Lions of Timbavati

[Potato]

(06-26-2024, 10:40 AM)Tr1x24 Wrote: Looks like they didnt succeed at trying to establish themselves as full territorial and pride males of Mayambulas

That is yet to be seen. Birminghams breakaways should have what it needs to contest Vuyela males. Reply

[lionuk]

(06-24-2024, 10:38 PM)Tr1x24 Wrote:

(06-24-2024, 09:44 PM)BA0701 Wrote: Also, appears to me, that they didn't take over the pride yet, as well, Else why would they chase them off like that, and if they were pride males why would those females run away like that?

Yea, they where prob seen with few members, mating etc., but still didnt establish themselves as full pride males.

Did someone recognize 3 males?

Black maned is Kovu i think.

So far I'm able to identify at least three Birmingham breakaway males seen recently. These are latest pictures of them


Indlebe

 

*This image is copyright of its original author

 Dzombo

*This image is copyright of its original author

Kovu

*This image is copyright of its original author

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[lionuk]

Another recent picture of Kovu. He does look like the Lieutenant Avoca/Giraffe male, my opinion

*This image is copyright of its original author

Lieutenant Avoca/Giraffe male

*This image is copyright of its original author

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[Ttimemarti]

I definitely see the resemblance Reply

[Mapokser]

Wow so it seems at least 5 BB are alive and together, meaning we might really see a serious competition between 2 huge coalitions which is rare to see to a point we don't know much how such competition plays out.

5v5 or 5v6 is probably anyone's game, it'd depend a lot on luck and who catches who first, but that's assuming the BB aren't pushoevers and can act at least like average dominant males, because clearly the Vuyelas are more experienced and in their absolute peak. Reply

[Mapokser]

@Tr1x24 they did fully establish themselves, they even have cubs.

What happened was that they were defeated by another dominant coalition. Reply

[KM600]

(06-26-2024, 09:28 PM)Mapokser Wrote: Wow so it seems at least 5 BB are alive and together, meaning we might really see a serious competition between 2 huge coalitions which is rare to see to a point we don't know much how such competition plays out.

5v5 or 5v6 is probably anyone's game, it'd depend a lot on luck and who catches who first, but that's assuming the BB aren't pushoevers and can act at least like average dominant males, because clearly the Vuyelas are more experienced and in their absolute peak.

One thing that I wouldn’t overlook is that Vuyelas are already pride males, they may not be as willing to fight a huge coalition to win over another pride. That being said BBs could also look elsewhere and choose an easier territory to take aswell. 

I always find it interesting how large coalitions react when they are slightly outnumbered / evenly challenged at this stage in their lives as it may be the first time they’re not massive favourites. It’s where u see which males are dependable on their numbers and which males will fight regardless. Reply

[Tr1x24]

(06-26-2024, 08:31 PM)lionuk Wrote: Another recent picture of Kovu. He does look like the Lieutenant Avoca/Giraffe male, my opinion

Apperantly Kovu is quite older then the rest, so he is possibly sired by Avoca/Giraffes.

But he is also similar to Tyson Ross male, so who knows. Reply

[Mapokser]

@KM600 only instances I remember ( in a well observed area ) where Matimbas and Majingilane in mid to late 2011. Majingilane were a year older, but Matimbas had numbers.

4 Majingilane and 6 Matimba. They had an encounter where 3 Majingis met 4 Matimba ( including older Ndhuna and younger 4,5yo HB ). It was in Majingi territory, Matimbas chased them but Majingis turned at some point and chased back, this went back and forth all morning.

One report said it was a stalemate, another guide said the Majingis won because it was in their territory.

Immediately after that though, Majingis abandoned the far north and east that they took from Mapogo and Gijimas, and the Matimbas took the NK pride.

It's likely that hearing 6 Matimbas roaring the Majingis quickly realized that it was better to leave.

And then the other instance was 4 Majingi and 4 Selatis. That was well documented, the Majingis were older, much more experienced, bigger and primed and always on the offensive, the Selatis always defending themselves, but despite being on the defensive, they were getting the better of the Majingis, winning clashes even when outnumbered.

One Selati perished from a buffalo injury though and then in early 2014 the Majingis quickly defeated them 4v3. When it was 4v4 though, even with an injury Selati and the Majingis trying hard and having good opportunities, they couldn't beat the Selatis.

Even here though, 6 Matimba v 4 Majingi had only one clash, 3v4. And 4 Selati v 4 Majingi is a good comparison but still only one example and 4v4 not 5v5 or 5v6. Reply

[BA0701]

(06-26-2024, 10:58 PM)Mapokser Wrote: @KM600 only instances I remember ( in a well observed area ) where Matimbas and Majingilane in mid to late 2011. Majingilane were a year older, but Matimbas had numbers.

4 Majingilane and 6 Matimba. They had an encounter where 3 Majingis met 4 Matimba ( including older Ndhuna and younger 4,5yo HB ). It was in Majingi territory, Matimbas chased them but Majingis turned at some point and chased back, this went back and forth all morning.

One report said it was a stalemate, another guide said the Majingis won because it was in their territory.

Immediately after that though, Majingis abandoned the far north and east that they took from Mapogo and Gijimas, and the Matimbas took the NK pride.

It's likely that hearing 6 Matimbas roaring the Majingis quickly realized that it was better to leave.

And then the other instance was 4 Majingi and 4 Selatis. That was well documented, the Majingis were older, much more experienced, bigger and primed and always on the offensive, the Selatis always defending themselves, but despite being on the defensive, they were getting the better of the Majingis, winning clashes even when outnumbered.

One Selati perished from a buffalo injury though and then in early 2014 the Majingis quickly defeated them 4v3. When it was 4v4 though, even with an injury Selati and the Majingis trying hard and having good opportunities, they couldn't beat the Selatis.

Even here though, 6 Matimba v 4 Majingi had only one clash, 3v4. And 4 Selati v 4 Majingi is a good comparison but still only one example and 4v4 not 5v5 or 5v6.

From everything I have seen and read, the Selatis were an incredible coalition, and if not for some incredibly terrible luck (hunting injuries, etc...) they could have created a really strong legacy. They were certainly tight, powerful and buffalo hunter extraordinaires, for sure. Reply

[KM600]

(06-26-2024, 10:58 PM)Mapokser Wrote: @KM600 only instances I remember ( in a well observed area ) where Matimbas and Majingilane in mid to late 2011. Majingilane were a year older, but Matimbas had numbers.

4 Majingilane and 6 Matimba. They had an encounter where 3 Majingis met 4 Matimba ( including older Ndhuna and younger 4,5yo HB ). It was in Majingi territory, Matimbas chased them but Majingis turned at some point and chased back, this went back and forth all morning.

One report said it was a stalemate, another guide said the Majingis won because it was in their territory.

Immediately after that though, Majingis abandoned the far north and east that they took from Mapogo and Gijimas, and the Matimbas took the NK pride.

It's likely that hearing 6 Matimbas roaring the Majingis quickly realized that it was better to leave.

And then the other instance was 4 Majingi and 4 Selatis. That was well documented, the Majingis were older, much more experienced, bigger and primed and always on the offensive, the Selatis always defending themselves, but despite being on the defensive, they were getting the better of the Majingis, winning clashes even when outnumbered.

One Selati perished from a buffalo injury though and then in early 2014 the Majingis quickly defeated them 4v3. When it was 4v4 though, even with an injury Selati and the Majingis trying hard and having good opportunities, they couldn't beat the Selatis.

Even here though, 6 Matimba v 4 Majingi had only one clash, 3v4. And 4 Selati v 4 Majingi is a good comparison but still only one example and 4v4 not 5v5 or 5v6.

Only other example I’ve heard of was 5 Selinda males vs the 4 Marsh Pride males in Botswana. Think they were known as the old Mababe males but not definitely sure on that. Despite both having numbers, the 5 Selinda brothers reportedly ended up killing one of the four brothers and ousted the others. Think they completed the takeover in less than a year, maybe even closer to 6 months which is crazy considering they were up against 4 dominant, pride males. Reply

[Mwk85]

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[Potato]

Five Male Lions feeding on a Giraffe | Birmingham Breakaway Males | 27 June 2024

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[KM600]

Young Avoca male had a run in with the Monwana Pride. He was feeding with them until Mapoza showed up with his sons and they gave him a lil beating. That one young male to the right is real aggressive, looks like he went straight for the neck.

Good to hear that Mapoza is spending a lot of time with his sons, he will eventually lose the pride and can lean on that strong bond to occupy somewhere else with his sons.

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[Tr1x24]

(06-29-2024, 02:51 PM)KM600 Wrote: Young Avoca male had a run in with the Monwana Pride. He was feeding with them until Mapoza showed up with his sons and they gave him a lil beating. That one young male to the right is real aggressive, looks like he went straight for the neck.

Good to hear that Mapoza is spending a lot of time with his sons, he will eventually lose the pride and can lean on that strong bond to occupy somewhere else with his sons.

Hope Avoca got away without serious injuries from his father and cousins.

How many Monwana young males? Looks like 5 or 6 on the video if im not mistaken.

When are these guys born in 2020 exactly? They look good. Reply