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Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage
Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage
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Avoca Male Lions and Their Male Lineage
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2/2 Southern avocas with plain camp pride.
 *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author
 (12-28-2022, 05:06 PM)Tr1x24 Wrote: Blondie and DM where not sired by same males, as each of them are copy of 2 Avoca/Giraffes, so its very unlikely they are littermates. A lioness can carry the offspring of different males in the same litter. It's theoretically possible to have 4 cubs with 4 different fathers in the same litter. DNA tests aren't done so it's unknown how often that happens. Speaking of DNA tests, it's IMPOSSIBLE to determine paternity based solely on looks. Especially when the potential fathers are closely related. If unrelated lions still look so much alike that we often have to resort to whisker patterns to tell them apart, then there's no way we can determine with accuracy which brother/cousin is the father based on face shape, etc. The results of that "method" are 100% speculation and nothing more. There is nothing at all wrong with speculating. It can be fun. But one person's speculation carries no more weight than another's.
Mohawk. He wasn't with the pride when this was posted several hours ago but saw a recent comment from the uploader that stated he was headed towards them.
Throwback image of dominant giraffe male, El Brutus, father of Sabi sands 5 avocas , in 2018
 *This image is copyright of its original author
I know there is no way to know who sired whom but when I first saw the above picture I thought it was a throwback of DM. They looked exactly alike.
Since the Black Dam males have same Avoca bloodline as the 5 other Avoca males, so can we use this thread to post future posts on them here?
 (02-03-2023, 02:09 AM)lionuk Wrote: Since the Black Dam males have same Avoca bloodline as the 5 other Avoca males, so can we use this thread to post future posts on them here? No, it doesn't make any sense and such doing would cause huge mess. That way you could bassicaly post any lion news in any thread as most lions around are a bit related one way or another. You could post for example Nkuchuma pride news in Birmingham pride thread as young Nkuchuma females being sired by Birmingham males are even more related to Birmingham pride than BDM are related to Avoca males.  (02-03-2023, 02:09 AM)lionuk Wrote: Since the Black Dam males have same Avoca bloodline as the 5 other Avoca males, so can we use this thread to post future posts on them here? Their father has no connections to Avoca pride, Old Avoca/Giraffes come from Giraffe pride, first 2 oldest takeover Avoca pride, they where called 2 Avoca males, later 4 younger Giraffe followed and joined them, but not father of BDM's, he was 2 yrs younger then those 4, he never followed his brothers to Avoca pride, he stayed with natal pride a bit longer and eventually went his own way alone. I mean they share same bloodline thru their grandfathers, old Giraffe/Ross males, but father of BDM's has no connections with Avoca pride and name. 
I think they mean the same giraffe male linage.
It would make sense to have a page for the six black dam males. Seems like a far more impactful group of males than say .. the Gijimas?  (02-03-2023, 04:05 AM)SMK350 Wrote: I think they mean the same giraffe male linage. BDMs do not fully hold a territory, nor are they dominant over a pride, which is typically the criteria for their own thread. Gijimas hold both, including the possibility they have fathered cubs, not to mention the damage they caused N'was on their way through, so even in that regard I'd say they have also been more impactful as well. BDMs, Mongawanes, PCMs didn't get their own thread either, until they held both territory and were dominant over some of the Nkuhumas. 
It wouldnt be the first time a much hyped up coalition fizzled out into nothing or ends up splitting in two. .
It also doesnt matter much if they end up being impactfull in an area we get little to no updates from. Best to wait and see right now. (02-03-2023, 04:05 AM)SMK350 Wrote: I think they mean the same giraffe male linage. New threads are usually made for coalitions and prides in Sabi Sands, as updates on them are regular and are most popular. If we start making new separate threads for every coalition and pride in Timbavati, Manyeleti and Kruger, that would be a big mess. If 2 BDM's become territorial in Sabi Sands, they will prob get their own thread, where we can post content of their northern brothers aswell.
I was just trying to provide support to @lionuk because they obviously have an interest in following the BDMs and I think that’s great that more and more people are interested in lions outside of Sabi sands.
I’m sure in this day and age people know how to find the information they need on basically any lion so it’s not a big deal. 
Were Dark Mane Avoca and the Young Birmingham male of the Mongawane coalition related? I just noticed that they look a lot alike.
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