| Poll: In your opinion, how much maximum weight can a human lift during an adrenaline rush? This poll is closed. |
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| 800 pounds. | 1 | 25.00% | |
| 1000 pounds. | 0 | 0% | |
| 1200 pounds. | 1 | 25.00% | |
| 1700 pounds. | 1 | 25.00% | |
| One whopping ton (2000 pounds.) | 1 | 25.00% | |
| Total | 4 vote(s) | 100% | |
| * You voted for this item. | [Show Results] |
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Human Strength
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@Pckts,
Wow, so I have been forgetting some of my UFC fights up to this point? Karelin, given some MMA training, will hold his ground and win against Lesnar, that is still my opinion. Lesnar can never keep calm in any fight; whether real or caged, and he certainly can't throw his opponents like Karelin could in a wrestling bout. I agree, one punch can finish any of them off, but you have to realize that most of these opponents are skilled at parrying or deflecting that one punch. I still vote for Hulk, Andre, and Henry to beat Brock in a death match. That is what I originally said and I will stick with that. 
A skilled stand up fighter can block or slip punches but that isn't always the case. These are 4oz gloves and that's why you see k1 champs like overeem get caught by Bigfoot or brown, why fedor got caught by hendo, cro cop gets ko'd by frank Mir, etc.
People get tired, their guard drops, they make a mistake and pay.. They are fighting against professional fighters who practice every day to beat another person. Let's not forget the extra skills these fighters must prepare for like kicks, takedowns, submissions and throws which all can keep a fighter off guard and leads to them getting caught. And no, hulk hogan, Andre the giant, big show, undertaker etc will all get annihilated in a fight. You must understand, wwe is fake! The bumps and bruises are real but none of them practice how to actually fight. None of them possess the skills obtained through practicing something throughout your entire life. If that doesn't change your mind, fine because there is nothing else I can show you. You have seen butterbean ko multiple wwe wrestlers, Brock and kurt angle specifically talking about it and lastly, the proven credentials of these men compared to the acting of wrestlers. Lastly, just look at cm punk. He signed with the ufc, wanted to train for 2 years before he fought, a no name btw and still got injured and has yet to fight. Do you think he would just walk into the octagon and fight a good mma fighter? Heck no, that's why we have had to wait 2 + years for him to even make a debut.
Lets just leave the discussion of Brock vs all the guys I mentioned. In a fight to the death without any sort of rules or weapons, I will still root for the guys I mentioned, while you still root for Brock.
From now, let's just discuss about "Human Strength."
A trained and fit 200-pound + human will not take on ursines, felines, wild canids, cervids, bovines,
marsupials, other primates, therapsids, and a small amount of other animals over 35 to 40-kilograms in a face-to-face fight to the death. But, at the same time, that man can take on most domestic dog breeds (excpet greyhounds, kangals, or humongous mastiffs) and perhaps a declawed domestic cat. However, even a drunk Brock Lesnar or Aleksandr Karelin can easily incapacitate and kill a man of equal weight, even when the man is trained. These two have an unnatural level of athleticism compared to most trained men at their weight. Also, as Brotherbear stated earlier, we can imagine the strength of a powerlifter or the athleticism of a MMA fighter, but against some wild animals of lesser/greater size, we are screwed, literally.
In the year of 1983 when my dad was 18, military service was mandatory in Soviet-dominated Bulgaria. On one of the occasions on which he would go out and grab railroad tracks in order to upgrade the official Bulgarian National Railway (the country needed it for further military equipment deployment), he and his military friend struggled with the an end track of one of the railway pathways.
For those who don't know what an end track is, it is basically a larger section of railroad track designated to either switch a train's direction or help stop the train's course over a longer distance. Now keep in mind, these particular tracks individually weighed in at 250-380 kilograms (depending on the size and shape of the particular train) and were usually between 2 to 4 meters in length. The one my dad and his friend carried was approximately 260 kilograms and 2.5 meters in length (573 pounds and 8'3" in length in our terms). Suddenly, a man slowly walked from the neighboring woods (railways in the Soviet countries were, and still are, extremely isolated within landscape environments). According to what my dad stated, the man was two inches taller than him (dad was 6'0" at the time), had shaggy and brown hair, looked to be quite fit and well-proportioned for a human, and came at him with a dazed sort-of look. The man asked my dad and friend (in a weird, non-local sounding voice, but still in minor Bulgarian) if they needed any help, and my dad's friend responded yes. Both picked up the end track on either ends up to hip level (with some minor grunting: they were strong guys), and my dad remembers the strange man slowly picking up the whole, 260-kilogram track like it was a lightweight toy (no grunting/struggle sound was emitted during this) from them up to shoulder level, with only one arm. The man then smiled at my dad (both dad and his friend stared at the man in awe-struck fear) and proceeded to walk towards the track-marks (places designated for the track to be placed) and slowly let it down upon the track-marks. The man slowly walked back to the duo, and the latter proceeded to introduce themselves to the former. The man talked in an almost non-human fashion: speech was slurred, words were commonly mispronounced, and mouth movements were wildly exaggerated for his words (as if he was yelling quietly while speaking normally). My dad made the mistake of asking if the man really was that strong for his build: the man simply allowed my dad to squeeze his upper arm muscles. To this day, my dad never squeezed anything harder than those man's muscles: simply put, only the toughest stone is comparable in hardness. The man then stated that no one in particular knew him, with the exception of my dad, my dad's military pal, and his "wild relatives". The day then went on as usual. The day after, both my dad and his friend went to the general and asked him about the strange man. Apparently, the general knew about the strange man because he saw him on some of his duties and area sweeps. He recounted to my dad and his friend about how he once saw the man "conversing" with a medium-sized brown bear while licking the bear's snout (general estimated it 220-280 kg), and making these strange snorting and low-grumbling sounds towards the bear and vice versa. This particular event was in one of the general's evening area sweeps in the surrounding vast mountains. The general thought the bear had actually raised the man, and by then, my dad and his friend stared at each other in fear and agreed for their life. It turned out that the man was another case of a wildman. He also seemed to have some sort of mental condition which made him quite refined in his movements, but nearly brain-dead in critical thinking or socialization. After hearing my dad recount that story a year ago, I thought of all the strongman competitions I went to, all of the WSM competitions I've watched, all of the powerlifting records I saw broken in both plain sight and in videos, all of the odd gimmicks some new "old-time strongmen" professed, and my own maximal abilities. Only some of these so-called "World's Strongest Men" could lift 500-700 pounds to their chest height with both arms, given a good struggle and a great amount of time. But this wildman did 570 pounds without interruption, leg-bending, or any sign of struggle, and with only one arm out at the side. Some of these powerlifters could deadlift 900+ pounds, but this wildman can possibly deadlift much, much more than 900 if he really wanted to. Me? I am only able to lift 350 pounds to my chest with extreme struggle and very noticeable leg-bending. Even a 250-pound dumbbell needs two hands from a strongman to even lift that object to shoulder height. Just shows you how much physically-able modern humans are willing to call themselves physically best, and how, when competing against a man of nature or across a wide variety of wild animals, they don't compare. 
The post about the Bulgarian bearman is a remarkable story, Polar. Reminds me of a few things I saw myself.
Story one. I was born and raised in a big city (Amsterdam). At 14, we moved to a small place. Countryside. Didn't like it one bit at first, but I learned to later on. In summer, I worked on the fields with my brothers. Tough work, but good money. When harvesting potatoes, the farmer we worked for used two trucks driving behind each other. The first collected the potatoes. They were put into bags by a few men and then handed over by them to the men on the second truck. These bags were heavy. One of the city boys, when moving over to the second truck with a bag, fell into the gap between the two trucks. While we was waiting for the sounds of cracking bones, one of the older men on the first truck grabbed him. With one arm, he lifted both the boy and the bag filled with potatoes. This guy was in his late fifties and about 150 pounds or so. Well below average for the region, that is. Although not young, he was quick enough to grab the boy and lift him and the bag on to the first truck. Combined weight at least 300 pounds. One arm. During coffee breaks, the younger guys always poked him. We liked him a lot, but he was very different from us. After his remarkable feat, they went over to see his muscles. We didn't see anything and started joking about his secret. The trick was hard labour and 3 beer a day, the farmer said. The old guy smiled. Second story. My younger brother started boxing at an early age. When he was about 20 or so, he moved to kick-boxing. He was in the gym every day and quickly became known. One of his best friends was a world champion in a different weight class. In built, he was similar to the older guy mentioned in the story above. I never saw any muscles, but his opponents usually were down before they had finished laughing. Most of them, in fact, had to be carried away and needed a long time to recover. Later, when he was well-known, he was invited to try his luck with the bigger guys. Same story, but his opponents suffered more severe black-outs because they were heavier. His career ended when he was surprised by combination of 6 of his former opponents in a local pub, but he still has a gym and most of his his customers are police-officers and would-be fighters. When my brother passed away (many of his friends didn't even reach 40), he came over to pay his respects. I hadn't seen him in a long time, but he recognized me immediately. How's the muscles these days, I asked. Although I still didn't see anything, he told me he couldn't get a fight anymore. The reason was the knock-outs were too known. And too severe. There's a lot more, but this will do. What I'm saying is strength is a bit of a mystery. I know plenty of people with a great built who used it to make a bit of money in sports or elsewhere. There's no question some of them almost compare to a bear for strength, but there seems to be a difference between them and those who really perform feats you wouldn't believe. Most of those operating in the last category never saw a gym and, on top of that, eat crap all the time. That's apart from drinking beer whenever possible, of course. Although enigmas, they're there and very real. My take is the generations born between both World Wars in particular, although quite a bit shorter and seldom exceeding 180 pounds, are a different breed. They were the ones who built the society we live in today. Not one of those I know was even close to the prosperity typical for those living in the western world of today. Some of their children, although the opposite of the well-known sportsmen of today, almost compare to a bear or a big cat for strength. It has to be said not one of them I know ever used it to his advantage. These guys have moral standards you only read about. These bearmen know you can't take things for granted. Their best opponents are average men you wouldn't give a dime. So there's strength and strength. Usually, you don't see it. You sense it. As to the ability to use it. Big cats don't compare to bears for robustness and strength, and yet they do. In some ways. Movement and speed definitely are involved. Same for technique and attitude. All in all, I'd say it could compare to what I saw in music. Some of the people I played with had no musical education at all. I also didn't see any ambition or big egos. Yet they outplayed the best whenever they wanted to. Real qualities are inborn. Same, I think, for other fields. What we see most often today is parodies. Today is the day of deception, airplay and ego. Those we see most often have great abilities in this respect, but they always come up empty when things matter. Most people don't see them for what they are and they don't seem to care. Until they realize the consequences.
I don't think any human (or primate, for that matter) could be as strong as a big cat or bear at weight parity.
The wildman's abilities are; however, much more enhanced than that of "modernized" humans (or diminshed, depending on their ability). But I don't think the Bulgarian bearman is truly as strong as an equally-weighted bear, not even close, in my opinion. I do agree, though, that strength is difficult to evaluate, especially when it comes to humans. A man who constantly presses 400 pounds over his head may not be able to deadlift 1000 pounds, and vice versa. He is only going to get stronger at what he does, not all movements.
In order to avoid any kind of suspicion right away: my previous post was serious. No ridicule or pun was intended. I just wrote a bit about the things I saw myself. Strength apparently can be expressed in more than one way and pronounced musculature isn't always one of the dominant features. The ability to use strength in the proper way is an entirely different matter.
As to humans and animals. Although some of us can lift incredible weights, humans, when compared to even smallish (wild) animals, lack in nearly all departments. One reason was discussed in an article on cats and humans recently posted. Another is humans have no weapons whatsoever. A fight would be a very one-sided affair in nearly all cases. The only real asset we have is not well understood and, as a result, very poorly developed.
Here is the famous Andre the Giant breaking an iron bar in two, lifting a one-ton block a foot off the ground, and I am not sure if the pulling contest was real or staged. If it was real, though, it would really show Andre's pulling strength equal to that of six men (guesstimate)!
I don't even think it's possible for even world record deadlifters Benedikt Magnusson, The Mountain, Andy Bolton, or Eddie Hall to even lift that block off of the ground! That speaks volumes about Andre's brute strength!
haha you can't think that is real?
The best is the same bar that snaps over his back is used to lift a "one ton" weight.... Never in a million years would a bar that snaps by human strength be able to hold up 2000 lbs centralized on one point Your eddie hall video is the truest form of strength, that is a feat that should be awed at, not pretend exploits by an organization that makes money off of fake stories and results. In fact, because of andres condition he was extremely fragile, he once broke his ankle getting out of bed. He was unable to straighten his spine, never had a work out regiment and never possessed any of the explosive strength needed to perform a DL, squat or any other compound strength movements.
@Pckts,
You're right. I don't know why I didn't think of that at the time. It would most likely break in 1/4 if it had to support a ton on its midpoint. Looks like the "one-ton" block really isn't one ton. But I would still say that Andre matches with world-class powerlifters on some of his strength attributes. It is very rare that I get fooled by these attractions.
Never could he match a world class power lifter, he couldn't match an amateur power lifter,
Remember what you and peter were discussing... How the human body will become powerful in a movement they have done repetitively and they will be strong in any movements that require those muscles. The same goes for lifting, no man will just walk into a competition and compete with the best of the best in that field. Olympic lifting, power lifting, strong man, cross fit and the list goes on. Andre never lifted weights, he was awkward, uncoordinated and disabled. Is he stronger than the average man, of course, he's 400+ lbs, is he stronger than a pro strongman... not a chance, there isn't a lift you could put him in where he could out match the likes of the Mountain, Pudiowski, Samuelsson or many others. (07-14-2016, 12:32 AM)Pckts Wrote: haha you can't think that is real? Agreed. Andre was quite weak when it came to leg-bending to a degree, and most definitely weak when it came to "weight-room strength". But he was quite strong in "real-world" applications. Yeah, Eddie Hall video is simply more true in terms of strength: it doesn't mean he could beat Denis Cyplenkov in an arm-wrestling match or out-clean/out-jerk Vasily Alekseyev in an Olympic Weightlifting meet. Lifting half a ton does not equal a 500-pound log press, which does not equal a 500-pound curl (IDK if that is even possible). In short, it is hard to say who the world's strongest man is (with the possible exception of the Bulgarian bearman story that I've posted). There might be a strong man in the plains of Africa waiting to be dubbed with that title. |
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