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~~Luipaard~~ · 04-01-2019, 02:48 PM

Rare camera trap of a male leopard in Guinea-Bissau, West Africa

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~~Luipaard~~ · 04-04-2019, 01:15 PM

This video is a nice example of the extreme sexual dimorphism in Central African leopards. The (several?) males dwarf every single female.

~~Luipaard~~ · 04-04-2019, 01:46 PM

Just look at this male from Gabon. Easily weighs 90kg if not more...

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~~Luipaard~~ · 04-10-2019, 12:32 PM

Some more individuals from Gabon

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~~Luipaard~~ · 04-10-2019, 12:44 PM

Male from Gabon with jaguar like coat (spots inside the rosettes)

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Pckts · 04-10-2019, 11:33 PM

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Female

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male

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Female

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Pckts · 04-10-2019, 11:45 PM

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Nice dewlap on this one

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https://www.zooniverse.org/projects/panthera-research/camera-catalogue/collections/lukast/gabon-2?page=13

These are the more modest angles and specimens

~~Luipaard~~ · 04-12-2019, 03:03 PM

I got in touch with someone from Panthera. Here's the response I got:

Quote:Hi, my name is Jo and I am one of Panthera's research technicians in South Africa. What an excellent question! I too have noticed that the Gabon leopards are much larger and appear stockier too, but I did not know what the difference measured out to be. I sent your question to our researchers in central and western Africa to see if they had any insight. Our chat group had a great discussion on the topic and some photos of "beasty" leopard males were shared. It does not sound like anyone in Panthera has done much research into the weight of leopards in the equatorial region. However, to gather weight information on live leopards, it requires an immobilisation by a veterinarian, which is a risky and stressful procedure for the leopard. Unless there is another activity such as removal of a snare or a collaring for monitoring (which we really try not do unless absolutely necessary for leopards), than just gathering weight information is not justifiable for a procedure with that level of risk. Overall, I think it is very interesting and something cool to note. Thank you so much for your question! Cheers, Jo

Interesting to see what their opinion is. Seems like they share that of mine.

Pckts · 04-12-2019, 06:47 PM

So they haven't provided any insight other than the one person who thinks they look beastly in photos but panthera discussion didnt disclose anything?
Try to get in touch with Laila Bahaa-el-din, shes the main person involved in the Congo Basin research team recommended by Sebastian Kennerknecht, both involved with the research team but Sebastian was researching the golden cat and a little leopard research as well, he did not know if they are any different in size btw.
I have one other person who photographed one who said he thinks they are "as large" as their counterparts but nothing real yet, which is why I'm waiting to get in contact with Laila but I haven't received her contact info yet if you have the time that's who you're going to want to get in contact with.

~~Luipaard~~ · 04-13-2019, 11:53 AM

Quote:So they haven't provided any insight other than the one person who thinks they look beastly in photos but panthera discussion didnt disclose anything?

No Jo also noticed the difference between these leopards and other African leopards. So they discussed about this and probably used camera trap photos of male leopards who they think are 'beastly'.

Quote:I have one other person who photographed one who said he thinks they are "as large" as their counterparts but nothing real yet,

There's also this picture. One of the very few photographs but you don't find this one impressive. I notice the massive skull he has, most would say it's a jaguar.

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~~Luipaard~~ · 04-20-2019, 11:28 AM

Female from Odzala National Park, Congo.

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~~Luipaard~~ · 04-23-2019, 11:03 AM

"The male in my video his weight is a little more than 90 kg which is the maximum weight in Gabon, we had never met this male before in the region, the guides of Nyonié they estimate his weight can be even over 100 kg"

Pckts · 04-23-2019, 04:48 PM

(04-23-2019, 11:03 AM)Luipaard Wrote:

"The male in my video his weight is a little more than 90 kg which is the maximum weight in Gabon, we had never met this male before in the region, the guides of Nyonié they estimate his weight can be even over 100 kg"

Except for the fact that he wasn't weighed, correct?

Comparing him to a tiny female is misleading, be honest, how large do you actually think that female is?

I'd have serious doubts of that leopard being even 90kgs either, he looks like a good sized Male but not one that is 40% heavier than a good sized Leopard from S. Or E. Africa.

~~Luipaard~~ · 04-23-2019, 08:37 PM

(04-23-2019, 04:48 PM)Pckts Wrote:
(04-23-2019, 11:03 AM)Luipaard Wrote:

"The male in my video his weight is a little more than 90 kg which is the maximum weight in Gabon, we had never met this male before in the region, the guides of Nyonié they estimate his weight can be even over 100 kg"

Except for the fact that he wasn't weighed, correct?

Comparing him to a tiny female is misleading, be honest, how large do you actually think that female is?

I'd have serious doubts of that leopard being even 90kgs either, he looks like a good sized Male but not one that is 40% heavier than a good sized Leopard from S. Or E. Africa.

That's your opinion and that's fine by me. I also know your opinion about these Central African leopards (being equal to other, mediocre subspecies). But I'm still gonna lean towards the guides their estimation if that's okay for you.

Quote:Comparing him to a tiny female is misleading

Except for the fact that she wasn't weighed, correct? As I've mentioned before, sexual dimorphism in Central African leopards is extreme.

Pckts · 04-23-2019, 09:12 PM

(04-23-2019, 08:37 PM)Luipaard Wrote:
(04-23-2019, 04:48 PM)Pckts Wrote:
(04-23-2019, 11:03 AM)Luipaard Wrote:

"The male in my video his weight is a little more than 90 kg which is the maximum weight in Gabon, we had never met this male before in the region, the guides of Nyonié they estimate his weight can be even over 100 kg"

Except for the fact that he wasn't weighed, correct?

Comparing him to a tiny female is misleading, be honest, how large do you actually think that female is?

I'd have serious doubts of that leopard being even 90kgs either, he looks like a good sized Male but not one that is 40% heavier than a good sized Leopard from S. Or E. Africa.

That's your opinion and that's fine by me. I also know your opinion about these Central African leopards (being equal to other, mediocre subspecies). But I'm still gonna lean towards the guides their estimation if that's okay for you.

Quote:Comparing him to a tiny female is misleading

Except for the fact that she wasn't weighed, correct? As I've mentioned before, sexual dimorphism in Central African leopards is extreme.

Sexual Dimorphism in C. Africa is no different than anywhere else.

Jaguar

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Tiger

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^Sub Adult male BTW^

Lion

Leopard *Not from C. Africa*

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Lion
Asiatic

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African

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From my post #103 in the "Big Males compared to females" thread.

"All big 4 show similar sexual dimorphism.

(Females) (Males)
80kg-170kg 170kg-272kg = Lions (Asiatic-African) and Tigers (Indian)
40kg-100kg 60kg - 150kg = Jaguars
30kg-60kg 40kg - 100kg = Leopards (African-Indian-Persian)

Locations not included.

Just to elaborate a bit further, Big Cats are like people, they come in all shapes and sizes. Some are much larger or smaller than others, so sometimes you'll see a large female with a small male or vice versa and it may give you a false sense of individual size. I generally try to avoid coming to conclusions on individual size unless I'm familiar with the female and/or male."

This still holds true, no Panthera shows any more or less dimorphism it just depends on the individuals you're comparing them too.

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