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Tyrannosaurus rex

United Kingdom Spalea Offline
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Circumspect feathered tyrannosaurus under a big hive...


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United Kingdom Spalea Offline
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" Face Off " by Jerry Lofaro.



A classic...
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United Kingdom Spalea Offline
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Perhaps an updating video about T-rex. "Scotty" and "Sue", the most famous T-rex ever discovered on Earth, are evoked.





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United Kingdom Spalea Offline
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Just for the fun to look at a very nice and imaginative T-rex's depiction, because i cannot believe them having been enjoying an aquatic way of life such like that like an extant hippo. But why not ?

" Trex fording Hell Creek. Artist: @sharkbitesteve "


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United Kingdom Spalea Offline
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Drawer's site: https://www.instagram.com/greatestloverart/ 




T-rex coming just to kill a stegosaurus... Interesting but not possible ! The stegosaurid dinosaurs having disapeared since a long time before the Late Cretaceous. Nice depiction though...
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Canada DinoFan83 Offline
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Tyrannosaurus skeletals by SpinoInWonderland

*This image is copyright of its original author



Tyrannosaurus GDI's by SpinoInWonderland (multiply volume by 0.915 to get mass). Source: https://www.deviantart.com/spinoinwonderland/journal/Some-GDI-s-for-a-few-folks-648811067

*This image is copyright of its original author


*This image is copyright of its original author
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Canada DinoFan83 Offline
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( This post was last modified: 10-10-2020, 03:56 AM by DinoFan83 )

Largest specimens of Triceratops and Tyrannosaurus (AMNH 5040 and FMNH PR 2081).
Triceratops is scaled to 275 cm skull and is at least 13-14 tonnes, while Tyrannosaurus is scaled to 12.3 meters and is 7.9 tonnes. Lateral views by GetAwayTrike and Scott Hartman respectively, dorsal views by Greg Paul and Scott Hartman respectively.

*This image is copyright of its original author
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Canada DinoFan83 Offline
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Largest specimens of Tyrannosaurus and Alamosaurus (FMNH PR 2081 and SMP-VP 1850). 
Tyrannosaurus is 12.3 meters TL and is 8.4 tonnes, while Alamosaurus is 34 meters TL and is 90 tonnes. Both skeletals by Scott Hartman.

*This image is copyright of its original author
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Canada DinoFan83 Offline
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( This post was last modified: 06-05-2021, 04:33 PM by DinoFan83 )

There is a great deal of contention over the average size of known adult T. rex specimens, so I took a moment to calculate what I could from known data. 

Here are all the adult T. rex specimens I could find data on (adult meaning 15 years or older, as this is when T. rex virtually stops growing) to get an idea of average size of known specimens. 
The proxy on which this is based will be femur length, with all bone measurements for both preserved and estimated femur length taken either from Tyrannosaurus Rex, the Tyrant King or the Theropod Database (unless stated otherwise of course).  

Tyrannosaurus Rex, the Tyrant King has a very helpful table of T. rex bone measurements, including femoral dimensions (link). With the exception of BHI 4100, all the listed measurements are from adult specimens, as per the Theropod Database.
 
Note, however, that some of the specimen measurements differ from what is given elsewhere and more recently for them. Specifically, the femoral lengths of CM 9380 and BHI 3033 are 128 and 127 cm as per Scott Hartman, MOR 1125's femur is 107 cm as per Schweitzer et al. (2016), and Sue's femur is 132.5 cm as per the Theropod Database, so I will be using those respective figures for them.

I will also be including femur length figures for some specimens either not listed in the table or listed in the table and preserving femora but not having the femora listed. Namely, those are Scotty (133 cm), Bucky (116 cm), MOR 009 (114.3 cm) and DMNH 2827 (111 cm).

Finally, there are very complete specimens like Tristan, Victoria and Trix that preserve femora but are awaiting description. They will be included in the sample when that happens.

The average of specimens known from femora:  

Adding all the measurements up results in a total femur length average of about 119.9 cm (129.5+120+99+121+120+116+118+119+111+118+128+132.5+123.2+127.5+107+126+127+114.3+133+111+116 equals 2517, divided by 21).
However, there are some specimens that have to have their femoral lengths estimated one way or the other (for example, specimens that don't preserve femora or don't have complete femora), and I will calculate a potential femur length for them so they can be included in the sample.

Estimates of femur length for less complete specimens:

The specimens whose femoral length I will be estimating based on other specimens are MOR 008, LACM 23844, AMNH 5027, BHI 4182, UCMP 118742, BHI 6231, BMNH R7994, and NHM R8001. Sue will be used as a base for all due to its completeness and resultant overlap with every specimen here.
 
-MOR 008 has a maxilla and dentary 72 and 88 cm respectively, compared to the 86.1 and 101 cm maxilla and dentary in Sue, the mean of which results in a 113.3 cm femur.
 
-LACM 23844 has a 92 cm dentary compared to 101 cm in Sue, which results in a 120.7 cm femur.
 
-AMNH 5027 has a dentary and ilium 85 and 151.5 cm respectively, compared to the 101 and 146 cm dentary and ilium in Sue, the mean of which results in a 126.9 cm femur.
 
-BHI 4182 has a 91 cm dentary compared to 101 cm in Sue, which results in a 119.4 cm femur.  

-UCMP 118742 has an 81 cm maxilla compared to 86.1 cm in Sue, which results in a 124.7 cm femur.    

-BHI 6231 has a 36 cm humerus compared to 39 cm in Sue, which results in a 122.3 cm femur.

-BMNH R7994 has a femur 49 cm in circumference compared to Sue's 58 cm (only circumference listed but no length, probably meaning an incomplete femur that needs a length estimate), which results in a 111.9 cm femur.

-NHM R8001 has a femur with the same situation as that of BMNH R7994, which results in another 111.9 cm femur.  
 
Adding these estimates up results in an average of about 118.9 cm (113.3+120.7+126.9+119.4+124.7+122.3+111.9+111.9 equals 951.1, divided by 8).  

Overall Average:  

Adding up all known and extrapolated femur lengths and then dividing them by the sample size (2517 plus 951.1 equals 3468.1, divided by 29) results in a mean femur length of about 119.6 cm. This is approximately 6000 kg based on Sue, which is 8200 kg (my mean estimation on page 13) with a 132.5 cm femur.
  
Therefore, based on this, the average adult T. rex going by known specimens is about 6000 kg. Not exactly as large as some people may have thought, but it most certainly isn't small - assuming this is correct, T. rex would average the size of an African bush elephant bull.
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United States tigerluver Offline
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@DinoFan83 , do you have any source describing the tibia circumference of Sue or any other T. rex specimen?
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Canada DinoFan83 Offline
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I'm afraid I don't.
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United Kingdom Spalea Offline
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@DinoFan83 

" Tyrannosaurus rex vs Giganotosaurus "





Top: Tyrannosaurus
Bottom: Giganatosaurus

Giganatosaurus bigger than t-rex ? I have no doubt about it. But when I consider their skeletons, it 's easy to see the t-rex skull is more massiv, as well as the femor (although shorter as you told) and the pelvis. Giganotosaurus longer, yes, giganotosaurus bigger, yes possibly because of its superior length, but nevertheless the t-rex is more heavily built. The proof is that it is estimated that the giganatosaurus at full speed is the fastest...
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Canada DinoFan83 Offline
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^I agree with you on that. Tyrannosaurus' skull, torso, and limb bones do seem to be a good bit more chunky and robust relative to their dimensions than those of Giganotosaurus.
Speed should be similar for both.
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Malaysia johnny rex Offline
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(05-20-2020, 08:35 PM)DinoFan83 Wrote: Here is some scaling I have done of all adult Tyrannosaurus specimens I could find data on (adult meaning 15 years or older) to get an idea of average size. This is based on femur length, so I will extrapolate femur lengths for specimens that do not preserve femurs. All bone measurements are either from Larson et al. 2008 or the Theropod Database.

Larson et al. 2008 (Tyrannosaurus Rex, the Tyrant King) has a very helpful table of Tyrannosaurus bone measurements (link). All the listed measurements for Tyrannosaurus are from adult specimens, as per the Theropod Database (Note, however, that some of the specimen measurements differ from what is given. Specifically, CM 9380's femur is 126.5 cm as per Hutchinson et al. 2011's mount scan, MOR 1125's femur is 107 cm as per Schweitzer et al. 2016, RTMP 81.6.1's femur is 115 cm as per the Theropod Database, and Sue's femur is 132.5 cm as per the Theropod Database, so I will be using those respective figures for them). I will also be including femur length figures for some specimens not listed in the table, namely Scotty (133 cm), Dynamosaurus (132 cm), and DMNH 2827 (111 cm), all as per the Theropod Database.

The average of specimens known from femora:

Adding all the measurements up results in a total femur length average of about 120.6 centimeters, out of a sample of 19 (22932/19). However, there are some specimens that do not preserve femora or have no reported femur length, and I will calculate a potential femur length for them based on other specimens.

Estimates for specimens that do not preserve femora:

The specimens whose femoral length I will be estimating based on other specimens are MOR 008, LACM 23844, AMNH 5027, BHI 4182, UCMP 118742, BHI 4960, 'Tristan', BHI 6231, and 'Trix'. What specimen I am using as a base will be noted for each.

MOR 008 has a maxilla and dentary 72 and 88 centimeters respectively, compared to the 86.1 and 101 cm maxilla and dentary in Sue. The average disparity between these is 1.169375 percent, so based on Sue's 132.5 cm femur, MOR 008 would have a 113.3 cm femur.

LACM 23844 has a 92 cm dentary vs 101 cm in Sue, which results in an approximately 120.7 cm femur.

AMNH 5027 is very similar in size to CM 9380 and their ilia are the same length. Its femur was likely around 126.5 cm, as CM 9380's was.

BHI 4182's dentary is 91 cm vs 101 cm in Sue, which is an approximately 119.4 cm femur.

UCMP 118742's maxilla is 96.4 percent the size of Sue's when averaging all measurements from the Theropod Database, which is an approximately 127.7 cm femur.

BHI 4960's ilium is 127.5 cm vs 155 cm in BHI 3033, which is approximately a 107.8 cm femur.

Tristan is stated to be 12 meters long by the Museum fur Naturkunde, vs 12.3 meters for Sue, which is a 129.4 cm femur.

BHI 6231 has a 36 cm humerus vs 39 cm in Sue, which is a 122.3 cm femur.

Trix is stated to be in between Sue and Stan in size (therefore 11.79 m), which is a 127 cm femur.

Adding these up results in a mean of about 108.8 cm, in a sample of 9 (10941/9).

Overall Average:

Adding up all known and extrapolated femur lengths and then dividing them by the sample size (22932 plus 10941, divided by 28) results in a mean femur length of about 120.5 cm. This is approximately 6 tonnes scaling down from CM 9380, which is about 7 tonnes with a 126.5 cm femur.

Therefore, based on this, the average adult Tyrannosaurus based on known specimens is about 6 tonnes. This is also coherent with Greg Paul's mass estimates in the 2010 and 2016 Princeton Field Guide to Dinosaurs.

The femur length and circumference of MOR 1125 a.k.a B-rex (the specimen where the medullary bone were discovered) are varied depending on different sources. The original source (Schweitzer and Horner) give the femur length and circumference at 107 cm and 43 cm respectively, while Larson give larger measurements which is dubious.
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Canada DinoFan83 Offline
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^Yes, I believe Schweitzer et al. would have the more reliable measurement; they did work directly with the bone after all.
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