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Impressive Wild Jaguars - Pictures and Videos
Impressive Wild Jaguars - Pictures and Videos
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Impressive Wild Jaguars - Pictures and Videos
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 (10-03-2020, 04:01 AM)KRA123 Wrote: I'm beginning to think that one thing about jaguars is that, partly because of their build, any jaguar will look impressive if an image of it is scaled up enough (lions may have the opposite problem). Looking back, I'm not surprised that Aju "only" came out to 110 kg since he looks to me to have a lighter frame than many large males; Gage was more of a surprise. Another problem though is that a jaguar may be in better condition in a photo than it was when it was actually weighed. I mean look at how much MM males weight apparently fluctuated between captures, and (maybe I'm wrong) I don't even thin he's passed his prime yet; it seems like their weight isn't really stable, even ignoring the effects of gorging. Weights are definitely never completely stable for any big cat, but your point of them being different in the build of pictures gathered compared to when they are actually captured holds validity. Aju was seen in person by Pckts and he said he was really big, so to his credit (Aju) he has a relatively large frame for his weight and while he is in his prime, he still may be able to put some 10-20 kg more as jaguars grown until they are 9 years of age. Your point about camera pictures and how deceptive they are is the reason why I'm so skeptical when I see people jumping to conclusions about the size of a species, population, or individual without much solid previous data to back those claims up (I'm myself have been guilty of these with Atlantic forest jaguars). I'm certainly more cautious now about giving weight estimations based on pictures and rely more on the trackers and biologists that have access to these cats in real life to get a better opinion from them. So in that sense, I'm only taking into consideration the weight estimations for Balam, Edno, and Forasteiro that were provided to me by Ailton Lara, the Jaguar ID Project, as well as Caricare who was estimated 120+kg plus by the owner of the reserve he lives in.
Edno, in all his glory
 *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author By Paseandoconsyv
From pousada Aguapé, unclear sex but I think this may be a male. This is the same area that captured that huge male eating the calf that was stuck in the tree.
 *This image is copyright of its original author By Pousada Aguapé
Inka
 *This image is copyright of its original author By Gasparetour Pantanal Balam "A large male jaguar (Balam)... we founded this jaguar with female jaguar (Margo) close to a marsh deer carcass, they were also mating. Because of carcass there were many vultures perched around waiting their turn to feed on the left overs (see the next photo, were we founded together Balam &Margo)"  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author By Karina Albarca  *This image is copyright of its original author By Gregori Fenile  (10-06-2020, 03:29 AM)Balam Wrote: Inka Balam looks gigantic next to her. I'm sure the angle is flattering but still, he looks huge in comparison. 
Cerrado Jaguar sedated captured by Biotrópicos Institute in Parque Nacional Grande Sertão Veredas - Cerrado ( same area where 100 kg Leão cerrado male was captured ).
credits: ONG Biotrópicos  *This image is copyright of its original author
 *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author By Pedro Beck We know Edno is huge because not only is his body very long, but he's also tall which is rare with jaguars, and still he manages to be stocky, meaning he's packing a lot of mass in his large frame. By comparison here is 130 kg Adriano/Ruxu:  *This image is copyright of its original author
Caatinga jag from Parque Nacional Serra das Capivaras.
And as usual in those areas of Parque Nacional Serra das Capivaras - Caatinga, it had to be melanistic since in that area its got the highest density of melanism genes studied. VIDEO 
Edno is clearly huge and Balam looks pretty big too. Either one could be as big as Lopez. Tusk doesn't really look to be in their size class to me. I actually think the local conservation organizations should commit to/make a point of weighing those very large specimens. If they are already weighing jaguars anyway, they might as well help to nail down some fairly significant information - the maximum size attained by the species. Of course, that isn't essential information for conservation, but like I said, they are already capturing and weighing jaguars anyway. Or am I missing something? How do they usually select which individuals they capture?
@KRA123 I recently had a talk with Valter Patrial who is a photographer who was also involved in some jaguar captures in Paso do Lontra in the south of the Pantanal. He's currently in Porto Jofre where Edno, Balam, Tusk, Forasteiro, Inka, et al live, he's captured several pictures of Edno so he knows him pretty well. I asked him what were the odds that Edno could be captured to retrieve his weight, he said this:
 *This image is copyright of its original author Basically they have very few incentives in collecting weight data, and this is the case not only for jaguars, I've noticed the same thing with other animals. Conservationists appear to be less interested in weights these days. About his estimate, while I appreciated it, I lean more towards the estimate that the Jaguar ID gave of at least 150 kg, not because in biased, but because Valter did not have the same direct contact that the people who run the JID have had with jaguars who used to live in the area, such as Lopez and Adriano, they've seen them in person. According to them Edno is a good deal bigger than both, and we know Lopez weighed 148 kg empty, so that gives you an idea. The JID implied in one conversation we had that Edno was bigger than Balam, Valter agrees:  *This image is copyright of its original author Now, Balam received a weight estimation of 135 kg by guide Ailton Lara who is pretty knowledgeable about these jaguars first hand. And keeping in mind that guide Pablo Barreiros told us that Balam was bigger than 130 kg Adriano, that 135 kg estimate holds weight. So if Balam weights around 135 kg, and if Valter Is correct that Edno has 15 kg more on him, that'd put Edno at 150 kg once again. (10-08-2020, 02:06 AM)KRA123 Wrote: Edno is clearly huge and Balam looks pretty big too. Either one could be as big as Lopez. Tusk doesn't really look to be in their size class to me. I actually think the local conservation organizations should commit to/make a point of weighing those very large specimens. If they are already weighing jaguars anyway, they might as well help to nail down some fairly significant information - the maximum size attained by the species. Of course, that isn't essential information for conservation, but like I said, they are already capturing and weighing jaguars anyway. Or am I missing something? How do they usually select which individuals they capture? Panthera actually still holds the right to capture a few more on their existing license, at least that was the case when I was out there. Panthera's facility is a few miles away from the Meeting of the 3 rivers, it's an old farming facility, you actually boat by it on your way back to Porto Jofre. That is where they generally capture their cats, so there is a possibility that the cats they capture may not even be the same you see at the meeting of the 3 rivers, but of course these Jaguars go too and from so who knows for sure. Plus they are constantly being pushed out and replaced by new territorial males. The most recent captures had to do with the fires if I'm not mistaken, these cats weren't part of the Corridor project that Panthera is researching. Lastly was that Panthera for whatever reason stopped their captures in recent days, I don't know if that changed now but that was the case when I was there last year. (10-08-2020, 02:26 AM)Balam Wrote: @KRA123 I recently had a talk with Valter Patrial who is a photographer who was also involved in some jaguar captures in Paso do Lontra in the south of the Pantanal. He's currently in Porto Jofre where Edno, Balam, Tusk, Forasteiro, Inka, et al live, he's captured several pictures of Edno so he knows him pretty well. I asked him what were the odds that Edno could be captured to retrieve his weight, he said this: Tusk must be a large framed Jaguar because I agree that he doesn't pack the same density as Balam, Edno or Adriano but everyone always says that he's huge. Adriano on the other hand was never very large framed but always a very thick Jaguar. I'd also like to know how these guys compare to Scarface who was said to be a large Jaguar during his prime years. |
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