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Crocodile and Big cats Interaction
Crocodile and Big cats Interaction
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Crocodile and Big cats Interaction
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 (10-19-2020, 12:28 PM)TheSmok Wrote:(10-19-2020, 11:17 AM)Shadow Wrote: Well, Machli was a tigress, so quite a lot smaller than male lions. So while Machli killed a crocodile estimated to be 12 ft, 14 ft means only half a meter more, while male lion is roughly 1,5-2 times bigger than a tigress. So I really don´t see anything extraordinary in it, that a lion kills a crocodile around 4 meters long.A 14-foot crocodile is on average 2 times heavier than a 12-foot crocodile and about 1/3 heavier than a 13 foot one. I would not be so skeptical if Bumi lions were adult males, but they are young ones, hardly so much larger than the adult tigress. I was in hurry earlier, but now when a bit more time, I have to say, that I find that "three lions at once" and then that 1897 story of a crocodiles and lion encounters something, what I have never taken too seriously. Just because when comparing those cases to modern ones and to filmed footage, not too realistic stories. Even though crocodiles are formidable. But in "good old days" some people seemed to like to write good stories, there are some others too. But naturally some lions have died because of crocodiles during time, claiming something else would be unrealistic. Still when reading some stories from past I have gotten some comical moments, when reading and thinking, that has this person writing been serious? 
This was shared a few weeks ago to a story on YouTube, a group of lionesses crossing a river when one was intercepted by a crocodile, there is brief brawl between them and the lioness pushes the crocodile away and reaches the other side with no major visible injuries. This is the second time I've seen a lion tackle a Nile crocodile in deep water, very impressive.
 *This image is copyright of its original author Source 
This is exceptional video. Cheetah are most unfortunate predator in Africa,
Lions, Leopards, Wild Dogs, Hyenas, Crocs... all can kill them. 
Lioness catching a young crocodile at the Chobe River...
" Incredible video of a lioness killing a crocodile along the river bank. Then the rest of the pride comes to eat and the lioness that killed the crocodile doesn't want to share. "
Leopard with Crocodile kill.
"December 3, 2016. Road above Borupanwila in Wilpattu. After lunch our safari driver Ajith told us to go for a walk without resting so we started our journey in the jeep. Ajith said that there was a tiger parked on the road above Borupanwila but we could not see anything. At the same time, the tiger ran across the road and jumped to the other side unimaginably fast. Disappointed, we put our cameras on the seats and stared at the empty road. At the same time, the tiger was dragged by the neck of a huge crocodile and came running across the road again."  *This image is copyright of its original author link: https://www.facebook.com/groups/Wild.Wilpatthu/permalink/2429979577104089  I asked her if she knew of any interaction's between Tigers and Muggers/Gharial in Chitwan and her response "I have! I've been told of an incident in 1992 (I think) where a tiger killed a small adult female gharial. Femal gharial guarding hatchlings in our remote camera footage respond to Tigers defensively, sort of 'squaring up' to them, so they're presumably seen as a threat by the gharial. I haven't heard of any mugger-tiger interactions, but it's so hard to make those sort of observations, they no doubt occur." (02-13-2021, 10:45 AM)Styx38 Wrote: Leopard with Crocodile kill. This was not a kill, it was posted originally here and according to OP the encounter lasted 1.5 hours, in which the crocodile ended up prevailing:  *This image is copyright of its original author
(02-17-2021, 12:27 AM)Balam Wrote:(02-13-2021, 10:45 AM)Styx38 Wrote: Leopard with Crocodile kill. The only mention of the Crocodile escaping was from that Chinese Forum. When I saw the facebook posts for the actual Sri Lankan poster, I did not find any mention of the Crocodile escaping. They were amazed at a unique photo of a Leopard catching a Crocodile, and the main poster was whining that he did not send it to Nat Geo due to thinking it was an amateur photo.  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author
(02-17-2021, 02:05 AM)Styx38 Wrote:(02-17-2021, 12:27 AM)Balam Wrote:(02-13-2021, 10:45 AM)Styx38 Wrote: Leopard with Crocodile kill. Quote:The only mention of the Crocodile escaping was from that Chinese Forum. The "Chinese site" had a post on the interaction dating back to 2017, the Facebook post was made in 2020, in the 2017 post the name of the guide is mentioned and later corroborated by the Facebook post, so it wasn't any random post, not to mention that in the 2017 post the picture included is that of the actual camera showing the shot in it. Quote:When I saw the facebook posts for the actual Sri Lankan poster, I did not find any mention of the Crocodile escaping. And in the Facebook post there is no mention of the leopard killing the crocodile either:  *This image is copyright of its original author The translation is rough, but it could be applied that the crocodile returned to the scene later on, no mention of successful predation or kill is specified here. What is specified is that they could not focus clearly on the scene, so any derived conclusion of the leopard killing the crocodile would be false. Quote:They were amazed at a unique photo of a Leopard catching a Crocodile, and the main poster was whining that he did not send it to Nat Geo due to thinking it was an amateur photo. I scrolled through the comments as well, nowhere in there does the photographer states that the leopard killed the crocodile, other commenters unrelated to the scene are the ones doing that. He states that it wouldn't have been the first case a leopard would have hunted a crocodile without stating that that specific situation ended up with the crocodile dead, it is likely he wanted to say "attempted to hunt a crocodile". In fact, in your last screenshot he clearly said that the scene was not fully captured, so to look at that and arrive at the conclusion that the leopard killed the crocodile is dishonest.  Quote:The "Chinese site" had a post on the interaction dating back to 2017, the Facebook post was made in 2020, in the 2017 post the name of the guide is mentioned and later corroborated by the Facebook post, so it wasn't any random post, not to mention that in the 2017 post the picture included is that of the actual camera showing the shot in it. The Facebook post is basically an account back from 3 December 2016 hence the uploader shared the date. It's also worth mentioning that the Chinese post appears to be from a random poster whereas the Facebook one is from a person who witnessed this encounter. Quote:And in the Facebook post there is no mention of the leopard killing the crocodile either: The translation says nothing about the crocodile returning afterwards unless you believe they sat there for 1,5 hours on an empty road? "Ajith said that there was a tiger parked on the road above Borupanwila but we could not see anything. At the same time, the tiger ran across the road and jumped to the other side as fast as we could imagine. Disappointed, we put our cameras on the seats and stared at the empty road. At the same time, the tiger was dragged by the neck of a huge crocodile and ran across the road again." It turns out they were aware of a leopard nearby but couldn't see it. Then all of a sudden it crosses the road and returns with a crocodile hanging in its jaws. You have the right to believe it still managed to escape after 1,5 hours but based on the account and two photos (notice the two photos are not the same), chances are the crocodile didn't survive. The fact that the leopard didn't even subdue it but rather grabbed it tells me the crocodile got overpowered immediately. I also don't think either the leopard or crocodile can fight each other for 1,5 hours nor do I believe they stayed this long on the scene. Quote:The Facebook post is basically an account back from 3 December 2016 hence the uploader shared the date. It's also worth mentioning that the Chinese post appears to be from a random poster whereas the Facebook one is from a person who witnessed this encounter.The Facebook post was made in the year 2020, the account took place in 2016, closer to the date of 2017 which was shared on the Chinese forum, which was not by a random commenter since the name of the guide was, once again, mentioned in that post too, alluding that the photographer had likely made the post there first before sharing on Facebook. Quote:The translation says nothing about the crocodile returning afterwards unless you believe they sat there for 1,5 hours on an empty road? The translation states with clarity that the crocodile returned later on, since safaris can last hours it is not unlikely that they waited for a long time in the area to see if they could continue witnessing the event. Since the initial post from 2017 mentions that timeframe, whereas nowhere is it mentioned that the crocodile was killed, we have more reasons to believe that was the case. Quote:You have the right to believe it still managed to escape after 1,5 hours but based on the account and two photos (notice the two photos are not the same), chances are the crocodile didn't survive.I'm not believing anything that wasn't shared before on the encounter likely by the photographer himself, the ones believing things that were never said are the ones claiming the crocodile died, perhaps try not to project. Quote:The fact that the leopard didn't even subdue it but rather grabbed it tells me the crocodile got overpowered immediately. I also don't think either the leopard or crocodile can fight each other for 1,5 hours nor do I believe they stayed this long on the scene.You have no evidence to suggest that the large crocodile was "quickly" overpowered, that is a wild guess coming from a biased perspective. The crocodile was clearly in a disadvantageous position from the beginning, it was inland which allowed the leopard to get a hold of it from the back as that was the easiest point to try to kill the crocodile. The crocodile is clearly fighting back throughout the whole process, which ended up in it coming victorious in the end. Seeing as though the crocodile was considerably larger than the sizes leopards tackle, it is unlikely that it had any major injuries in the end, baring dehydration and stress caused by the area it was in. Rather than a fight this was more a failed hunting attempt on a crocodilian that was outside the range for the leopard to kill. Quote:The Facebook post was made in the year 2020, the account took place in 2016, closer to the date of 2017 which was shared on the Chinese forum, which was not by a random commenter since the name of the guide was, once again, mentioned in that post too, alluding that the photographer had likely made the post there first before sharing on Facebook. And how do you know for sure the post wasn't just copy paste? Once again we have a poster on a Chinese forum and on the other hand we have a native witness who kindly shared a photo of his experience back in 2016. Quote:The translation states with clarity that the crocodile returned later on, since safaris can last hours it is not unlikely that they waited for a long time in the area to see if they could continue witnessing the event. Since the initial post from 2017 mentions that timeframe, whereas nowhere is it mentioned that the crocodile was killed, we have more reasons to believe that was the case. The crocodile did not return... You're basing this off the translation button you used on Facebook. Here's the translation once again: "Ajith said that there was a tiger parked on the road above Borupanwila but we could not see anything. At the same time, the tiger ran across the road and jumped to the other side as fast as we could imagine. Disappointed, we put our cameras on the seats and stared at the empty road. At the same time, the tiger was dragged by the neck of a huge crocodile and ran across the road again." Quote:You have no evidence to suggest that the large crocodile was "quickly" overpowered, that is a wild guess coming from a biased perspective. It appeared to be overpowered based on the account with the right translation in combination with the photographs. This has nothing to do with bias. The account and photos clearly state the leopard rushed out of nowhere across the road and returned with a crocodile hanging in its jaws. I don't know about you, but that tells me it overpowered the crocodile. Otherwise it wouldn't be able to drag it back from where it came, it would've been struggling at the place they engaged. Quote:The crocodile was clearly in a disadvantageous position from the beginning, it was inland which allowed the leopard to get a hold of it from the back as that was the easiest point to try to kill the crocodile. This is pretty ignorant to be honest. I have no evidence to suggest it managed to overpower the crocodile based on the account and photos but you can somehow conclude it was in an disadvantageous position? So you're 100% there are no ponds, lakes, rivers etc present nearby? That this was a mugger crocodile that got lost? No you cannot. Quote:The crocodile is clearly fighting back throughout the whole process, which ended up in it coming victorious in the end. It's not fighting back because it can't do anything at this point. At best it's struggling but so does every animal when it's being predated on. You're looking at a crocodile that's being killed by a leopard via suffocation, at least that's what it looks like. Quote:Seeing as though the crocodile was considerably larger than the sizes leopards tackle, it is unlikely that it had any major injuries in the end, baring dehydration and stress caused by the area it was in. Rather than a fight this was more a failed hunting attempt on a crocodilian that was outside the range for the leopard to kill. Leopards have attacked/killed crocodiles of similar size before. I can post evidence if you desire. It's once again ignorant of you to think that it won't have any major injuries since you don't even know if it survived in the first place. The leopard is holding the crocodile in its jaws for Christ sake, the odds are in favour of the leopard this time wether you like it or not. But then again you believe that leopards can only kill crocodiles that are either dehydrated or young ones for whatever reason. Quote:And how do you know for sure the post wasn't just copy paste? Once again we have a poster on a Chinese forum and on the other hand we have a native witness who kindly shared a photo of his experience back in 2016. What does the post being a copy has anything to do with its authenticity? The post described the name on the guide and later shared a picture of the interaction coming from the camera itself. Whether it was initially posted on a different site and later pasted to a different one is irrelevant, the point is that the event was described there as well. You don't know if whoever made the post there was not a different tourist on the same safari who "kindly" chose to share it on that platform as well. What you're doing is trying to dismiss one of the claims of the event by someone who witnessed it because it doesn't suit your biases. Quote:The crocodile did not return... You're basing this off the translation button you used on Facebook. Here's the translation once again: I'm sorry is this supposed to be a valid argument? Facebook uses its own translation tool, which for a company its size I would assume would have to be very refined. Do you speak Sinhala to corroborate that the translation was erroneous? (I remember you liking posts that were questioning my understanding of Portuguese so perhaps you can elaborate on your multilingual abilities) Or are you simply adjusting it to better suit you? Not to mention on that second translation there is no mention of the leopard killing the crocodile which was the initial claim made. Quote:It appeared to be overpowered based on the account with the right translation in combination with the photographs. This has nothing to do with bias. The account and photos clearly state the leopard rushed out of nowhere across the road and returned with a crocodile hanging in its jaws. I don't know about you, but that tells me it overpowered the crocodile. Otherwise it wouldn't be able to drag it back from where it came, it would've been struggling at the place they engaged. You can choose to see it as overpowering, that is your personal interpretation. That, however, was not mentioned in any of the posts. In order for the crocodile to have been overpowered the leopard would have killed it quickly, and since it failed to do so it could also be inferred that the crocodile fought throughout the way and the leopard simply could not subdue it or restrain it to cause enough damage and hold onto it until it died. That's far from overpowering in my view. Quote:This is pretty ignorant to be honest. I have no evidence to suggest it managed to overpower the crocodile based on the account and photos but you can somehow conclude it was in an disadvantageous position? So you're 100% there are no ponds, lakes, rivers etc present nearby? That this was a mugger crocodile that got lost? No you cannot. Do you even read what you say before posting? I don't have to be a genius to know that inland is not the most suitable habitat for a crocodilian, there is a reason why their bodies have the dimensions that they have, they are adapted to an aquatic environment. Whether there were ponds or lakes around is irrelevant, the crocodile was on land and the leopard took its chance because it (the crocodile) was in a disadvantageous position. This is common sense. Quote:It's not fighting back because it can't do anything at this point. At best it's struggling but so does every animal when it's being predated on. You're looking at a crocodile that's being killed by a leopard via suffocation, at least that's what it looks like. If it's not doing much is because it is not in its prime habitat, as mentioned before (thanks for proving my point), nonetheless the picture clearly shows the crocodile swirling its neck to the size, a clear sign that it was trying to unhook the leopard from its neck, that is fighting back, and clearly it worked because no kill was made at the end. Quote:Leopards have attacked/killed crocodiles of similar size before. I can post evidence if you desire. I think you know very well that nothing you post here concerning leopard-crocodile interactions will be news to me. Most of the time the crocodiles killed by leopards represent opportunistic kills yes, you let your bias cloud your judgment sometimes and take issue when others view these feats by leopards with a more objective point of view. For crocodiles killed that are closer to the size of leopards (one case in Africa and another, different, alleged case in Sri Lanka) the crocodile is always inland, and with the African case, the desertic and dry terrain leads us to suggest that the crocodile was dehydrated and emaciated, this is very much common sense. All other kills are of crocodiles much smaller than the leopard, which is to be expected since size differences are crucial in interspecific killings. The point being, the leopard did not kill the crocodile as it was alleged in the post above, there's not much else to discuss.
The reason why we don't see much of crocs killing lions is because it happens in the water compared to finding carcasses on land which is way easier. So crocs shouldn't be underrated especially niles , Muggers, black caiman and salties.
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