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(02-12-2025, 11:40 PM)criollo2mil Wrote: The Mangheni Pride has been sighted down in Sabi Sabi. In speaking w guides and guests over the past week, seems that at least two members are unaccounted for.
The sabi sand guides said 7 members were at their sighting and in the last week, there had been guests having as low as six.
There is a suspicion that the Mangheni sub adult seen flung by buffalo in the hunting sighting could have succumbed to injuries since the Pride numbers have not accounted for all nine since.
I’m hoping there’s a different reason and it’s just a temporary separation.
Of note, there’s still at least one male accounted for, the report said it was 3 adults and 4 Sub adults and one at least was male.
Sad news, Sabi Sabi is the territory of Msuthu and Styx prides right?
The missing subadults could be casualties caused by fights with those prides, maybe?
02-14-2025, 10:53 AM( This post was last modified: 02-14-2025, 10:56 AM by Duco Ndona )
More likely the alteration happened up north. The Mangheni tend to move south if they no longer feel safe there.
The main suspects, if there was indeed a conflict is the Ximhungwe pride or one of the several coalitions in the regio. Like the Monwana, Kambulas or Nkuhuma Talimati duo.
The cub that got injured earlier seems to be fine though
(02-14-2025, 10:53 AM)Duco Ndona Wrote: More likely the alteration happened up north. The Mangheni tend to move south if they no longer feel safe there.
The main suspects, if there was indeed a conflict is the Ximhungwe pride or one of the several coalitions in the regio. Like the Monwana, Kambulas or Nkuhuma Talimati duo.
The cub that got injured earlier seems to be fine though
That is just a bad place to go to. There is already a lot of lions in the south.
(02-12-2025, 11:40 PM)criollo2mil Wrote: The Mangheni Pride has been sighted down in Sabi Sabi. In speaking w guides and guests over the past week, seems that at least two members are unaccounted for.
The sabi sand guides said 7 members were at their sighting and in the last week, there had been guests having as low as six.
There is a suspicion that the Mangheni sub adult seen flung by buffalo in the hunting sighting could have succumbed to injuries since the Pride numbers have not accounted for all nine since.
I’m hoping there’s a different reason and it’s just a temporary separation.
Of note, there’s still at least one male accounted for, the report said it was 3 adults and 4 Sub adults and one at least was male.
Sad news, Sabi Sabi is the territory of Msuthu and Styx prides right?
The missing subadults could be casualties caused by fights with those prides, maybe?
Well there had been speculation by the guide that 2 subs are missing when they are still in West and probably chased by Nkuhuma & Talamati Duo and Sabi Sabi only sighted 7/9 members in South, also only 3/4 Monwana Boys pop out of Djuma and headed more north to Buffelshoek/Manyeleti seems like Nkuhuma & Talamati Duo had chased out the Monwana Boys out of West per Singinta Report.
02-15-2025, 09:07 PM( This post was last modified: 02-15-2025, 09:09 PM by Cath2020 )
We all have to be realistic. A major thinning of subs, even over 2-3 years of age, occurs in this highly competitive area. Look at what happened to the 4 grown nomads of Mohawk/Blondie when they left the pride! Only 2/4 made it to be pride males. We will get used to seeing nomads and subs shrink down in numbers as they get older. Now, I notice that even the sub females in the Styx and Sand River Prides have disappeared....some of them. Now only 3 in the Styx and 3 in the SR Pride...when there were at least 5-6 last year at some point. And only 2 S Avoca Male sons! And Khanya's handsome brother disappeared suddenly. There were at least 5 that actually made it to 1.5 to 2 years of age (S. Avoca sons). I guess at the ages of 3-4 is their most vulnerable. The males become targets for the established coalitions they encounter. Khanya and the NK Male will challenge for territory and females in the future if they don't get injured or taken out. This involves eliminating as much competition as they can. Since they are of the age where the NK Male is in his prime, and Khanya nearly so, they have essentially passed all the hazards of young males growing up to establish themselves....(barring bad luck or a freak accident) It's just that there is A LOT of competition where they insist on roaming around in SS.
02-16-2025, 03:47 AM( This post was last modified: 02-16-2025, 03:48 AM by FACR2212 )
(02-15-2025, 09:07 PM)Cath2020 Wrote: Khanya and the NK Male will challenge for territory and females in the future if they don't get injured or taken out. This involves eliminating as much competition as they can. Since they are of the age where the NK Male is in his prime, and Khanya nearly so, they have essentially passed all the hazards of young males growing up to establish themselves....(barring bad luck or a freak accident) It's just that there is A LOT of competition where they insist on roaming around in SS.
Well, it's very likely that Manghenis were kicked out by one of the nomadic coalitions, but do you really think that NK male is going to challenge any of the territorial coalitions in SS? I see it more likely that an accident happens, some coalition loses a member, before NK male challenges for territory and females. Maybe Khanya could give him the boost he never had, but I see it as unlikely. Let's see. Regarding Mangheni subadults, they are going to have a difficult time before they reach adulthood, certainly.
The Mangheni currently have no pridemales so there is barely any coalition to challenge. The Kambulas are in shambles and the Monwanas are too young.
The PCmales have nearly completely abandoned the area, Ridgenose young male is not even nomadic yet and Tumbella is lucky to be alive.
Its not that unreasonable to believe the Nkuhuma Talamati duo (Nkuhumati?) may have tried to make a move for the Mangheni, resulting in a clash that displaced and killed some of its members or Monwanas. Its not the first time Nkuhuma tried anything with that pride.
(02-16-2025, 04:53 AM)Duco Ndona Wrote: The Mangheni currently have no pridemales so there is barely any coalition to challenge. The Kambulas are in shambles and the Monwanas are too young.
The PCmales have nearly completely abandoned the area, Ridgenose young male is not even nomadic yet and Tumbella is lucky to be alive.
Its not that unreasonable to believe the Nkuhuma Talamati duo (Nkuhumati?) may have tried to make a move for the Mangheni, resulting in a clash that displaced and killed some of its members or Monwanas. Its not the first time Nkuhuma tried anything with that pride.
I thought Ridgenose son after getting beaten he left? He is still in the west? What about the Kruger male lion?
This pride is just so unlucky. I actually agree with the comments about NK and Khanya most likely chasing the pride which led them into Sabi Sabi, purely down to the fact they haven't been following their normal route lately, which is them going east or south from western Sabi Sands heading to Sabi Sabi themselves or thru Londolozi and into MalaMala, sometimes even stopping in the north too. I don't think they would have sent the Monwanas that far out, I think that was more their own doing. I remember saying a while ago how I thought these boys had almost fooled themselves into believing all of the west was completely under PCM ruling, it was just after both NK and Khanya were roaring and scent marking in the middle of the west, despite Savanna at that point being pretty open for the taking and with them sticking in the west for the moment, maybe they've finally realised.
Ofcourse the most southern parts are no longer as free for the taking with Othawas now having cubs, meaning PCMs will definitely still have a presence. It's completely dependant on NK and Khanya, but I can see a world where they can claim this abandoned pride and territory, as long as they act real stubborn about it. No matter how many times both PCMs openly challenge them, both boys try to stand their ground as much as possible and keep returning back even if chased off. Eventually PCMs should give in, but hoping for these things with anything surrounding NK himself, is wishful thinking to say the least.
03-01-2025, 05:44 AM( This post was last modified: 03-01-2025, 05:50 AM by FACR2212 )
(02-28-2025, 05:57 PM)KM600 Wrote: This pride is just so unlucky. I actually agree with the comments about NK and Khanya most likely chasing the pride which led them into Sabi Sabi, purely down to the fact they haven't been following their normal route lately, which is them going east or south from western Sabi Sands heading to Sabi Sabi themselves or thru Londolozi and into MalaMala, sometimes even stopping in the north too. I don't think they would have sent the Monwanas that far out, I think that was more their own doing. I remember saying a while ago how I thought these boys had almost fooled themselves into believing all of the west was completely under PCM ruling, it was just after both NK and Khanya were roaring and scent marking in the middle of the west, despite Savanna at that point being pretty open for the taking and with them sticking in the west for the moment, maybe they've finally realised.
To be fair, Othawas are raising 4/10 young despite the death of the last Mangheni matriarch ("10th" cub mother).
I read once that only 20-30% of cubs reach adulthood, so they are above the mean.
(02-28-2025, 05:57 PM)KM600 Wrote: This pride is just so unlucky. I actually agree with the comments about NK and Khanya most likely chasing the pride which led them into Sabi Sabi, purely down to the fact they haven't been following their normal route lately, which is them going east or south from western Sabi Sands heading to Sabi Sabi themselves or thru Londolozi and into MalaMala, sometimes even stopping in the north too. I don't think they would have sent the Monwanas that far out, I think that was more their own doing. I remember saying a while ago how I thought these boys had almost fooled themselves into believing all of the west was completely under PCM ruling, it was just after both NK and Khanya were roaring and scent marking in the middle of the west, despite Savanna at that point being pretty open for the taking and with them sticking in the west for the moment, maybe they've finally realised.
To be fair, Othawas are raising 4/10 young despite the death of the last Mangheni matriarch ("10th" cub mother).
I read once that only 20-30% of cubs reach adulthood, so they are above the mean.
Londolozi stated that lion cubs have a formality rate just under 50% within the first year and 80% overall, meaning the odds improve quite a bit as they age, yet the 6 youngsters died even after passing one. Obviously PCMs are completely out the picture too so it’s looking very bleak for this pride, when at one point it was looking great for them. Even if the following 4 youngsters were to survive, the solo boy went from having 4 brothers and possibly being a future powerhouse to now having an uncertain future even if he makes it to adulthood.
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(03-01-2025, 03:29 PM)Duco Ndona Wrote: That does not mean that usually 50 or 30% of each litter dies. But rather that one time all the cubs die while another times most of them make it.
It doesnt have to be.
It very rarely happens that in lets say 10 cubs generation, all die, or all make it.
Usually its something in between, which depens on the stability of the pride.
