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Freak Felids - A Discussion of History's Largest Felines

Canada GrizzlyClaws Offline
Canine Expert
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Moderators

(04-21-2019, 11:17 AM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-21-2019, 05:44 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:54 PM)sanjay Wrote: No Lion Vs Tiger Debate on forum, If you do again, moderator will ban you.
Tagging Mods
@Rishi @peter @tigerluver @GrizzlyClaws
Sorry.
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/
Cave Lions can grow 600 kg.

Please, be aware of the forum rules, and refrain to turn it into another lion vs tiger flamebait.

BTW, the inconsistency of the body mass calculation has been discussed over years, but we take the largest documented fossil records.

The largest Cave lion fossil record should reach the magnitude of 500 kg, and so far it is pretty clear that no American lion fossil or other later Cave lion fossil being larger than this.



*This image is copyright of its original author

I add this, that when here is posted some claim about extreme measurements of some animal and then some link to back up that claim. Mininum is, that there would be then same information to be found from that link.

So if I say suddenly, that Asian elephant can be 8000 kg, I can´t back it up by link where can´t be found such information confirmed. And if I´m questioned, it doesn´t help if then share a link about African elephant.

So when some claim is about American lion, then sources used in reasoning to back up claim, should be concerning American lions. Not some findings from Europe which aren´t the same thing. Personally I look closer when here is some new poster and putting some figures looking like to be extreme, that what he/she is talking about.


All the available of fossils of the American lion are well studied so far. If we scaled up the modern African lion to the same dimension, it would weigh in between 350 - 400 kg, but considered this species was more robust built proportionally. Therefore, the actual weight of the largest American lion could be something a little more than 400 kg, but overall anything over 450 kg is out the realm of possibility for the American lion.

So far, only the largest fossil record for the Cromerian Cave lion has been significantly outsized the largest American lion, so the possibility of 500 kg is only available for the aforementioned species.
4 users Like GrizzlyClaws's post
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Finland Shadow Offline
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( This post was last modified: 04-23-2019, 04:11 AM by Shadow )

(04-22-2019, 11:53 AM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-21-2019, 05:44 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:54 PM)sanjay Wrote: No Lion Vs Tiger Debate on forum, If you do again, moderator will ban you.
Tagging Mods
@Rishi @peter @tigerluver @GrizzlyClaws
Sorry.
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/
Cave Lions can grow 600 kg.

Please, be aware of the forum rules, and refrain to turn it into another lion vs tiger flamebait.

BTW, the inconsistency of the body mass calculation has been discussed over years, but we take the largest documented fossil records.

The largest Cave lion fossil record should reach the magnitude of 500 kg, and so far it is pretty clear that no American lion fossil or other later Cave lion fossil being larger than this.



*This image is copyright of its original author
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/




http://www.nat-geo.ru/science/694561-kladbishche-gigantskikh-peshchernykh-lvov-naydeno-v-bashkirii/
Cave Lions can up to 600 kg.

This is about that same issue in english:

http://russia-ic.com/education_science/science_overview/4453/#.XL1ktOgzZPY

I have to say, that when I look at big Kodiak bear weighing around 600 kg and knowing, that it is over 3 meters tall while standing on hind legs and when walking normally, shoulder height still 1,5 meters or even more.

Then I try to figure out an animal with shoulder height 1 meter said to be able to have same weight. And when looking at some ligers weighing 400 kg. I can´t help to get an image in my mind, where is 600 kg cave lion so fat, that it can roll sideways so, that legs not touching ground... :) I am really curious to see when official studies are published and what other scientists say. Now it looks like to be, that this 600 kg is only from Kosintsev. 

I am really curious to see more about this and see if I personally can fit it in common sense some way :)
1 user Likes Shadow's post
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Turkey Arctotherium Offline
Member
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( This post was last modified: 04-27-2019, 08:55 PM by Rishi )

(04-22-2019, 12:36 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 11:53 AM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-21-2019, 05:44 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:54 PM)sanjay Wrote: No Lion Vs Tiger Debate on forum, If you do again, moderator will ban you.
Tagging Mods
@Rishi @peter @tigerluver @GrizzlyClaws
Sorry.
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/
Cave Lions can grow 600 kg.

Please, be aware of the forum rules, and refrain to turn it into another lion vs tiger flamebait.

BTW, the inconsistency of the body mass calculation has been discussed over years, but we take the largest documented fossil records.

The largest Cave lion fossil record should reach the magnitude of 500 kg, and so far it is pretty clear that no American lion fossil or other later Cave lion fossil being larger than this.



*This image is copyright of its original author
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/




http://www.nat-geo.ru/science/694561-kladbishche-gigantskikh-peshchernykh-lvov-naydeno-v-bashkirii/
Cave Lions can up to 600 kg.

This is about that same issue in english:

http://russia-ic.com/education_science/science_overview/4453/#.XL1ktOgzZPY

I have to say, that when I look at big Kodiak bear weighing around 600 kg and knowing, that it is over 3 meters tall while standing on hind legs and when walking normally, shoulder height still 1,5 meters or even more.

Then I try to figure out an animal with shoulder height 1 meter said to be able to have same weight. And when looking at some ligers weighing 400 kg. I can´t help to get an image in my mind, where is 600 kg cave lion so fat, that it can roll sideways so, that legs not touching ground... :) I am really curious to see when official studies are published and what other scientists say. Now it looks like to be, that this 600 kg is only from Kosintsev. 

I am really curious to see more about this and see if I personally can fit it in common sense some way :)
https://hyperleap.com/topic/American_lion
https://markozen.com/2018/04/11/the-north-american-cave-lion/
https://sites.google.com/site/paleofilescom/prehistoric-world-records-cont-d
http://www.ligerworld.com/liger-vs-great-american-lion.html
https://roaring.earth/amazing-big-cats/2/
American Lion is the largest cat.
Reply

Finland Shadow Offline
Moderator
*****
Moderators

(04-27-2019, 12:26 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 12:36 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 11:53 AM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-21-2019, 05:44 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:54 PM)sanjay Wrote: No Lion Vs Tiger Debate on forum, If you do again, moderator will ban you.
Tagging Mods
@Rishi @peter @tigerluver @GrizzlyClaws
Sorry.
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/
Cave Lions can grow 600 kg.

Please, be aware of the forum rules, and refrain to turn it into another lion vs tiger flamebait.

BTW, the inconsistency of the body mass calculation has been discussed over years, but we take the largest documented fossil records.

The largest Cave lion fossil record should reach the magnitude of 500 kg, and so far it is pretty clear that no American lion fossil or other later Cave lion fossil being larger than this.



*This image is copyright of its original author
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/




http://www.nat-geo.ru/science/694561-kladbishche-gigantskikh-peshchernykh-lvov-naydeno-v-bashkirii/
Cave Lions can up to 600 kg.

This is about that same issue in english:

http://russia-ic.com/education_science/science_overview/4453/#.XL1ktOgzZPY

I have to say, that when I look at big Kodiak bear weighing around 600 kg and knowing, that it is over 3 meters tall while standing on hind legs and when walking normally, shoulder height still 1,5 meters or even more.

Then I try to figure out an animal with shoulder height 1 meter said to be able to have same weight. And when looking at some ligers weighing 400 kg. I can´t help to get an image in my mind, where is 600 kg cave lion so fat, that it can roll sideways so, that legs not touching ground... :) I am really curious to see when official studies are published and what other scientists say. Now it looks like to be, that this 600 kg is only from Kosintsev. 

I am really curious to see more about this and see if I personally can fit it in common sense some way :)
https://hyperleap.com/topic/American_lion
https://markozen.com/2018/04/11/the-north-american-cave-lion/
https://sites.google.com/site/paleofilescom/prehistoric-world-records-cont-d
http://www.ligerworld.com/liger-vs-great-american-lion.html
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/animalsversesanimals/panthera-leo-atrox-versus-panthera-tigris-soloensi-t2863.html
https://roaring.earth/amazing-big-cats/2/
American Lion is the largest cat.
I don´t even open some tapatalk or other forums, where fanboys of lions and tigers are having their "wars". If you have some good scientific source or article, just put direct link.

But does this mean, that you don´t believe to information you shared earlier about findings in Russia and that those are as big as claimed to be? Those articles about possibly biggest ever cave lions. I mean didn´t they have bigger bones, than American lion fossils?
1 user Likes Shadow's post
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Finland Shadow Offline
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Moderators
( This post was last modified: 04-27-2019, 01:19 PM by Shadow )

(04-27-2019, 12:26 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 12:36 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 11:53 AM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-21-2019, 05:44 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:54 PM)sanjay Wrote: No Lion Vs Tiger Debate on forum, If you do again, moderator will ban you.
Tagging Mods
@Rishi @peter @tigerluver @GrizzlyClaws
Sorry.
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/
Cave Lions can grow 600 kg.

Please, be aware of the forum rules, and refrain to turn it into another lion vs tiger flamebait.

BTW, the inconsistency of the body mass calculation has been discussed over years, but we take the largest documented fossil records.

The largest Cave lion fossil record should reach the magnitude of 500 kg, and so far it is pretty clear that no American lion fossil or other later Cave lion fossil being larger than this.



*This image is copyright of its original author
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/




http://www.nat-geo.ru/science/694561-kladbishche-gigantskikh-peshchernykh-lvov-naydeno-v-bashkirii/
Cave Lions can up to 600 kg.

This is about that same issue in english:

http://russia-ic.com/education_science/science_overview/4453/#.XL1ktOgzZPY

I have to say, that when I look at big Kodiak bear weighing around 600 kg and knowing, that it is over 3 meters tall while standing on hind legs and when walking normally, shoulder height still 1,5 meters or even more.

Then I try to figure out an animal with shoulder height 1 meter said to be able to have same weight. And when looking at some ligers weighing 400 kg. I can´t help to get an image in my mind, where is 600 kg cave lion so fat, that it can roll sideways so, that legs not touching ground... :) I am really curious to see when official studies are published and what other scientists say. Now it looks like to be, that this 600 kg is only from Kosintsev. 

I am really curious to see more about this and see if I personally can fit it in common sense some way :)
https://hyperleap.com/topic/American_lion
https://markozen.com/2018/04/11/the-north-american-cave-lion/
https://sites.google.com/site/paleofilescom/prehistoric-world-records-cont-d
http://www.ligerworld.com/liger-vs-great-american-lion.html
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/animalsversesanimals/panthera-leo-atrox-versus-panthera-tigris-soloensi-t2863.html
https://roaring.earth/amazing-big-cats/2/
American Lion is the largest cat.

About this link:
https://sites.google.com/site/paleofilescom/prehistoric-world-records-cont-d

Doesn´t look like reliable source. Those figures there are quite "interesting" :) For some animals there are extremely high and controversial figures, even something never confirmed by any reliable source. Then for instance polar bear maximum weight and height are not at all what should be. When you share some link, please check a bit before doing so, that information can handle at least some critical eye. People on this forum tend to be interested about animals, so sharing such links isn´t a good idea what comes to credibility of poster and also of this forum.

Same with this.... really, a few lines of overall information based on what? That kind of sites are for kids to give some idea, but not good as a source for good information.

https://roaring.earth/amazing-big-cats/2/
2 users Like Shadow's post
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Finland Shadow Offline
Moderator
*****
Moderators
( This post was last modified: 04-27-2019, 02:09 PM by Shadow )

(04-27-2019, 12:26 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 12:36 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 11:53 AM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-21-2019, 05:44 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:54 PM)sanjay Wrote: No Lion Vs Tiger Debate on forum, If you do again, moderator will ban you.
Tagging Mods
@Rishi @peter @tigerluver @GrizzlyClaws
Sorry.
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/
Cave Lions can grow 600 kg.

Please, be aware of the forum rules, and refrain to turn it into another lion vs tiger flamebait.

BTW, the inconsistency of the body mass calculation has been discussed over years, but we take the largest documented fossil records.

The largest Cave lion fossil record should reach the magnitude of 500 kg, and so far it is pretty clear that no American lion fossil or other later Cave lion fossil being larger than this.



*This image is copyright of its original author
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/




http://www.nat-geo.ru/science/694561-kladbishche-gigantskikh-peshchernykh-lvov-naydeno-v-bashkirii/
Cave Lions can up to 600 kg.

This is about that same issue in english:

http://russia-ic.com/education_science/science_overview/4453/#.XL1ktOgzZPY

I have to say, that when I look at big Kodiak bear weighing around 600 kg and knowing, that it is over 3 meters tall while standing on hind legs and when walking normally, shoulder height still 1,5 meters or even more.

Then I try to figure out an animal with shoulder height 1 meter said to be able to have same weight. And when looking at some ligers weighing 400 kg. I can´t help to get an image in my mind, where is 600 kg cave lion so fat, that it can roll sideways so, that legs not touching ground... :) I am really curious to see when official studies are published and what other scientists say. Now it looks like to be, that this 600 kg is only from Kosintsev. 

I am really curious to see more about this and see if I personally can fit it in common sense some way :)
https://hyperleap.com/topic/American_lion
https://markozen.com/2018/04/11/the-north-american-cave-lion/
https://sites.google.com/site/paleofilescom/prehistoric-world-records-cont-d
http://www.ligerworld.com/liger-vs-great-american-lion.html
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/animalsversesanimals/panthera-leo-atrox-versus-panthera-tigris-soloensi-t2863.html
https://roaring.earth/amazing-big-cats/2/
American Lion is the largest cat.

And just to make it clear. I couldn´t care less if American lion or cave lion from Europe was bigger (Spelaea or Atrox). I was originally interested to see how you explain that 600 kg claim, when you shared as proof a link, which didn´t confirm your claim. Then you used information about cave lion in order to justify your claim about 600 kg American lion.

Now after that was shot down, you share links and say, that American lion is the biggest of them all. And that is now in contradiction with information you shared before, because what comes to weights, any cat suspected to be 600 kg would be a clear contender to get the name "biggest lion ever" or "biggest feline ever".


It seems to be, that main thing you want to say is, that American lion was bigger than any other extinct or extant big cat, right?
Reply

Turkey Arctotherium Offline
Member
**

(04-27-2019, 12:49 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:26 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 12:36 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 11:53 AM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-21-2019, 05:44 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:54 PM)sanjay Wrote: No Lion Vs Tiger Debate on forum, If you do again, moderator will ban you.
Tagging Mods
@Rishi @peter @tigerluver @GrizzlyClaws
Sorry.
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/
Cave Lions can grow 600 kg.

Please, be aware of the forum rules, and refrain to turn it into another lion vs tiger flamebait.

BTW, the inconsistency of the body mass calculation has been discussed over years, but we take the largest documented fossil records.

The largest Cave lion fossil record should reach the magnitude of 500 kg, and so far it is pretty clear that no American lion fossil or other later Cave lion fossil being larger than this.



*This image is copyright of its original author
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/




http://www.nat-geo.ru/science/694561-kladbishche-gigantskikh-peshchernykh-lvov-naydeno-v-bashkirii/
Cave Lions can up to 600 kg.

This is about that same issue in english:

http://russia-ic.com/education_science/science_overview/4453/#.XL1ktOgzZPY

I have to say, that when I look at big Kodiak bear weighing around 600 kg and knowing, that it is over 3 meters tall while standing on hind legs and when walking normally, shoulder height still 1,5 meters or even more.

Then I try to figure out an animal with shoulder height 1 meter said to be able to have same weight. And when looking at some ligers weighing 400 kg. I can´t help to get an image in my mind, where is 600 kg cave lion so fat, that it can roll sideways so, that legs not touching ground... :) I am really curious to see when official studies are published and what other scientists say. Now it looks like to be, that this 600 kg is only from Kosintsev. 

I am really curious to see more about this and see if I personally can fit it in common sense some way :)
https://hyperleap.com/topic/American_lion
https://markozen.com/2018/04/11/the-north-american-cave-lion/
https://sites.google.com/site/paleofilescom/prehistoric-world-records-cont-d
http://www.ligerworld.com/liger-vs-great-american-lion.html
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/animalsversesanimals/panthera-leo-atrox-versus-panthera-tigris-soloensi-t2863.html
https://roaring.earth/amazing-big-cats/2/
American Lion is the largest cat.
I don´t even open some tapatalk or other forums, where fanboys of lions and tigers are having their "wars". If you have some good scientific source or article, just put direct link.

But does this mean, that you don´t believe to information you shared earlier about findings in Russia and that those are as big as claimed to be? Those articles about possibly biggest ever cave lions. I mean didn´t they have bigger bones, than American lion fossils?
https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-largest-cat-that-existed-in-the-Pleistocene
https://thereaderwiki.com/en/American_lion
A cat with 500mm+(50 cm+)skull.And I am trying to say''Some cats can up to 600 kg (Or 600kg+)''
Reply

Finland Shadow Offline
Moderator
*****
Moderators

(04-27-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:49 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:26 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 12:36 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 11:53 AM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-21-2019, 05:44 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:54 PM)sanjay Wrote: No Lion Vs Tiger Debate on forum, If you do again, moderator will ban you.
Tagging Mods
@Rishi @peter @tigerluver @GrizzlyClaws
Sorry.
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/
Cave Lions can grow 600 kg.

Please, be aware of the forum rules, and refrain to turn it into another lion vs tiger flamebait.

BTW, the inconsistency of the body mass calculation has been discussed over years, but we take the largest documented fossil records.

The largest Cave lion fossil record should reach the magnitude of 500 kg, and so far it is pretty clear that no American lion fossil or other later Cave lion fossil being larger than this.



*This image is copyright of its original author
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/




http://www.nat-geo.ru/science/694561-kladbishche-gigantskikh-peshchernykh-lvov-naydeno-v-bashkirii/
Cave Lions can up to 600 kg.

This is about that same issue in english:

http://russia-ic.com/education_science/science_overview/4453/#.XL1ktOgzZPY

I have to say, that when I look at big Kodiak bear weighing around 600 kg and knowing, that it is over 3 meters tall while standing on hind legs and when walking normally, shoulder height still 1,5 meters or even more.

Then I try to figure out an animal with shoulder height 1 meter said to be able to have same weight. And when looking at some ligers weighing 400 kg. I can´t help to get an image in my mind, where is 600 kg cave lion so fat, that it can roll sideways so, that legs not touching ground... :) I am really curious to see when official studies are published and what other scientists say. Now it looks like to be, that this 600 kg is only from Kosintsev. 

I am really curious to see more about this and see if I personally can fit it in common sense some way :)
https://hyperleap.com/topic/American_lion
https://markozen.com/2018/04/11/the-north-american-cave-lion/
https://sites.google.com/site/paleofilescom/prehistoric-world-records-cont-d
http://www.ligerworld.com/liger-vs-great-american-lion.html
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/animalsversesanimals/panthera-leo-atrox-versus-panthera-tigris-soloensi-t2863.html
https://roaring.earth/amazing-big-cats/2/
American Lion is the largest cat.
I don´t even open some tapatalk or other forums, where fanboys of lions and tigers are having their "wars". If you have some good scientific source or article, just put direct link.

But does this mean, that you don´t believe to information you shared earlier about findings in Russia and that those are as big as claimed to be? Those articles about possibly biggest ever cave lions. I mean didn´t they have bigger bones, than American lion fossils?
https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-largest-cat-that-existed-in-the-Pleistocene
https://thereaderwiki.com/en/American_lion
A cat with 500mm+(50 cm+)skull.And I am trying to say''Some cats can up to 600 kg (Or 600kg+)''

Well, luckily we have hear some people, like tigerluver, guategojira, grizzlyclaws and some others who are quite familiar with the subject, I find it interesting to see what they might have to say about this. I have noticed, that they have used quite a lot of time to study prehistoric animals.
1 user Likes Shadow's post
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Turkey Arctotherium Offline
Member
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(04-27-2019, 03:12 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:49 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:26 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 12:36 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 11:53 AM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-21-2019, 05:44 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:54 PM)sanjay Wrote: No Lion Vs Tiger Debate on forum, If you do again, moderator will ban you.
Tagging Mods
@Rishi @peter @tigerluver @GrizzlyClaws
Sorry.
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/
Cave Lions can grow 600 kg.

Please, be aware of the forum rules, and refrain to turn it into another lion vs tiger flamebait.

BTW, the inconsistency of the body mass calculation has been discussed over years, but we take the largest documented fossil records.

The largest Cave lion fossil record should reach the magnitude of 500 kg, and so far it is pretty clear that no American lion fossil or other later Cave lion fossil being larger than this.



*This image is copyright of its original author
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/




http://www.nat-geo.ru/science/694561-kladbishche-gigantskikh-peshchernykh-lvov-naydeno-v-bashkirii/
Cave Lions can up to 600 kg.

This is about that same issue in english:

http://russia-ic.com/education_science/science_overview/4453/#.XL1ktOgzZPY

I have to say, that when I look at big Kodiak bear weighing around 600 kg and knowing, that it is over 3 meters tall while standing on hind legs and when walking normally, shoulder height still 1,5 meters or even more.

Then I try to figure out an animal with shoulder height 1 meter said to be able to have same weight. And when looking at some ligers weighing 400 kg. I can´t help to get an image in my mind, where is 600 kg cave lion so fat, that it can roll sideways so, that legs not touching ground... :) I am really curious to see when official studies are published and what other scientists say. Now it looks like to be, that this 600 kg is only from Kosintsev. 

I am really curious to see more about this and see if I personally can fit it in common sense some way :)
https://hyperleap.com/topic/American_lion
https://markozen.com/2018/04/11/the-north-american-cave-lion/
https://sites.google.com/site/paleofilescom/prehistoric-world-records-cont-d
http://www.ligerworld.com/liger-vs-great-american-lion.html
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/animalsversesanimals/panthera-leo-atrox-versus-panthera-tigris-soloensi-t2863.html
https://roaring.earth/amazing-big-cats/2/
American Lion is the largest cat.
I don´t even open some tapatalk or other forums, where fanboys of lions and tigers are having their "wars". If you have some good scientific source or article, just put direct link.

But does this mean, that you don´t believe to information you shared earlier about findings in Russia and that those are as big as claimed to be? Those articles about possibly biggest ever cave lions. I mean didn´t they have bigger bones, than American lion fossils?
https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-largest-cat-that-existed-in-the-Pleistocene
https://thereaderwiki.com/en/American_lion
A cat with 500mm+(50 cm+)skull.And I am trying to say''Some cats can up to 600 kg (Or 600kg+)''

Well, luckily we have hear some people, like tigerluver, guategojira, grizzlyclaws and some others who are quite familiar with the subject, I find it interesting to see what they might have to say about this. I have noticed, that they have used quite a lot of time to study prehistoric animals.
Yes.This guys is masters of their job(Sory for bad English)
Reply

Finland Shadow Offline
Moderator
*****
Moderators
( This post was last modified: 04-27-2019, 09:13 PM by Rishi )

(04-27-2019, 03:39 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:12 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:49 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:26 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 12:36 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 11:53 AM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-21-2019, 05:44 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:54 PM)sanjay Wrote: No Lion Vs Tiger Debate on forum, If you do again, moderator will ban you.
Tagging Mods
@Rishi @peter @tigerluver @GrizzlyClaws
Sorry.
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/
Cave Lions can grow 600 kg.

Please, be aware of the forum rules, and refrain to turn it into another lion vs tiger flamebait.

BTW, the inconsistency of the body mass calculation has been discussed over years, but we take the largest documented fossil records.

The largest Cave lion fossil record should reach the magnitude of 500 kg, and so far it is pretty clear that no American lion fossil or other later Cave lion fossil being larger than this.



*This image is copyright of its original author
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/




http://www.nat-geo.ru/science/694561-kladbishche-gigantskikh-peshchernykh-lvov-naydeno-v-bashkirii/
Cave Lions can up to 600 kg.

This is about that same issue in english:

http://russia-ic.com/education_science/science_overview/4453/#.XL1ktOgzZPY

I have to say, that when I look at big Kodiak bear weighing around 600 kg and knowing, that it is over 3 meters tall while standing on hind legs and when walking normally, shoulder height still 1,5 meters or even more.

Then I try to figure out an animal with shoulder height 1 meter said to be able to have same weight. And when looking at some ligers weighing 400 kg. I can´t help to get an image in my mind, where is 600 kg cave lion so fat, that it can roll sideways so, that legs not touching ground... :) I am really curious to see when official studies are published and what other scientists say. Now it looks like to be, that this 600 kg is only from Kosintsev. 

I am really curious to see more about this and see if I personally can fit it in common sense some way :)
https://hyperleap.com/topic/American_lion
https://markozen.com/2018/04/11/the-north-american-cave-lion/
https://sites.google.com/site/paleofilescom/prehistoric-world-records-cont-d
http://www.ligerworld.com/liger-vs-great-american-lion.html
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/animalsversesanimals/panthera-leo-atrox-versus-panthera-tigris-soloensi-t2863.html
https://roaring.earth/amazing-big-cats/2/
American Lion is the largest cat.
I don´t even open some tapatalk or other forums, where fanboys of lions and tigers are having their "wars". If you have some good scientific source or article, just put direct link.

But does this mean, that you don´t believe to information you shared earlier about findings in Russia and that those are as big as claimed to be? Those articles about possibly biggest ever cave lions. I mean didn´t they have bigger bones, than American lion fossils?
https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-largest-cat-that-existed-in-the-Pleistocene
https://thereaderwiki.com/en/American_lion
A cat with 500mm+(50 cm+)skull.And I am trying to say''Some cats can up to 600 kg (Or 600kg+)''

Well, luckily we have hear some people, like tigerluver, guategojira, grizzlyclaws and some others who are quite familiar with the subject, I find it interesting to see what they might have to say about this. I have noticed, that they have used quite a lot of time to study prehistoric animals.
And I say something.Any cat can kill Equus Giganteus?Maybe American Lion(Power and size)
And American Lion's size is like a bullshit.
470 kg average=680 kg maximum
556 kg average=769 kg maximum

Well, your opinion is clear. I am sorry, but I haven't seen lately any studies backing up what you say.
But I wait with interest, what people here who have more knowledge about this subject have to say about things you claim :)
2 users Like Shadow's post
Reply

Turkey Arctotherium Offline
Member
**

(04-27-2019, 03:47 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:39 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:12 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:49 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:26 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 12:36 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 11:53 AM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-21-2019, 05:44 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote:
(04-20-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote: Sorry.
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/
Cave Lions can grow 600 kg.

Please, be aware of the forum rules, and refrain to turn it into another lion vs tiger flamebait.

BTW, the inconsistency of the body mass calculation has been discussed over years, but we take the largest documented fossil records.

The largest Cave lion fossil record should reach the magnitude of 500 kg, and so far it is pretty clear that no American lion fossil or other later Cave lion fossil being larger than this.



*This image is copyright of its original author
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/




http://www.nat-geo.ru/science/694561-kladbishche-gigantskikh-peshchernykh-lvov-naydeno-v-bashkirii/
Cave Lions can up to 600 kg.

This is about that same issue in english:

http://russia-ic.com/education_science/science_overview/4453/#.XL1ktOgzZPY

I have to say, that when I look at big Kodiak bear weighing around 600 kg and knowing, that it is over 3 meters tall while standing on hind legs and when walking normally, shoulder height still 1,5 meters or even more.

Then I try to figure out an animal with shoulder height 1 meter said to be able to have same weight. And when looking at some ligers weighing 400 kg. I can´t help to get an image in my mind, where is 600 kg cave lion so fat, that it can roll sideways so, that legs not touching ground... :) I am really curious to see when official studies are published and what other scientists say. Now it looks like to be, that this 600 kg is only from Kosintsev. 

I am really curious to see more about this and see if I personally can fit it in common sense some way :)
https://hyperleap.com/topic/American_lion
https://markozen.com/2018/04/11/the-north-american-cave-lion/
https://sites.google.com/site/paleofilescom/prehistoric-world-records-cont-d
http://www.ligerworld.com/liger-vs-great-american-lion.html
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/animalsversesanimals/panthera-leo-atrox-versus-panthera-tigris-soloensi-t2863.html
https://roaring.earth/amazing-big-cats/2/
American Lion is the largest cat.
I don´t even open some tapatalk or other forums, where fanboys of lions and tigers are having their "wars". If you have some good scientific source or article, just put direct link.

But does this mean, that you don´t believe to information you shared earlier about findings in Russia and that those are as big as claimed to be? Those articles about possibly biggest ever cave lions. I mean didn´t they have bigger bones, than American lion fossils?
https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-largest-cat-that-existed-in-the-Pleistocene
https://thereaderwiki.com/en/American_lion
A cat with 500mm+(50 cm+)skull.And I am trying to say''Some cats can up to 600 kg (Or 600kg+)''

Well, luckily we have hear some people, like tigerluver, guategojira, grizzlyclaws and some others who are quite familiar with the subject, I find it interesting to see what they might have to say about this. I have noticed, that they have used quite a lot of time to study prehistoric animals.
And I say something.Any cat can kill Equus Giganteus?Maybe American Lion(Power and size)
And American Lion's size is like a bullshit.
470 kg average=680 kg maximum
556 kg average=769 kg maximum

Well, your opinion is clear. I am sorry, but I can´t take what you say too seriously. I haven´t seen lately any studies backing up what you say. But I wait with interest, what people here who have more knowledge about this subject have to say about things you claim :)
American Lion is not 556 kg.Newest estimate of American Lion=523 kg.
You think 2009's study was true.
Reply

Finland Shadow Offline
Moderator
*****
Moderators

(04-27-2019, 03:50 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:47 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:39 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:12 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:49 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:26 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 12:36 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 11:53 AM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-21-2019, 05:44 AM)GrizzlyClaws Wrote: Please, be aware of the forum rules, and refrain to turn it into another lion vs tiger flamebait.

BTW, the inconsistency of the body mass calculation has been discussed over years, but we take the largest documented fossil records.

The largest Cave lion fossil record should reach the magnitude of 500 kg, and so far it is pretty clear that no American lion fossil or other later Cave lion fossil being larger than this.



*This image is copyright of its original author
https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/




http://www.nat-geo.ru/science/694561-kladbishche-gigantskikh-peshchernykh-lvov-naydeno-v-bashkirii/
Cave Lions can up to 600 kg.

This is about that same issue in english:

http://russia-ic.com/education_science/science_overview/4453/#.XL1ktOgzZPY

I have to say, that when I look at big Kodiak bear weighing around 600 kg and knowing, that it is over 3 meters tall while standing on hind legs and when walking normally, shoulder height still 1,5 meters or even more.

Then I try to figure out an animal with shoulder height 1 meter said to be able to have same weight. And when looking at some ligers weighing 400 kg. I can´t help to get an image in my mind, where is 600 kg cave lion so fat, that it can roll sideways so, that legs not touching ground... :) I am really curious to see when official studies are published and what other scientists say. Now it looks like to be, that this 600 kg is only from Kosintsev. 

I am really curious to see more about this and see if I personally can fit it in common sense some way :)
https://hyperleap.com/topic/American_lion
https://markozen.com/2018/04/11/the-north-american-cave-lion/
https://sites.google.com/site/paleofilescom/prehistoric-world-records-cont-d
http://www.ligerworld.com/liger-vs-great-american-lion.html
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/animalsversesanimals/panthera-leo-atrox-versus-panthera-tigris-soloensi-t2863.html
https://roaring.earth/amazing-big-cats/2/
American Lion is the largest cat.
I don´t even open some tapatalk or other forums, where fanboys of lions and tigers are having their "wars". If you have some good scientific source or article, just put direct link.

But does this mean, that you don´t believe to information you shared earlier about findings in Russia and that those are as big as claimed to be? Those articles about possibly biggest ever cave lions. I mean didn´t they have bigger bones, than American lion fossils?
https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-largest-cat-that-existed-in-the-Pleistocene
https://thereaderwiki.com/en/American_lion
A cat with 500mm+(50 cm+)skull.And I am trying to say''Some cats can up to 600 kg (Or 600kg+)''

Well, luckily we have hear some people, like tigerluver, guategojira, grizzlyclaws and some others who are quite familiar with the subject, I find it interesting to see what they might have to say about this. I have noticed, that they have used quite a lot of time to study prehistoric animals.
And I say something.Any cat can kill Equus Giganteus?Maybe American Lion(Power and size)
And American Lion's size is like a bullshit.
470 kg average=680 kg maximum
556 kg average=769 kg maximum

Well, your opinion is clear. I am sorry, but I can´t take what you say too seriously. I haven´t seen lately any studies backing up what you say. But I wait with interest, what people here who have more knowledge about this subject have to say about things you claim :)
American Lion is not 556 kg.Newest estimate of American Lion=523 kg.
You think 2009's study was true.

Just look at posting #1062 in this thread from guate. Quite different kind of information. If that helps you understand why your information isn´t taken just like so seriously. You write about average weights which are over estimations of biggest possible when looking other sources.

And you don´t even have any study to show as source for your information.
1 user Likes Shadow's post
Reply

Turkey Arctotherium Offline
Member
**

(04-27-2019, 04:45 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:50 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:47 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:39 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:12 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:49 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:26 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 12:36 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 11:53 AM)Arctotherium Wrote: https://www.nakanune.ru/news/2017/08/29/22480970/




http://www.nat-geo.ru/science/694561-kladbishche-gigantskikh-peshchernykh-lvov-naydeno-v-bashkirii/
Cave Lions can up to 600 kg.

This is about that same issue in english:

http://russia-ic.com/education_science/science_overview/4453/#.XL1ktOgzZPY

I have to say, that when I look at big Kodiak bear weighing around 600 kg and knowing, that it is over 3 meters tall while standing on hind legs and when walking normally, shoulder height still 1,5 meters or even more.

Then I try to figure out an animal with shoulder height 1 meter said to be able to have same weight. And when looking at some ligers weighing 400 kg. I can´t help to get an image in my mind, where is 600 kg cave lion so fat, that it can roll sideways so, that legs not touching ground... :) I am really curious to see when official studies are published and what other scientists say. Now it looks like to be, that this 600 kg is only from Kosintsev. 

I am really curious to see more about this and see if I personally can fit it in common sense some way :)
https://hyperleap.com/topic/American_lion
https://markozen.com/2018/04/11/the-north-american-cave-lion/
https://sites.google.com/site/paleofilescom/prehistoric-world-records-cont-d
http://www.ligerworld.com/liger-vs-great-american-lion.html
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/animalsversesanimals/panthera-leo-atrox-versus-panthera-tigris-soloensi-t2863.html
https://roaring.earth/amazing-big-cats/2/
American Lion is the largest cat.
I don´t even open some tapatalk or other forums, where fanboys of lions and tigers are having their "wars". If you have some good scientific source or article, just put direct link.

But does this mean, that you don´t believe to information you shared earlier about findings in Russia and that those are as big as claimed to be? Those articles about possibly biggest ever cave lions. I mean didn´t they have bigger bones, than American lion fossils?
https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-largest-cat-that-existed-in-the-Pleistocene
https://thereaderwiki.com/en/American_lion
A cat with 500mm+(50 cm+)skull.And I am trying to say''Some cats can up to 600 kg (Or 600kg+)''

Well, luckily we have hear some people, like tigerluver, guategojira, grizzlyclaws and some others who are quite familiar with the subject, I find it interesting to see what they might have to say about this. I have noticed, that they have used quite a lot of time to study prehistoric animals.
And I say something.Any cat can kill Equus Giganteus?Maybe American Lion(Power and size)
And American Lion's size is like a bullshit.
470 kg average=680 kg maximum
556 kg average=769 kg maximum

Well, your opinion is clear. I am sorry, but I can´t take what you say too seriously. I haven´t seen lately any studies backing up what you say. But I wait with interest, what people here who have more knowledge about this subject have to say about things you claim :)
American Lion is not 556 kg.Newest estimate of American Lion=523 kg.
You think 2009's study was true.

Just look at posting #1062 in this thread from guate. Quite different kind of information. If that helps you understand why your information isn´t taken just like so seriously. You write about average weights which are over estimations of biggest possible when looking other sources.

And you don´t even have any study to show as source for your information.
http://www.tarpits.org/sites/default/files/pdfs/DeSantis%20et%20al%20-%202012-%20IMPLICATIONS%20OF%20DIET%20FOR%20THE%20EXTINCTION%20OF%20SABER-TOOTHED%20CATS%20AND%20AMERICAN%20LIONS%20%20-%20PLOSone.pdf
I say American Lion's average was 523 kg?Is that a bear or cat?
1 user Likes Arctotherium's post
Reply

Finland Shadow Offline
Moderator
*****
Moderators

(04-27-2019, 05:10 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 04:45 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:50 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:47 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:39 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 03:12 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 02:55 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:49 PM)Shadow Wrote:
(04-27-2019, 12:26 PM)Arctotherium Wrote:
(04-22-2019, 12:36 PM)Shadow Wrote: This is about that same issue in english:

http://russia-ic.com/education_science/science_overview/4453/#.XL1ktOgzZPY

I have to say, that when I look at big Kodiak bear weighing around 600 kg and knowing, that it is over 3 meters tall while standing on hind legs and when walking normally, shoulder height still 1,5 meters or even more.

Then I try to figure out an animal with shoulder height 1 meter said to be able to have same weight. And when looking at some ligers weighing 400 kg. I can´t help to get an image in my mind, where is 600 kg cave lion so fat, that it can roll sideways so, that legs not touching ground... :) I am really curious to see when official studies are published and what other scientists say. Now it looks like to be, that this 600 kg is only from Kosintsev. 

I am really curious to see more about this and see if I personally can fit it in common sense some way :)
https://hyperleap.com/topic/American_lion
https://markozen.com/2018/04/11/the-north-american-cave-lion/
https://sites.google.com/site/paleofilescom/prehistoric-world-records-cont-d
http://www.ligerworld.com/liger-vs-great-american-lion.html
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/animalsversesanimals/panthera-leo-atrox-versus-panthera-tigris-soloensi-t2863.html
https://roaring.earth/amazing-big-cats/2/
American Lion is the largest cat.
I don´t even open some tapatalk or other forums, where fanboys of lions and tigers are having their "wars". If you have some good scientific source or article, just put direct link.

But does this mean, that you don´t believe to information you shared earlier about findings in Russia and that those are as big as claimed to be? Those articles about possibly biggest ever cave lions. I mean didn´t they have bigger bones, than American lion fossils?
https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-largest-cat-that-existed-in-the-Pleistocene
https://thereaderwiki.com/en/American_lion
A cat with 500mm+(50 cm+)skull.And I am trying to say''Some cats can up to 600 kg (Or 600kg+)''

Well, luckily we have hear some people, like tigerluver, guategojira, grizzlyclaws and some others who are quite familiar with the subject, I find it interesting to see what they might have to say about this. I have noticed, that they have used quite a lot of time to study prehistoric animals.
And I say something.Any cat can kill Equus Giganteus?Maybe American Lion(Power and size)
And American Lion's size is like a bullshit.
470 kg average=680 kg maximum
556 kg average=769 kg maximum

Well, your opinion is clear. I am sorry, but I can´t take what you say too seriously. I haven´t seen lately any studies backing up what you say. But I wait with interest, what people here who have more knowledge about this subject have to say about things you claim :)
American Lion is not 556 kg.Newest estimate of American Lion=523 kg.
You think 2009's study was true.

Just look at posting #1062 in this thread from guate. Quite different kind of information. If that helps you understand why your information isn´t taken just like so seriously. You write about average weights which are over estimations of biggest possible when looking other sources.

And you don´t even have any study to show as source for your information.
http://www.tarpits.org/sites/default/files/pdfs/DeSantis%20et%20al%20-%202012-%20IMPLICATIONS%20OF%20DIET%20FOR%20THE%20EXTINCTION%20OF%20SABER-TOOTHED%20CATS%20AND%20AMERICAN%20LIONS%20%20-%20PLOSone.pdf
I say American Lion's average was 523 kg?Is that a bear or cat?
Are you asking from me what you are saying? Here is quote from your earlier posting:

"And I say something.Any cat can kill Equus Giganteus?Maybe American Lion(Power and size)
And American Lion's size is like a bullshit.
470 kg average=680 kg maximum
556 kg average=769 kg maximum"

So what do you think, do you say that American lion is in average 556 kg which you then changed to 523 kg?

But if you ask from me, yes, I understood it so that you say, that average weight of American lions was 523 kg.

This is quote from that link you shared about tar pits:
" Despite P. atrox’s large size (estimates range from 235 to 523 kg in males and 175 to 365 kg in females, the second largest carnivoran at La Brea second only to the short-faced bear Arctodus simus) [9,43] and status as a conspecific of P. leo, its carcass utilization was evidently more like that of the cheetah."

There it is, estimates range between 235 to 523 kg. And you write, that American lion is 523 kg, looks like cherry picking to me.

But to keep this simple I ask two things from you. 1. What do you think, that was average weight of American lion? 2. What do you think, that was maximum weight of it?
Answer to those and then here shouldn´t be misunderstandings if you feel, that now there are some.
Reply

P.T.Sondaica Offline
Regular Member
***

American lion is 760 kg ?? Lol..please data
1 user Likes P.T.Sondaica's post
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