was full when initially weighed, that's why this big male weighed almost 120 kg (115 kg).
Finally we know the cause of this very high weight, I guess that no-one who ever contacted Iman was able to get this particular but important detail.
The real weight?
However he told me that this leopard the day of the euthanasia, after days in very bad conditions and not eating (He was shot in his spine, couldn't walk, refused to eat after the capture, was overstressed and even started eating its own limbs! ), weighed about 98 kg, but before he even mentioned 105 kg in the voice message so I don't know if when it was 105 kg it was still with stomach content ... Maybe yes maybe not.
^^What do you guys think about this part mentioning 105 kg? Let me know.
At the end of the day, to be safe, I would say that 95-98 kg would be a fair estimate of the weight of this huge male, being the largest verified Persian leopard in history. @ "Guategojira" it would be interesting now if you updated your sample and finally added this 95- 98 kg male (mean: 96.5 kg) in the sample to see how the averages fairs up now.
The official veterinary record stated his weight as 95 kg, which is the vet record shown to Dr. Farhadina
Probably the change will be minimal, but remember that even just 1 or 1.5 kg more could change something important, for a simple reason I'll list in the future.
*This image is copyright of its original author
To conclude, here is a photo of the poor soul during euthanasia, the day he was said to have weighed 95 - 98 kg.
Look at the eyes of this poor little creature, just imagine surviving several rifle shots to fight anyway even when completely paralyzed, entering a state of stress so high that you start eating your own limbs.
Many people speak of peace in the world and of coexisting all while still bringing respect towards others but never in life will I ever accept to endure the existence of people who cause this pain and stress to animals (I mean who shot the leopard in this case).
So whatever happens in the future, I officially declare the state of "war" and hostility between me and all the kinds of people that fall in these categories : poachers, trophy hunters or anyone who practices these barbarisms illegally.
As long as you're able, clean the world from the vermin.
Do you have the head-body length and shoulder height measurements? And also chest girth if possible? With those measurements at hand, it would be easier to determine if the 105kg weight is really possible or not.
Pckts seems to be a bit in disbelief since a major argument of his was that it would be impossible for a Leopard to reach and surpass the 100 kg mark.
I do agree in the sense that this Leopard may be an anomaly. However, I am still hopeful for other possible 100+ kg Leopards waiting to be discovered in the near future.
Anyway, here is a Leopard from Chitral Gol National Park, Pakistan. The place is close to the Afghanistan border, so this could be the eastern extent for the Persian Leopard.
Pckts seems to be a bit in disbelief since a major argument of his was that it would be impossible for a Leopard to reach and surpass the 100 kg mark.
I do agree in the sense that this Leopard may be an anomaly. However, I am still hopeful for other possible 100+ kg Leopards waiting to be discovered in the near future.
Anyway, here is a Leopard from Chitral Gol National Park, Pakistan. The place is close to the Afghanistan border, so this could be the eastern extent for the Persian Leopard.
Pckts seems to be a bit in disbelief since a major argument of his was that it would be impossible for a Leopard to reach and surpass the 100 kg mark.
I do agree in the sense that this Leopard may be an anomaly. However, I am still hopeful for other possible 100+ kg Leopards waiting to be discovered in the near future.
Anyway, here is a Leopard from Chitral Gol National Park, Pakistan. The place is close to the Afghanistan border, so this could be the eastern extent for the Persian Leopard.
04-29-2022, 06:38 PM( This post was last modified: 04-29-2022, 06:44 PM by AndresVida )
@Twico5 Guys stop with this thing if thw leopard weighed 95-98 kg or not, I may understand why @Pckts is doubtful after all of these different weights so just agree to disagree and stop this continuous debate about the animal.
To me the 95 - 98 kg weight is reliable as it was confirmed by veterinaries and even if people don't see the leopard as "enough large" to be that heavy, well, I'll tell you that this mexican jaguar below doesn't look large either and that to me when I first saw the image without the weight I thought it was 60 - 70 kg at best.
But no! It weighed just 10 kgs below 100 kg!
*This image is copyright of its original author
Compare again to the leopard, they are comparable
*This image is copyright of its original author
*This image is copyright of its original author
Again, stop this debate you all. If Pckts doesn't biy the weight it's total understandable, everyone has his own opinions right? And also
(04-28-2022, 11:05 PM)Styx38 Wrote: If you changed your opinions and believe that other 100+ kg Leopards are still out there, then I will recant my statement.
Pckts is just doubting on THIS leopard not leopards as a whole as I recall seeing his posts saying he does believe in 100+ kg leopards which are imo 100% real.
Why does it matter though? That's like me being pissed and wanting to convince everyone that a bengal tiger weighed 295kg and not 305kg.
At the end of the day it's too close to care, since between 95 kg and 100 kg there's a difference of JUST 5 kg, and about 3.5 kg for the 96.5 kg Namibian male, and just 2 kg if we say this persian was 95-98 kg.
But who cares? It's too close to see it as an important debate, if leopards have gotten as heavy as 95- 96.5kg their limit is definitely around the 100kg mark or slightly more, just like cougars.
(04-29-2022, 06:38 PM)LoveAnimals Wrote: @Twico5 Guys stop with this thing if thw leopard weighed 95-98 kg or not, I may understand why @Pckts is doubtful after all of these different weights so just agree to disagree and stop this continuous debate about the animal.
To me the 95 - 98 kg weight is reliable as it was confirmed by veterinaries and even if people don't see the leopard as "enough large" to be that heavy, well, I'll tell you that this mexican jaguar below doesn't look large either and that to me when I first saw the image without the weight I thought it was 60 - 70 kg at best.
But no! It weighed just 10 kgs below 100 kg!
*This image is copyright of its original author
Compare again to the leopard, they are comparable
*This image is copyright of its original author
*This image is copyright of its original author
Again, stop this debate you all. If Pckts doesn't biy the weight it's total understandable, everyone has his own opinions right? And also
(04-28-2022, 11:05 PM)Styx38 Wrote: If you changed your opinions and believe that other 100+ kg Leopards are still out there, then I will recant my statement.
Pckts is just doubting on THIS leopard not leopards as a whole as I recall seeing his posts saying he does believe in 100+ kg leopards which are imo 100% real.
Why does it matter though? That's like me being pissed and wanting to convince everyone that a bengal tiger weighed 295kg and not 305kg.
At the end of the day it's too close to care, since between 95 kg and 100 kg there's a difference of JUST 5 kg, and about 3.5 kg for the 96.5 kg Namibian male, and just 2 kg if we say this persian was 95-98 kg.
But who cares? It's too close to see it as an important debate, if leopards have gotten as heavy as 95- 96.5kg their limit is definitely around the 100kg mark or slightly more, just like cougars.
Do you have any body measurements of this leopard? Head-body length? Chest girth or anything?
(04-29-2022, 06:48 PM)LonePredator Wrote: Do you have any body measurements of this leopard? Head-body length? Chest girth or anything?
If I don't remember wrong there was a TBL measurement of like 230 cm.
There was if I'm not mistaken a 215 cm TBL leopard that was close to 80 kg, so if the leopard was 230 cm for real I don't see why it can't be almost 100 kg (95-98 kg) as it's longer than the 215 cm male
04-29-2022, 08:58 PM( This post was last modified: 04-29-2022, 11:39 PM by LonePredator )
(04-29-2022, 08:43 PM)LoveAnimals Wrote:
(04-29-2022, 06:48 PM)LonePredator Wrote: Do you have any body measurements of this leopard? Head-body length? Chest girth or anything?
If I don't remember wrong there was a TBL measurement of like 230 cm.
There was if I'm not mistaken a 215 cm TBL leopard that was close to 80 kg, so if the leopard was 230 cm for real I don't see why it can't be almost 100 kg (95-98 kg) as it's longer than the 215 cm male
By TBL you mean total body length, right? Well on average, a Persian Leopard’s head-body length is about 67% of it’s total length and if this Leopard’s head-body length was also 67% of the total length (if it had a normal sized tail) then this Leopard should only be about 75kg-80kg unless it is unusually bulky but it doesn’t really look much more bulkier than a normal Leopard.
BUT, even if the leopard had an extremely small tail and it’s head-body length was 73% of it’s total length, even then the weight of the Leopard should only be about 98kg.
If the tail of the Leopard was small (at most 28% of total body length) and if it had some stomach content or higher than average chest girth, only then is the weight of 105kg possible and I always try to be optimistic and imagine the best case scenario but such cases require a condition to be met just like when I saw the picture of the ‘389kg’ Tiger.
Therefore, I would say that 105kg is extremely unlikely. I would say around 85kg unless it’s tail was quite shorter than average which would only make it 98. So my guess is 85kg.
(04-29-2022, 06:48 PM)LonePredator Wrote: Do you have any body measurements of this leopard? Head-body length? Chest girth or anything?
If I don't remember wrong there was a TBL measurement of like 230 cm.
There was if I'm not mistaken a 215 cm TBL leopard that was close to 80 kg, so if the leopard was 230 cm for real I don't see why it can't be almost 100 kg (95-98 kg) as it's longer than the 215 cm male
DO you know where you got this measurement?
He hasn't presented anything that we know about.
Also, you'd want to find out if it's over the curves.
(04-29-2022, 09:43 PM)Pckts Wrote: DO you know where you got this measurement?
He hasn't presented anything that we know about.
Also, you'd want to find out if it's over the curves.
I got this from the conversation in the early pages of this exact thread, I guess it was Guate that posted the information about this TBL
Persian Leopard (Panthera pardus saxicolor)
