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Modern weights and measurements on wild tigers

United States Pckts Online
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( This post was last modified: 07-30-2020, 01:02 AM by Pckts )

(07-30-2020, 12:11 AM)tsk_19 Wrote:
(07-29-2020, 08:01 PM)Pckts Wrote: I also asked about this male

*This image is copyright of its original author


*This image is copyright of its original author

This male was weighted during post mortem.  Kaushlendra Singh the post mortem report on his facebook page. Carcass weighted 192 kg.
https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=3475610719133349&set=pcb.3475615739132847

I wonder if that is a skinned carcass or not?
I ask because his length is short at 65'' but shoulder height is tall at 44'' (could be measured to tip of paw)
A chest girth of 56'' is massive, that's larger than the Sauhara male

Tiger Measurements to compare
Body Length 167cm
Length of Tail 102cm
Girth 144cm
Fore Limb height 113cm
Body Weight 192kg
Canine Length Upper Right 6.1 Left 6.0
Lower Right 5.0 Left 5.2


*This image is copyright of its original author
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United States tigerluver Offline
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Does Mr. Jamshed weigh or estimate his specimens? Just wondering due to the discrepancy.
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United States Pckts Online
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( This post was last modified: 07-30-2020, 01:19 AM by Pckts )

(07-30-2020, 01:15 AM)tigerluver Wrote: Does Mr. Jamshed weigh or estimate his specimens? Just wondering due to the discrepancy.

He estimated the Sugar Cane Tiger but is onsite for the other specimen I posted.
You can see him in the photo and his response beneath so I assume that is accurate.
I sent him the link on the autopsy although he already had liked it so I'm sure he was aware of it.
I'll relay when he responds.
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United States Pckts Online
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Posted By


Tamojit Ghosh



"I  obtained a kill by a particularly fine tiger subsequently
shot by Mr. (now Sir) W. L. Stampe and measuring over 10 feet
between pegs and I set my automatic flashlight traps over the
kill in the usual way, requiring about two hours' silent work on
foot at the kill, with the tiger hanging about all the time.
I then left the kill for the night and returned in the morning
on foot and with no weapon, to see what had happened. On
reaching the spot I found that the tiger had returned and had
removed the kill without firing my flashlight in a way which
seemed to me quite impossible.
I was so astonished that, without thinking what I was
doing, I silently followed the drag, accompanied by my Garhwali
orderly, Mahendra Singh, up a steep slope culminating in a
small plateau. On reaching the plateau we found that the
drag went round a big rock, so we went round the rock too,
and suddenly blundered right on the kill with the tiger in
possession ! The distance could not have been more than
five or six yards and the tiger had apparently been so engrossed
in his meal that he hadn't heard us coming.
As we turned the corner, however, he suddenly looked up
and immediately crouched with a horrible snarl, lashing his
tail from side to side and ready to spring at any moment. The
situation was critical and it really looked as though our number
was up this time. We had no rifle. The tiger had been suddenly
disturbed and was obviously very angry.
Retreat was very difficult either for the tiger or for us.
THE PHOTOGRAPHER'S POINT OF VIEW 33
But instinctively we both did the only possible thing in such
circumstances and "
froze," staring the tiger straight in the eyes.
This continued for a minute or so, the tiger snarling and lashing
his tail and we standing motionless with our hearts beating like
sledge-hammers. Then we began gradually to move backwards
inch by inch, hoping that the tiger wouldn't notice that we were
moving.
The snarls increased.
We stopped, fearing the worst. But as opportunity offered
we continued our almost imperceptible retreat, until finally
with sighs of relief we disappeared behind the rock.
The tiger did not follow and we beat a hasty retreat ! This
was, I think, one of the nearest things I have ever had, as the
slightest sudden movement on our part would have precipitated
an attack which we could never have met, with no weapon
between us.
Anyhow,
"
All's well that ends well," but I shall always
remain thankful that I had a staunch man with me, who instantly
realised without being told indeed, there was no
opportunity to speak ! what was the only chance of escaping
from a really critical situation.
I think that most shikaris will agree that this sudden
meeting with an angry tiger would have been a tense moment,
even if I had been armed with a heavy rifle. Without a rifle
at all,
"
tense
"
hardly describes the situation.------------- FW Champion ..



From: With A Camera in Tigerland by F.W.Champion IFS (1927), Chatto & Windus, London.
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Rishi Offline
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( This post was last modified: 08-06-2020, 10:03 AM by Rishi )

She got stranded in a village in January 2010 & in one of the (now) rare recue operations was captured, to be released back.

I remember reading in news that she was 8ft 6inch long & weighed 65 kg.

*This image is copyright of its original author


2 adult female & 3 adult male tigers were captured, radio-collared and released back into the forests in past decade. Of them, a 6-year old male (Netidhopani tiger) was captured, while straying into inhabited areas, and weighed only 97 kg, but gained almost 10 kg in only 2 weeks at rescue centre. Its neck was measured 53 cm. Another adult tiger (Khatuajhuri male), which was caught at Malmelia village of Basirhat range, was also found to be frail and underweight (108 kg) with the neck-size of 58 cm.

Other than these we have no records on weights of healthy tigers living deep within the mangroves.
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India Ashutosh Online
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@Rishi, YV Jhala radiocollared a female weighing 96 or 98 kilos in 2017.
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Rishi Offline
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(08-06-2020, 11:05 AM)Ashutosh Wrote: @Rishi, YV Jhala radiocollared a female weighing 96 or 98 kilos in 2017.

By tranqing them in the deep interiors?! .. Whoa!

If you got a link where I can read more about it, then please send/share.
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India Ashutosh Online
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I saw it on a documentary. Though I do remember a study done by Jhala about Sundarbans tiger and they had collared 6 tigers - 3 males, 3 females. But, this study was published in 2016. The documentary I remember was from 2018.
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Rishi Offline
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( This post was last modified: 08-06-2020, 01:43 PM by Rishi )

(08-06-2020, 01:29 PM)Ashutosh Wrote: I saw it on a documentary. Though I do remember a study done by Jhala about Sundarbans tiger and they had collared 6 tigers - 3 males, 3 females. But, this study was published in 2016. The documentary I remember was from 2018.

Remember the name of the docu?.. That'll help too. I couldn't find anything of the sort.

And is here the study: Ranging, Activity and Habitat Use by Tigers in the Mangrove Forests of the Sundarban
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India Ashutosh Online
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@Rishi It was a documentary on Animal planet in the series mission big cat (it was one of the episodes).
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Dark Jaguar Offline
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( This post was last modified: 08-16-2020, 05:47 PM by Dark Jaguar )

Batua Sumatran male Tiger 110 kg.

Unfortunately as a result of a poacher's snare the male tiger named Kiyay Batua suffered many injuries which resulted him to get his leg amputated, he will be kept in captivity for recover.

photo credits: Istimewa

*This image is copyright of its original author




*This image is copyright of its original author


''The Sumatran tiger weighing around 110 kg was previously caught in the Batu Ampar area, Suoh, West Lampung, Tuesday (2/7/2019). Not only did his leg rot and had to be amputated, Batua also suffered wounds on his stomach and broken his upper canines. In addition, there is a hole above the neck, on the back and between the right front legs.''


110 kg Batua Sumatran male when found. ( Photo: Instagram @bksda_lampung )


*This image is copyright of its original author





Prof. Dr. Rosichon Ubaidillah observes the activities of the Batua Tiger through CCTV cameras. (Photo: Lampung77.com)


*This image is copyright of its original author


From the results of his observations when viewing Batua's activities through CCTV cameras, Rosichon revealed that these animals were very risky if released.

“Personally, I'm a little doubtful about being released. This is related to his biophysical condition (deformed right leg). Biophysics for carnivorous (meat-eating) animal groups is more complicated than for non-carnivores. There is the ability to chase, catch and kill prey. If the biophysics is not fulfilled, it cannot. "It is more risky for the tiger to live if the biophysics are not fulfilled," said the Association of Zoos throughout Indonesia (PKBSI).



Thankfuly his condition improved.

''Luckily, after the amputation and receiving treatment and intensive care at the Green Valley Conservation Institute (LK), Lampung, Batua's condition has gradually improved even though his condition is now permanently disabled. Batua is now still in isolation for the next three months for recovery.''

photo credits: Istimewa

*This image is copyright of its original author




Check the full case in details from the Indonesian pages.

https://www.lampung77.com/kaki-kanan-dia...i-alamnya/

https://www.lampung77.com/fakta-fakta-ha...ikawinkan/
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Dark Jaguar Offline
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( This post was last modified: 08-21-2020, 04:17 PM by Dark Jaguar )

(08-16-2020, 05:39 PM)Dark Jaguar Wrote: Batua Sumatran male Tiger 110 kg.

Unfortunately as a result of a poacher's snare the male tiger named Kiyay Batua suffered many injuries which resulted him to get his leg amputated, he will be kept in captivity for recover.

photo credits: Istimewa

*This image is copyright of its original author




*This image is copyright of its original author


''The Sumatran tiger weighing around 110 kg was previously caught in the Batu Ampar area, Suoh, West Lampung, Tuesday (2/7/2019). Not only did his leg rot and had to be amputated, Batua also suffered wounds on his stomach and broken his upper canines. In addition, there is a hole above the neck, on the back and between the right front legs.''


110 kg Batua Sumatran male when found. ( Photo: Instagram @bksda_lampung )


*This image is copyright of its original author





Prof. Dr. Rosichon Ubaidillah observes the activities of the Batua Tiger through CCTV cameras. (Photo: Lampung77.com)


*This image is copyright of its original author


From the results of his observations when viewing Batua's activities through CCTV cameras, Rosichon revealed that these animals were very risky if released.

“Personally, I'm a little doubtful about being released. This is related to his biophysical condition (deformed right leg). Biophysics for carnivorous (meat-eating) animal groups is more complicated than for non-carnivores. There is the ability to chase, catch and kill prey. If the biophysics is not fulfilled, it cannot. "It is more risky for the tiger to live if the biophysics are not fulfilled," said the Association of Zoos throughout Indonesia (PKBSI).



Thankfuly his condition improved.

''Luckily, after the amputation and receiving treatment and intensive care at the Green Valley Conservation Institute (LK), Lampung, Batua's condition has gradually improved even though his condition is now permanently disabled. Batua is now still in isolation for the next three months for recovery.''

photo credits: Istimewa

*This image is copyright of its original author




Check the full case in details from the Indonesian pages.

https://www.lampung77.com/kaki-kanan-dia...i-alamnya/

https://www.lampung77.com/fakta-fakta-ha...ikawinkan/


5 wild Sumatran tigers captured for translocation due to frequent conflicts with local residents.


*This image is copyright of its original author



June 2008

BANDARLAMPUNG, JUMAT - The Ministry of Forestry, through the Directorate of Biodiversity Conservation, Ministry of Forestry, translocated or moved five Sumatran tigers or Panthera tigris sumatrae and one crocodile from Nanggroe Aceh Darussalam to Lampung. The six animals were moved to the Tampang Belimbing area to be precise in the Pengekahan Village of Way Haru Village, Tampang Belimbing District, Bukit Barisan Selatan National Park, West Lampung.



*This image is copyright of its original author

Photo - ''The Indonesian Safari Park team is conducting a health check on a Sumatran tiger that has been quarantined for 8 months at the Office of the Natural Resources Conservation Agency (BKSDA), Aceh, Banda, Thursday (26/6). The five Sumatran tigers that are thought to have preyed on humans in the Aceh forest area will then be translated into the Bukit Barisan Selatan National Park area in Lampung.''




*This image is copyright of its original author





Veterinarian Bongot, a member of the veterinarian team who examined and supervised the health of the five tigers, said that while still under the care of the NAD BKSDA and before the translocation of the five days, they were given the initials A1, A2, A3, A4, and A5.

''A1 a male who weights 105 kg, A2 a male who weights 62 kg, A3 a male who weights 106 kg , A4 a male who weights 105 kg, A5 a female who weights 50 kg.''

''The five tigers are between 4-9 years old. When transferred, the five of them were in very good health.''


Further, Tonny said that when they arrived at Tampang Belimbing, the five tigers were not immediately released into the tropical forest of BBSNP. The five tigers will be placed in two large cages to adapt while being watched by a team of doctors or BBSNP managers. The adaptation process can take several months until the five of them are ready to be released into the BBSNP forest.

''When ready to be released, BBSNP managers and sponsors will attach a GSM Collar to each tiger before being released. This step was taken to monitor the whereabouts of the tigers.''



Learn more of the case in the Indonesian sources.

http://konservasipapua.blogspot.com/2008...atera.html

https://travel.kompas.com/read/2008/06/2...ke.lampung.

https://nasional.kompas.com/read/2008/06....?page=all




THE RELEASE

From the research by Ani Mardiastuti ''LESSONS LEARNED FROM THE TIGER TRANSLOCATION AND RELEASE IN TAMBLING, LAMPUNG, INDONESIA''

https://www.researchgate.net/publication..._Indonesia


METHODS.

The case study

'' In June 2008, five tigers (4 males, 1 female) were translocated from Banda Aceh to Bandar Lampung, from where they were brought to and released into the Tambling zone,  part  of  Bukit Barisan  Selatan National  Park  (BBSNP).  Tambling  is  currently privately managed and collaborate with the national park’s  authorities  in  boosting  ecotourism.  The private organisation funded the entire translocation process  that  was  initiated  and  coordinated  by  the Ministry of Environment and Forestry (MEF). After a successful rehabilitation, two male tigers were released into selected sites. Of the remaining three tigers, two were kept for release at a later date, after assessing the results of the first two releases, whereas  the fifth tiger,  a  known man-eater, was deemed too risky and kept in captivity for breeding purposes.''

Of the released Sumatran tigers one male of 8 years old weighing 119 kg and other male of 4 years old weighed 74 kg.


*This image is copyright of its original author



''Of the three unreleased tigers, one male (9 year) was kept in captivity, because of a history as a man-eater. The two remaining tigers (3-year  old female and 6-year old male) were kept temporarily in Tambling for  release at a later date, if the first release was successful.

After the release, the movement of two male tigers were monitored along with their  feeding  habits. Considering their movements combined with lack of human/livestock  conflict (e.g. home-range did not overlap  human  settlements), the release  was considerably a success.''
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Balam Offline
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@Dark Jaguar thanks so much for this valuable information on Sumatran tigers. I'm gonna work on another table for the once I have time similar to what we did with jaguars, there's almost 10 weights already with all the data in this thread.
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GuateGojira Offline
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(07-25-2020, 03:20 PM)Ashutosh Wrote: A couple of days ago, a tiger coded MT3 died within the Mukundra Tiger Reserve. It had an enlarged heart and clots were found in it’s heart as well. This tiger was 4.5 years old.

During the postmortem, it was revealed there were lumps of fat within the blood in the heart. The lump was almost the size of a closed fist, may be weighing between 50 and 100 grams, and the lungs were oozing out fluid mixed with pus, the CCF said, adding there was also huge amounts of fat in layers, deposited in the body.”




This tiger had been treated in early March for maggots on his face as a wound had turned septic and his tongue couldn’t reach his facial injuries to heal himself (this is NTCA protocol). At the time of his treatment, he weighed in at 243 kilos.

Today, the results of his autopsy have been revealed and data from his radio-collar suggests that he lost 51 kilos in last 5 months!

Some wildlife enthusiasts say that better management could have saved it’s life. Personally, I think they are being harsh and not letting nature take it’s course. I am guessing this has more to do with Mukundra losing a tiger.

@Rishi.

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/jaipur/mt-3-had-lost-51kg-in-5-mths-turned-anaemic/articleshow/77158969.cms

This is what make me happy and sad at the same time, new records will update my samples, but at the same time obligate me to change my tables and comparative images, but that is what the science request, constant update.

This record seems legit based in the figures provided, these are not round numbers and they stablish facts that happened. However when I saw the pictures that tiger do not seems large, but pictures may look deceptive in some cases.

I will like to see if I can dig a little more, and some of you that are from India may try to confirm the record. If all is good, I think that this is a good candidate to be added to the main list, contrary to many other records here that are only figures with no background. Let's se what we can get of this.

@Shadow did you got more information about the record tiger from Dr Yhala?
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GuateGojira Offline
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( This post was last modified: 08-25-2020, 09:01 PM by GuateGojira )

Short note: on the body mass of the Sumatran tiger.

As you know, in my last comparative image the average weight of the Sumatran tigers is of 123 kg (n=10; range: 104 - 148 kg) for males and 98 kg (n=5; range: 75 - 110 kg) for females. Now, we have more weights and is important to corroborate and explain some information that we have.

Information about the Sumatran tiger is very scarce and few hunting and scientific records are available. Based in the information that I have, and the new one provided here, I collected 19 weights from males, but actually is not that simple as we may think.

The first 6 males came from hunting records gathered by Sody (1949) and Mazák (2013), these weights are: 104, 104, 115, 123, 130 and 140 kg. Based on this and the captive specimens that he knowed, Mazák (1981) stablished a range of 100 - 140 kg for male Sumatran tigers. Latter in 2005, Slaght et al. (2005) reported only one wild male of 140.2 kg and the average weight of 21 captive males of 109.4 kg (SE 3.1) and 21 females of 86.7 kg (SE 2.8); including the wild male Slagth et al. (2005) stablished an average of 110.8 kg (SE 3.3). Barlow et al. (2009) provided more details as he published the ranges used, but while we know now that the lightest of the males was of 91 kg, the heaviest is the wild male of 140.2 kg, so we don't know which is the heaviest captive male in the original sample. As far I know, the heaviest pure Sumatran tiger weighed 131.4 kg (Juma tiger in the Australia Zoo, at 2007). There is a mention of a male of 181 kg from the DreamWorld park, but I am not quite sure if that tiger is 100% pure Sumatran.

Based on this, the captive male tigers may weight between 91 - 131 kg, while the wild males may weight between 100 to 140 kg, not big diference. Now we have new weights from wild males, all except one problematic specimens in not quite good conditions and that were captured for relocation or because were injured. The 11 males range from 62 to 130 kg, the lower figures reflect specimens not in they best form.

Priatna et al., 2012 reported three males over 4 years old that weighed 73, 98 and 122 kg, and althoug the document says that the three were in good conditions, do not specify if this was during the capture or before its release. Kompas & Fransisca (2008) mention four adults males of 62, 105, 105 and 106 kg, but two of those males (the ones of 105 and 62) are mentioned again by Mardiastuti (2019), this time with weights of 119 kg and 74 kg respectively. So, why there is a difference of 14 and 12 kg respectively? This shows that in the 9 months that they were is captivity they gained weight, corroborating that they initial weights were not normal and when they mention that they were in good conditions, it is clear that this was after the time of recovery in captivity. Here is where we found the problem of using the weigths of animals that presented problems as they do not reflect the status of a wild and healty animals. The weights of 73, 74 and 62 must be discarted (specially the one of 62 as is the same as the one of 74 kg) as do not reflect healthy males, check that even adult captive males do not weight as low. This leave us with all the other 15 wild males between 98 to 148 kg, which at least match the weights of healty adults in captivity and the old records, also from the wild. Other three wild males found injured, one from 110 kg (Jarkasih, 2019), other male of 130 kg confirmed by Veteriany Erni Suyanti Musabine were also included (Suyanti, 2015), and the record male of 148 kg captured in the Jambi region and named "Slamet" (ZLS, 2003), which was not injured but captured for study purposes.  

Using the 15 wild "healty" adult males we get an average of 119.6 kg, which seems realiable for a species with an average skull length of 314.8 mm, probably should be a little more, as @"Pathio" confirmed that the adults animals that we can see in camera traps in the deep of the jungle looks very heavy. The weights used are 98, 105, 106, 110, 119, 122, 130, 140.2 and 148 kg, plus the old records of 104, 104, 115, 123, 130 and 140 kg.

In conclution:
* Wild Sumatran male tigers: 119.6 kg - n=15 - range: 98 - 148 kg.
* Captive Sumatran male tigers: 109.4 kg - n=21 - range: 91 - 131 kg (?).

This means that I will need to update my image on the size of the tigers, but this provide us to a closer idea of what is the real weight of the Sumatran tigers.

Greetings to all.
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