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Bears as Predators ~

India brotherbear Offline
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(07-22-2016, 11:16 PM)Pckts Wrote: It's stated in the accounts, It was probably done as human misinterpretation.


The hypothesis can be one of two options

1. The bear was outmatched if the bull had its horns.
2. They thought the bear would be outmatched if the bull had it's horns and were mistaken.

Perhaps some of the bull owners had the horns removed simply for the safety of people tending it. Some ranchers/farmers do so to this day. I don't believe that this idea was widespread among those fighting in these 'games' or at least not in the battles I have read about. 
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United States Pckts Offline
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It's possible, what ever the reason, one thing is for sure. The capabilities of a Bear are impressive, being able to take on a Spanish fighting bull is quite the feat, same for the bull, taking on a big grizzly also shows its capabilities as well. 
It also shows what a wild life does for a predator/omnivore.... I truly believe a captive bear would have little hope of taking on a SPB, only a wild one, with experience taking on horned prey would be able to do so.
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
-Oscar Wilde
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India brotherbear Offline
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Continued from post #135...
In the meantime, the bear, lying on his back, held the bull's nose between his teeth, and embraced him round the neck with his fore-paws, while the bull made the most of his opportunities in stamping on the bear with his hind-feet. At last the General  became exasperated at such treatment, and shook the bull savagely by the nose, when a promiscuous scuffle ensued, which resulted in the bear throwing his antagonist to the ground with his fore-paws. 
For this feat the bear was cheered immensely, and it was thought that, having the bull down, he would make short work of him; but... neither the bear's teeth nor his long claws seemed to have much effect on the hide of the bull, who soon regained his feet, and, disengaging himself, retired to the other side of the ring, while the bear again crouched down in his hole. 
Neither of them seemed to be very much the worse of the encounter, excepting that the bull's nose had a ragged and bloody appearance; but after standing a few minutes, steadily eyeing the General, he made another rush at him. Again poor bruin's ribs resounded, but again he took the bull's nose into chancery... The bull, however, qyickly disengaged himself, and was making off, when the General, not wishing to part with him so soon, seized his hind-foot between his teeth, and, holding on by his paws as well, was thus dragged round the ring before he quitted his hold.
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India brotherbear Offline
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(07-23-2016, 12:29 AM)Pckts Wrote: It's possible, what ever the reason, one thing is for sure. The capabilities of a Bear are impressive, being able to take on a Spanish fighting bull is quite the feat, same for the bull, taking on a big grizzly also shows its capabilities as well. 
It also shows what a wild life does for a predator/omnivore.... I truly believe a captive bear would have little hope of taking on a SPB, only a wild one, with experience taking on horned prey would be able to do so.

I agree. Those grizzlies, before being captured, preyed regularly on feral range cattle. As mention in an earlier post, they likely, in the custom of the grizzly, sought out calves. But in doing so, there would be the inevitable occasional face-off with a cow and, probably more rarely, a bull. Without this prior experiance in killing cattle, the Spanish Bull would certainly have the upper hand.
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United States Polar Offline
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Based on the accounts, I would definitely believe that the bears would often take the bulls (of any kind) down more than half-the-time, whether with or without horns.
"Be the reason someone smiles. Be the reason someone feels loved and believes in the goodness in people."

- Roy T. Bennett
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United States Pckts Offline
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The accounts suggest that the bear won more than the bull, but the bull won as well, so the outcome was certainly not set. Like with all animals, the outcome between two evenly matched (or closely) individuals usually comes down to specific individual characteristics. That's why some bears earned the a specific nickname and some bulls did as well.
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
-Oscar Wilde
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United States Pckts Offline
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Black Bear and Bison Encounter



"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
-Oscar Wilde
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United States Polar Offline
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Polar bear hunts a walrus and another of his kind tries to take the kill from him: a usual day.




"Be the reason someone smiles. Be the reason someone feels loved and believes in the goodness in people."

- Roy T. Bennett
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United States Pckts Offline
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I wonder if the high level of competition is due to the fact that bears habitat is shrinking so they are forced to live in close quarters or that they congregate together when large number of walrus are around.
Either way, so impressive that they hunt walrus.
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
-Oscar Wilde
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India brotherbear Offline
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Continued from post #138...( skipping a few rounds ).
In the next round both parties fought more savagely than ever, and the advantage was rather in favour of the bear: the bull seemed to be quite used up, and to have lost all chance of victory.
The conductor of the performances then mounted the barrier, and, addressing the crowd, asked them if the bull had not had fair play, which was unanimously allowed. He then stated that he knew there was not a bull in California which the General could not whip, and that for two hundred dollars he would let in the other bull, and the three should fight it out till one or all were killed.
This proposal was received with loud cheers, and two or three men going round with hats soon collected, in voluntary contribution, the required amount. The people were intensely excited and delighted with the sport, and double the sum would have been just as quickly raised to insure a continuance of the scene. A man sitting next to me, who was a connoisseur in bear-fights, and passionately fond of the amusement, informed me that this was "the finest fight every fit in the country."
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India brotherbear Offline
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Continued from post #145...
The second bull was equally handsome as the first, and in as good condition. On entering the arena, and looking around him, he seemed to understand the state of affairs at once. Glancing from the bear lying on the ground to the other bull standing at the opposite side of the ring, with drooping head and bloody nose, he seemed to divine at once that the bear was their common enemy, and rushed at him full tilt. The bear as usual, pinned him by the nose; but this bull did not take such treatment so quietly as the other: struggling violently, he soon freed himself, and, wheeling around as he did so, he caught the bear on the hind-quarters and knocked him over; while the other bull, who had been quietly watching the proceedings, thought this a good opportunity to pitch in also, and rushing up, he gave the bear a dig in the ribs on the other side before he had time to recover himself. The poor General between the two did not know what to do, but struck out blindly with his fore-paws with such a suppliant pitiable look that I thought this the most disgusting part of the whole exhibition.
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India brotherbear Offline
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Continued from post #146...
After another round or two with the fresh bull, it was evident that he was no match for the bear, and it was agreed to conclude the performances. The bulls were then shot to put them out of pain, and the company dispersed, all apparently satisfied that it had been a very splendid fight...
I took a sketch of the General the day after the battle. He was in the middle of the now deserted arena, and was in a particularly savage humour. He seemed to consider my intrusion on his solitude as a personal insult, for he growled most savagely, and stormed, about in his cage, even pulling at the iron bars in his efforts to get out... I lighted my pipe, and waited till he should quiet down into an attitude, which he soon did, though very sulkily, when he saw that he could not help himself. 
He did not seem to be much the worse of the battle, having but one wound, and that appeared to be only skin deep. ( Borthwick, 1857 ).
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Switzerland Spalea Offline
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How did this biased (bear's leg tied) fights, at last, end ? Who was the great man by acting these barbaric practices as illegal that prohibited them ?
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India brotherbear Offline
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(07-23-2016, 03:16 PM)Spalea Wrote: How did this biased (bear's leg tied) fights, at last, end ? Who was the great man by acting these barbaric practices as illegal that prohibited them ?

That's coming soon. 
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United States Polar Offline
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I am a bit confused as to what the accounts mean by "General". Do they mean the bear's name or the fight coordinator (a human)?
"Be the reason someone smiles. Be the reason someone feels loved and believes in the goodness in people."

- Roy T. Bennett
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