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Amur Tigers
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  (05-02-2021, 05:49 PM)peter Wrote:(04-26-2021, 04:27 PM)Nyers Wrote: credits to Amur tiger center i think tiger got this injury when he attack car and yes this incident was happen in China (05-02-2021, 02:31 PM)Panthera Wrote: Rare record, Wild Amur tiger go into Chinese village and shattered car windows on 23th of last month(10 days ago) During a trip to Russia to explore the country, the tiger concluded China wasn't as bad as he initially thought. He decided to return. The trip back, however, didn't go smoothly. My guess is he was in a hurry, as he travelled in daylight. Out in the open in a treeless region he didn't know, he most probably felt uncomfortable. This could be the reason he decided to seek shelter in a village. When he was discovered, he had no option but to leave. As he was seen and followed, he felt trapped. This, most probably, was the reason he decided to confront those he considered responsible for the situation. The video suggests the woman working on the field wasn't even aware of him. My guess is the tiger also concluded she didn't pose a threat when he was closing in. This could be the reason she wasn't attacked, but just bumped. The woman immediately got to her feet, meaning the tiger, at least twice, if not three times her weight, hadn't used any force. When he was moving towards the woman, another woman driving a car decided to intervene in order to discourage him. Seen from the perspective of the tiger, it was an aggressive move, if not a threat. This is the reason he decided to use a bit more force. Although he broke a window, nobody was hurt. The violence used, therefore, was proportionate in both cases. When we add the tiger was a young man out of his comfort zone facing a situation he could have perceived as life-threatening, we can only conclude he acted in a very mature way. When I saw the video, I immediately thought of Jim Corbett. Although he, more than most others, had good reasons to consider tigers as dangerous (Corbett hunted man-eaters for many years), he got to a remarkable conclusion: " ... There is, however, one point on which I am convinced that all sportsmen ... will agree with me, and that is, that a tiger is a large-hearted gentlemen with boundless courage ... ('Man-Eaters of Kumaon', Jim Corbett, London, 1947, Author's Note, pp. xvi). 
@Rage2277
@Pckts @Hello @Sher Khan @ @Balam @tigerluver I know many of these have been debunked but is there any way I can get the full list of old hunting records of siberian tigers by Ryckov (or whatever his name is)? I am curious and I just wanna calculate an average of tigers before our influence on their size (even though some weights are debunked) *This image is copyright of its original author *This image is copyright of its original author I got these screens, do you know where i can find the full document?  (05-02-2021, 02:47 PM)Hello Wrote: Bimbo,120 cm and claimed to be 400 kg Which one is true, some people including one of the zookeeper said it was 125 cm tall at the shoulder and you said Bimbo was 120 cm tall.  (05-06-2021, 03:13 PM)LoveAnimals Wrote: @Rage2277This is from Slaght et al. 2005 - Tigers in Sikhote-Alin Zapovednik: Ecology and Conservation Page 5 and 10/11 
Slaght et al 2005.pdf (Size: 1.29 MB / Downloads: 14)
Most of these weights have been disproved and disregarded, but in that table are also 9 reliable ones which gave an average of 215.5 kg for historical amur tigers (prior 1970) largest being 254 kg This was also the source of the erroneous average figure of 176.4 kg for amur tigers after 1970s, mainly because the sample included unhealthy animals too which dropped the numbers. (05-06-2021, 04:13 PM)johnny rex Wrote:I was not sure, but 125 cm seems bit of a stretch.i'd say it is not impossible but such heights are extremely rare, abnormal and are giants. Amnon said amurs from this facility are extremely large.(05-02-2021, 02:47 PM)Hello Wrote: Bimbo,120 cm and claimed to be 400 kg Some huge amurs from tiger oasis https://www.milanfoto.eu/displayimage.php?album=151&pid=3985#top_display_media  *This image is copyright of its original author
(05-06-2021, 04:31 PM)Khan85 Wrote: This is from Slaght et al. 2005 - Tigers in Sikhote-Alin Zapovednik: Ecology and Conservation Page 5 and 10/11Thank you! I am really interested in knowing how they were disproven, I mean I understand why they would consider unreliable any 380-400 lg tiger but why as example some 280 or some 300 kg ones? If the largest bengal weighed 322 empty after eating a Buffalo how can't amurs reach 280 - 300 kgs... There are some captive HEALTHY males weighing 276-282 kg with one being 4'4 feet tall so if exemplars of this size exist in captivity I'm totally sure they could exist in the wild when there was much more prey to catch (05-06-2021, 04:31 PM)Khan85 Wrote: This was also the source of the erroneous average figure of 176.4 kg for amur tigers after 1970s, mainly because the sample included unhealthy animals too which dropped the numbers. Really? Is the 176 kg average for Amur tigers just the result from weighing unhealthy males? That's great news I am extra tored of hearing that as the average weight of the Amurs. The average now is 196-203 kg I guess? (05-06-2021, 09:30 PM)LoveAnimals Wrote:They tried to go into detail of the records, and for majority of them it was found that the data came from secondary sources. Many mentions were very vague like for eg,. one said, "There were reports of tigers up to 384 kg" & that was all. Such vague statements and data coming from secondary sources and not first hand made their reliability questionable.(05-06-2021, 04:31 PM)Khan85 Wrote: This is from Slaght et al. 2005 - Tigers in Sikhote-Alin Zapovednik: Ecology and Conservation Page 5 and 10/11Thank you! I am really interested in knowing how they were disproven, I mean I understand why they would consider unreliable any 380-400 lg tiger but why as example some 280 or some 300 kg ones? If the largest bengal weighed 322 empty after eating a Buffalo how can't amurs reach 280 - 300 kgs... There are some captive HEALTHY males weighing 276-282 kg with one being 4'4 feet tall so if exemplars of this size exist in captivity I'm totally sure they could exist in the wild when there was much more prey to catch For all animals, I prefer to consider only the published figures from zoologists for the max size which comes out to be over 272 kg for bengals (272 kg+) from Terai Arc Landscape. Two tigers exceeded a scale of 272 kg which were captured and weighed during the Tiger Ecology Program in Chitwan NP (70s and 80s) There have been verified reports of Bengals at 320 kg like from Nepal (Smythies 1942) but a hunting record is a hunting record and can always be questioned at some time. There was also a male Bengal tiger which was said to have been weighed and verified by Dr. Wasif from Pilibhit NP at 345 kg through pers. comm. and only 2-3 years back but we haven't seen the figure being published anywhere hence it can't be used as a fact, that is for now. As published in Slaght et al. 2005, it was 254 kg for amur tigers and 212 kg from post '70 records. However, I believe that the modern records that exist for Amur tigers make us greatly underestimate these cats and older reliable records are a better reflection of their actual size. Credits - Guate Gojira You can see the appendix in table one that 3 tigers were severely malnourished and dropped the average. Also, there were 10 tigers that were measured other than STP. Guate included them. For older records (05-06-2021, 10:41 PM)Khan85 Wrote: There have been verified reports of Bengals at 320 kg like from Nepal (Smythies 1942) but a hunting record is a hunting record and can always be questioned at some timeDo you know where I can read more about all those 320 kg tigers? Therr must be reports and if they are "verified"... Just curiosity I would like to read about those giant speciments. Thanks again for everything btw (05-07-2021, 12:41 AM)LoveAnimals Wrote:(05-06-2021, 10:41 PM)Khan85 Wrote: There have been verified reports of Bengals at 320 kg like from Nepal (Smythies 1942) but a hunting record is a hunting record and can always be questioned at some timeDo you know where I can read more about all those 320 kg tigers? Therr must be reports and if they are "verified"... Just curiosity I would like to read about those giant speciments. You can read here - https://wildfact.com/forum/topic-on-the-edge-of-extinction-a-the-tiger-panthera-tigris?pid=8625#pid8625 and here - https://wildfact.com/forum/topic-on-the-edge-of-extinction-a-the-tiger-panthera-tigris?pid=8626#pid8626
https://bigcats-ru.livejournal.com/125951.html
The Project Wildlife Conservation Society “Amur Tiger” has been taking place in Sikhote Alinskiy biosphere nature Reserve (north-eastern part of Primorye, Russian Far East) since 1992. The Project includes capturing tigers with the use of Aldrich foot snare for further immobilization and equipping them with radio or GPS collars. Aldrich foot snare is a steel device made of 8mm rod, spring and big screw bolts. The trap is set in a small hollow on the trail that the animal uses; it is attached to a tree and is thoroughly disguised. When the animal steps on a spring, the loop catches its foot. When the tiger is trapped he starts to throw himself and bite the metal device. As a result, tigers seriously injure their paws and teeth, and it usually later results in their death. Russian zoologists started using this snare as well in 2008. Dalnauka Publishing House (Vladivostok) has published a monograph Diseases and Parasites of Wildlife in Siberia and the Russian Far East under the editorship of I.V. Seryodkin and D.G. Miquelle. Dr. Seryodkin is an associate professor and acting Head of Laboratory in Pacific Institute of Geography, Far-Eastern Branch, Russian Academy of Science. Dr. D. G. Miquelle is the director of WCS Russia [1]. Pages 108-117 of the book contain a chapter titled “Tooth breakage in tigers: cause for conflict?” [2]. The authors of the chapter are members of “Amur Tiger” Project launched by WCS: D.M. Goodrich, I.V. Seryodkin, D.G. Miquelle, L.L. Kerley, H.B. Quigley, M.G. Hornocker. They try to address the criticism of WCS centered on dangerous entrapment techniques which often harm animals and consequently provoke aggression towards humans [3..6]. They try to prove this wrong by substantiating their work with studies of 46 tigers caught by Aldrich foot snares. Notably, they discuss only dental injuries, and more specifically “… on injured canines with necrotic pulp and open apex; other teeth are beyond the scope of this research”. Limb injuries are not mentioned at all, while it is intuitive to expect this kind of damage after being caught by paw-catching steel snare. The conclusions derived from the research are hardly unexpected considering the affiliation of the authors:
So what was going on with other tigers? Were the two tigers mentioned by WCS the only ones which injured the teeth while being caught by Aldrich snares? The teeth of the first tiger were completely destroyed (Fig. 1). Were the other tigers of different kind? Did they lay down calmly waiting to get a dose of tranquillizer? Sure! This is what WCS members claim in their book. We consider that book extremely simplistic and biased, since it claims that tigers with dental problems hunt down bigger prey (the difference is valued about 3kg or 6.6 lbs), successfully reproduce and do not interfere with people. One might think that tigers don’t need canines at all. To support their conclusions, Goodrich et al. compare African lions to tigers, not taking into account totally different ecology, social structure and range patterns. They point out that “Dental injuries caused by trapping were detected only twice”. Interestingly, they also mention that over 70% of trapped tigers were later killed by poachers. (05-06-2021, 06:01 PM)Hello Wrote:(05-06-2021, 04:13 PM)johnny rex Wrote:I was not sure, but 125 cm seems bit of a stretch.i'd say it is not impossible but such heights are extremely rare, abnormal and are giants. Amnon said amurs from this facility are extremely large.(05-02-2021, 02:47 PM)Hello Wrote: Bimbo,120 cm and claimed to be 400 kg Do you know if the tiger on the other side of the fence was standing on higher ground? |
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