Modern weights and measurements on wild tigers

[Charger01]

(01-01-2023, 08:26 AM)Roflcopters Wrote: someone from youtube reached out to me recently and shared this picture with me and asked me what i thought about this, upon investigating. i realized it came from the same fanboy "muhammed yusuf", last username on this forum - ZigZag (now banned). keep in mind, this individual is part of the Lion vs Tiger fanboy group, none of those people are here for real conservation. rather it's more of "my cat is bigger than yours fantasy war". most of the weights and measurements by this individual are fabricated and he has a history of talking to himself under different names. here's a picture of an alleged "21 cm lion pugmark" belonging to a lion called "BDM". 

*This image is copyright of its original author

this fanboy claims this is a 21cm pugmark. pay attention to the bic lighter that can be seen on the bottom of the picture. being fairly familiar with these lighters as they are very common here in the US and Canada (not sure if its the case worldwide). I figured i could use the width of the lighter which is fairly standard at 2.2cm and try to measure both length and width by placing the lighters from starting point to the ending point. (both vertical and horizontal)  

*This image is copyright of its original author

a small bic lighter to the left, a random lighter and a big size bic lighter on the far right. the smaller bic is just around 2cm roughly and the big size bic lighter is roughly around 2.2cm. 

*This image is copyright of its original author

(big size bic lighter) this scale here is in inches, the lighter is just under 1 inch wide.

*This image is copyright of its original author

 



I was trying to figure out how to go on about this as accurate as possible and also to avoid (outside interference) so i copied the lighter from the picture and used the width of the lighter and copy pasted the lighters vertically and horizontally. I also scaled each lighter at 2.2cm on the scale. I was able to get 13.4cm in length and 10.7cm in width, with a little margin for error maybe. (if you can convince me lighter was odd 1 and a half inch or 2 inch wide - which is highly unlikely) there's no way this pugmark was anywhere close to the claimed 21cm. I don't think many of these fanboys even realize how big a 20cm + pugmark would look like on a picture, let alone next to a scale.   DEBUNKED

here's a few other pugmark measurements (tigers)

*This image is copyright of its original author

14.8 cm (PML), this either belonged to a very large female or a male tiger. (Pench, MP)

*This image is copyright of its original author

tiger jai's pugmark next to a scale, just under 15cm. this male tiger weighed 220kg (Umred Karhandla)

Great debunk. However, one correction that this bs came not from Yusuf but another guy with username Nhenha on youtube. He has been banned from wildfact twice or thrice, and is as much of a specimen as Yusuf if not worse. Reply

[Pckts]

(01-01-2023, 08:26 AM)Roflcopters Wrote: someone from youtube reached out to me recently and shared this picture with me and asked me what i thought about this, upon investigating. i realized it came from the same fanboy "muhammed yusuf", last username on this forum - ZigZag (now banned). keep in mind, this individual is part of the Lion vs Tiger fanboy group, none of those people are here for real conservation. rather it's more of "my cat is bigger than yours fantasy war". most of the weights and measurements by this individual are fabricated and he has a history of talking to himself under different names. here's a picture of an alleged "21 cm lion pugmark" belonging to a lion called "BDM". 

*This image is copyright of its original author

this fanboy claims this is a 21cm pugmark. pay attention to the bic lighter that can be seen on the bottom of the picture. being fairly familiar with these lighters as they are very common here in the US and Canada (not sure if its the case worldwide). I figured i could use the width of the lighter which is fairly standard at 2.2cm and try to measure both length and width by placing the lighters from starting point to the ending point. (both vertical and horizontal)  

*This image is copyright of its original author

a small bic lighter to the left, a random lighter and a big size bic lighter on the far right. the smaller bic is just around 2cm roughly and the big size bic lighter is roughly around 2.2cm. 

*This image is copyright of its original author

(big size bic lighter) this scale here is in inches, the lighter is just under 1 inch wide.

*This image is copyright of its original author

 



I was trying to figure out how to go on about this as accurate as possible and also to avoid (outside interference) so i copied the lighter from the picture and used the width of the lighter and copy pasted the lighters vertically and horizontally. I also scaled each lighter at 2.2cm on the scale. I was able to get 13.4cm in length and 10.7cm in width, with a little margin for error maybe. (if you can convince me lighter was odd 1 and a half inch or 2 inch wide - which is highly unlikely) there's no way this pugmark was anywhere close to the claimed 21cm. I don't think many of these fanboys even realize how big a 20cm + pugmark would look like on a picture, let alone next to a scale.   DEBUNKED

here's a few other pugmark measurements (tigers)

*This image is copyright of its original author

14.8 cm (PML), this either belonged to a very large female or a male tiger. (Pench, MP)

*This image is copyright of its original author

tiger jai's pugmark next to a scale, just under 15cm. this male tiger weighed 220kg (Umred Karhandla)

Rage and I corrected him a while back.

*This image is copyright of its original author

Reply

[abhisingh7]

(01-02-2023, 05:18 AM)Roflcopters Wrote: @strongmanw7 

Unfortunately, i have nothing to work with. i can only work with known objects in the picture or even the tire tread if i knew the size of the tire.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HwCJgKSX0Q pugmarks of rajaji male . Reply

[Roflcopters]

(01-03-2023, 10:06 PM)Pckts Wrote:

(01-01-2023, 08:26 AM)Roflcopters Wrote: someone from youtube reached out to me recently and shared this picture with me and asked me what i thought about this, upon investigating. i realized it came from the same fanboy "muhammed yusuf", last username on this forum - ZigZag (now banned). keep in mind, this individual is part of the Lion vs Tiger fanboy group, none of those people are here for real conservation. rather it's more of "my cat is bigger than yours fantasy war". most of the weights and measurements by this individual are fabricated and he has a history of talking to himself under different names. here's a picture of an alleged "21 cm lion pugmark" belonging to a lion called "BDM". 

*This image is copyright of its original author

this fanboy claims this is a 21cm pugmark. pay attention to the bic lighter that can be seen on the bottom of the picture. being fairly familiar with these lighters as they are very common here in the US and Canada (not sure if its the case worldwide). I figured i could use the width of the lighter which is fairly standard at 2.2cm and try to measure both length and width by placing the lighters from starting point to the ending point. (both vertical and horizontal)  

*This image is copyright of its original author

a small bic lighter to the left, a random lighter and a big size bic lighter on the far right. the smaller bic is just around 2cm roughly and the big size bic lighter is roughly around 2.2cm. 

*This image is copyright of its original author

(big size bic lighter) this scale here is in inches, the lighter is just under 1 inch wide.

*This image is copyright of its original author

 



I was trying to figure out how to go on about this as accurate as possible and also to avoid (outside interference) so i copied the lighter from the picture and used the width of the lighter and copy pasted the lighters vertically and horizontally. I also scaled each lighter at 2.2cm on the scale. I was able to get 13.4cm in length and 10.7cm in width, with a little margin for error maybe. (if you can convince me lighter was odd 1 and a half inch or 2 inch wide - which is highly unlikely) there's no way this pugmark was anywhere close to the claimed 21cm. I don't think many of these fanboys even realize how big a 20cm + pugmark would look like on a picture, let alone next to a scale.   DEBUNKED

here's a few other pugmark measurements (tigers)

*This image is copyright of its original author

14.8 cm (PML), this either belonged to a very large female or a male tiger. (Pench, MP)

*This image is copyright of its original author

tiger jai's pugmark next to a scale, just under 15cm. this male tiger weighed 220kg (Umred Karhandla)

Rage and I corrected him a while back.

*This image is copyright of its original author

lol! definitely didn’t see this before and indeed, the pugmark was so enormous. it couldn’t even beat Pench tigress’s PML. 

@abhisingh7 nice video, seems about 14-16cm. no scale was used so it’s hard to say. tfs! 

back on topic

*This image is copyright of its original author

tigress from Similipal with 16cm (PML)

source : https://www.academia.edu/43696274/Prusty_B_C_L_A_K_Singh_and_S_D_Rout_1995_Habitat_Utilisation_by_Tiger_in_Similipal_Retrieved_from_Research_Report_1973_1995_Technical_Report_7

*This image is copyright of its original author

An image of a tiger pug mark in a muddy substrate.
Length = 14cm (likely a female)

Location - Eastern Ghats forest range in the state of Andhra Pradesh, India. (2022)

*This image is copyright of its original author

male tiger pugmark from Nallamala hills, India. (2018)

*This image is copyright of its original author

I can’t remember exactly where this one was from, i believe this belonged to a Malaysian tiger.

*This image is copyright of its original author

Malaysian tiger pugmark from 2011. both the scales are 6 inch wide. 

*This image is copyright of its original author

another Malaysian tiger pug mark from 2011. Reply

[Roflcopters]

some Ranthambore tigers from 2005 study.

Male tigers (below)

*This image is copyright of its original author

Berda male’s (PML) just around 15cm

*This image is copyright of its original author

little under 15cm (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

15cm (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

around 14cm (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

little over 14cm (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

around 15cm (PML)



Female tigers (below)

*This image is copyright of its original author

can’t tell the starting point, likely around 13-13.5cm. (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

around 14cm (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

15cm (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

around 13cm (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

around 14cm (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

around 14cm (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

little over 13cm (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

13.5-14cm (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

little over 14cm (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

i can’t tell with this pic.

*This image is copyright of its original author

14cm or little over 14cm. (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

around 13-13.5cm (PML)

*This image is copyright of its original author

over 13cm (PML)

source : https://www.wpsi-india.org/images/ranthambore_census_report.pdf

someone correct me if i’m wrong anywhere.  Reply

[abhisingh7]

nepal male tiger Reply

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[Charger01]

I wanted to see what results we would get if we combined all the available data we have concerning measurements of bengal tigers. Credit also goes to @peter and @GuateGojira as I utilized their older tables for this. 
It's a massive table. I included almost all available information and collected a sample of 325 male bengal tigers. Some dates may be inaccurate as I had to use the year of publishing the book in some cases. 

    Reply

[strongmanw7]

(01-15-2023, 08:36 AM)Charger01 Wrote: I wanted to see what results we would get if we combined all the available data we have concerning measurements of bengal tigers. Credit also goes to @peter and @GuateGojira as I utilized their older tables for this. 
It's a massive table. I included almost all available information and collected a sample of 325 male bengal tigers. Some dates may be inaccurate as I had to use the year of publishing the book in some cases. 

Why u reduced p111 And p243 to 180kgs , they were measured 227 and 228 , many people say they were almost empty . Reply

[Charger01]

(01-16-2023, 10:28 PM)strongmanw7 Wrote:

(01-15-2023, 08:36 AM)Charger01 Wrote: I wanted to see what results we would get if we combined all the available data we have concerning measurements of bengal tigers. Credit also goes to @peter and @GuateGojira as I utilized their older tables for this. 
It's a massive table. I included almost all available information and collected a sample of 325 male bengal tigers. Some dates may be inaccurate as I had to use the year of publishing the book in some cases. 

Why u reduced p111 And p243 to 180kgs , they were measured 227 and 228 , many people say they were almost empty .

It's a typo. My bad. Reply

[Roflcopters]

@Charger01 I heard Ranthambore FD took T57’s measurements at the time of his death. are you able to find out? exact details of his death (below). 

*This image is copyright of its original author

Reply

[Pckts]

It's mentioned on Chargers table but not posted here so the updated weight for Bheema at 3.5 years old was 207kg confirmed by Akhilesh Mishra.

"Bheema Three and half year old male tiger weighing 207 kg"
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=...351&type=3

Good sized male at that age, not the 225kg at 2.5 we were lead to believe but still a large male. Generally speaking he should be around 230kg-250kg in his prime depending on body condition. *Probably closer  to 230kg empty while closer to 250kg with content*
Generally speaking per Smuts, male lions gained around 30kgs from 3.5years of age till their peak.
This is based on an average of 190kgs or so for Empty Males so Bheema being larger than the average Male would most likely gain a bit more in that time. Reply

[AndresVida]

(01-15-2023, 08:36 AM)Charger01 Wrote: I wanted to see what results we would get if we combined all the available data we have concerning measurements of bengal tigers. Credit also goes to @peter and @GuateGojira as I utilized their older tables for this. 
It's a massive table. I included almost all available information and collected a sample of 325 male bengal tigers. Some dates may be inaccurate as I had to use the year of publishing the book in some cases. 

I recall that in the 320 kg gorged Nepalese male (290-305 kg empty) had a chest girth circumference of 160 cm according to Guate's table? Reply

[Charger01]

(01-17-2023, 02:14 PM)Roflcopters Wrote: @Charger01 I heard Ranthambore FD took T57’s measurements at the time of his death. are you able to find out? exact details of his death (below). 

*This image is copyright of its original author

Total length 291 cm
Head-body 189 cm
Shoulder height 109 cm
Upper canines 6 cm
Lower canines 5 cm

Weight not taken Reply

[Pckts]

(01-20-2023, 09:45 AM)Charger01 Wrote:

(01-17-2023, 02:14 PM)Roflcopters Wrote: @Charger01 I heard Ranthambore FD took T57’s measurements at the time of his death. are you able to find out? exact details of his death (below). 

*This image is copyright of its original author

Total length 291 cm
Head-body 189 cm
Shoulder height 109 cm
Upper canines 6 cm
Lower canines 5 cm

Weight not taken

Can you get girth measurements as well?
Judging by size, I'm guessing measurements were done in a straight line. 
Without girth measurements but still using length and height its safe to assume he was around 
200kg or so. Possibly more but need the girth and measurement protocol first to confirm. Reply

[Charger01]

(01-20-2023, 09:31 PM)Pckts Wrote:

(01-20-2023, 09:45 AM)Charger01 Wrote:

(01-17-2023, 02:14 PM)Roflcopters Wrote: @Charger01 I heard Ranthambore FD took T57’s measurements at the time of his death. are you able to find out? exact details of his death (below). 

*This image is copyright of its original author

Total length 291 cm
Head-body 189 cm
Shoulder height 109 cm
Upper canines 6 cm
Lower canines 5 cm

Weight not taken

Can you get girth measurements as well?
Judging by size, I'm guessing measurements were done in a straight line. 
Without girth measurements but still using length and height its safe to assume he was around 
200kg or so. Possibly more but need the girth and measurement protocol first to confirm.

I believe they sent me all the measurements they took, and chest girth wasn't there so maybe they did not take it. But I will try to ask. The person told me that he was extremely skinny and weak in his last days due to tumor.

    Reply