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Persian Leopard (Panthera pardus saxicolor)

United States Pckts Offline
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#46
( This post was last modified: 07-01-2015, 12:21 AM by Pckts )

(06-30-2015, 08:45 AM)'Richardrli' Wrote: Yes I agree that it doesn't "look" that big, but what is the rational reason for not accepting it? I mean it's a figure given directly by a vet, a first hand source published in a scientific document. The Iranian organization responsible for the conservation of leopards in their country has measured and weighed leopards before and as far as I know there haven't been any problems with their measurements. Also, many animals have been weighed that "looked" smaller than their actual weight, and conversely many have "looked" bigger than their actual weight. For this individual, it might just be the former case.

 


The vet has not given the weight as of yet. It isn't used in the records so its obviously a little suspicious. Vets usually use Avery scales and they are digital and are a prone to mis-weighing individuals as well, but being realistic, its missing a paw (weight) its no longer than many other leopards, broken spine, bullets lodged in it, its no more robust than many others, yet its the heaviest in history by a wide margin?
Its not very reasonable IMO.
 
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Guatemala GuateGojira Offline
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#47
( This post was last modified: 07-03-2015, 09:18 AM by GuateGojira )

(06-30-2015, 05:37 PM)'Majingilane' Wrote: And what about the weight, Guate? Was it correct?
 
 

I did not ask about the weight, because for me the answer is simple. From my point of view, the weight is reliable but it is inaccurate. Why?, well, check the belly.

In the moment of the capture, we can see that this is a very long male and looks massive and fat, maybe too fat, which suggest that it was gorged. Taking in count that any large cat can eat up to 1/5 of its body, the weight "empty" of this cat was probably c.90 kg, still a good record. Now, in the last pictures the leopard has lived over ten days with its back broken and probably had not eat in those days, so what we are seeing is a starving animal in a bad shape.

Other thing that disturb me are the canines. In the moment of the capture it had perfectly good canines, but at the moment with the vet, the canines are broken. What happened to him after its capture? Have you saw that? The animals survived with only three extremities but the shoot in its back and the time in captivity seems to have killed it.

So, I think that the weight of 115 kg is correct but includes stomach content, based in the picture. This same animal was emaciated at the moment when it was with the vet, and I suspect that this animal was weighed in the first capture and not in the last moment.

One case that I remember is the male tiger T-01 from Nagarahole, which weighed c.240 kg gorged, but it was in bad shape and died in less than a month. This tiger could die in less time but as the scientist that captured him treated its injures, the tiger lived slightly more but probably was unable to hunt and died from hungry.
 
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tigerluver Offline
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#48

Having over a quarter of one's body weight of food at once is very unlikely (the assumption here to round down to 90 kg), I feel the study that concluded this missed many factors and subsequently a cats ability to eat has been mythologized to unreal amounts. At the same time, the leopard is missing a paw I think and was in bad shape, so it could have gorged after a long period of starvation. Even then, 25 kg of food is likely an overestimate. 

Take the Etosha lion for example. Gorged, it still was only estimated to have 8.3% of food content in its belly by a vet. 100-105 kg empty would be a better estimate if we assume gorging in my opinion. 

Keep in mind, leopard and jaguars seem to be proportionately heavier than tigers and lions (ignoring the island tigers). This is proven by the negative allometry found by Christiansen in his equations. 

Finally, the image in which the leopard's belly looks distented, the ground looks unleveled, which may falsely create the effect, but I'm not sitting on this thought.
 
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Guatemala GuateGojira Offline
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#49
( This post was last modified: 07-04-2015, 10:01 AM by GuateGojira )

Good point Tigerluver, I think that your observation is accurate. Contrary to popular belief (sadly, also popularized by scientific books), the large cats don't gorge themselves in every moment, especially in the areas with high prey density. Maybe, if the "gorged" hypothesis is correct, the "empty" weight could be closer to c.100 kg, which still will be a great record.

By the way, I have contacted Dr Farhadinia and he redirect me to the veterinary that weighed and measured this leopard. Let's see what data could I get with him. Dr Farhadinia told me that he will use my comparison image in the facebook page of the project. I will be very happy if he do this. [img]images/smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]
 
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United States Pckts Offline
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#50

(07-04-2015, 10:00 AM)'GuateGojira' Wrote: Good point Tigerluver, I think that your observation is accurate. Contrary to popular belief (sadly, also popularized by scientific books), the large cats don't gorge themselves in every moment, especially in the areas with high prey density. Maybe, if the "gorged" hypothesis is correct, the "empty" weight could be closer to c.100 kg, which still will be a great record.

By the way, I have contacted Dr Farhadinia and he redirect me to the veterinary that weighed and measured this leopard. Let's see what data could I get with him. Dr Farhadinia told me that he will use my comparison image in the facebook page of the project. I will be very happy if he do this. [img]images/smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]
 

 



The vet is the only one who can settle this, could you ask what type of scale was used as well?
Thanks Guate
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Guatemala GuateGojira Offline
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#51

Did you remember the record of 115 kg for the Persian leopard? Well, I ask to Dr Farhadinia some time ago and he say that he believe in the weight, that is accurate but that most be used as "exceptional". Latter, he redirect me with the veterinarian, but at this date, he has not answered my two emails.

I guess that, if Dr Farhadinia believes that is reliable, we can use it, but with caution as it is not normal and probably includes stomach content.

Sorry, that is the best that I can get for the moment. IF the veterinarian answer me, I will let you know.
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Norway Jubatus Offline
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#52

Persian leopard feeding on its red deer kill! 

*This image is copyright of its original author


*This image is copyright of its original author
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Norway Jubatus Offline
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#53


*This image is copyright of its original author

An unfortunate event has taken place in Azerbaijan, where and endangered Persian Leopard has been killed by poachers...

A Leopard skinn can be sold for as much as 15.000$
In this region... 

There are only about 25 Persian Leopards left on the boarder between Azerbaijan and Iran, and if leopards keep getting poached like this There won't be any left in Azerbaijan soon!
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Norway Jubatus Offline
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#54

A persian leopard on its cow kill! Incredible sight indeed. (the cow is on the right) 

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author


*This image is copyright of its original author
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Norway Jubatus Offline
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#55

Awsome footage from southeastern Iran where footage was caught of a leopard eating a wild sheep! These sheep get placed infront of cameratraps, so that researchers can get a better idea of the Leopards living in the area. And this is a fantastic way to lure them in. 

watch the video of the event here:

http://www.iew.ir/1394/08/30/42732
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United Kingdom Sully Offline
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#56

Wow, looking at these leopards I question my common assumtion that Sri Lankan leopards are the biggest. But then again as richardrli said looks mean less than facts.
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United States Pckts Offline
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#57

Even though I am skeptical of it, it was confirmed by the vet.
The largest verified leopard weight was the 115kg mark set by a persian leopard missing one paw.
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Canada Dr Panthera Offline
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#58

The popular notion that Sri Lankan leopards are the largest leopards is outdated data , Eisenberg reported ( after Pocock ) that the largest male was 77 kg and where they do not occur with neither lions nor tigers making them the apex predator on the island.
Leopards that exceed 80 kg are quite common in Iran and are also reported from India, Kenya, Tanzania, Namibia, South Africa, and other areas in Africa.
Farhidinia and other Iranian biologists compared morphometric and craniometric measurements from different leopard populations and it is safe to say  that the largest leopards are Saxicolor (Persian leopards), large African leopards rival their Persian relatives but leopards from Somalia and the Cape areas are very small so the overall overage is smaller.
H.S.Singh reports a leopard from Gir that weighed 115 kg!! It was starved for two days and weighed again and was about 100 kg.
There is a gap in knowledge about leopards from the Congo basin, the absence of lions there make the leopards the only possible predator of the young of forest elephants, forest buffalo, okapi, and gorillas , I am sure we can find some large leopards from such areas.
I am amazed by female leopards they rarely exceed 100 LBS. (45 kg) and easily kill prey twice their size.
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United Kingdom Sully Offline
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#59
( This post was last modified: 12-24-2015, 01:31 AM by Sully )

@DrPanthera Thanks for the info, I too would be interested in seeing some more in depth data on Congo leopards, if they prey on young of forest elephants, forest buffalo, okapi, chimpanzees, and gorillas then they should have a substancial weight.

I actually remember an article from someone on yuku explaining predation on gorillas from leopards that I posted on my google+, a very in depth one at that.

Here it is, the copy-paste version on my google+. I'm not sure who originally posted it on yuku, I'll try and find out:

https://plus.google.com/u/0/103089044115...L88yVyNP1Q

Edit: From a poster named gatogordo, and the article from fay et al
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India parvez Offline
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#60

           
Persian leapords are said to be the largest of all the leapords. They are amazingly impressive, without a second thought. I found many impressive specimens while searching about them. Here are a few.
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