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Lions of Sabi Sands
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Watching Tumbela getting attacked was very sad for me considering he's my favorite solitary lion, but I'm happy he escaped without serious injuries.
It wasn't smart of him to roar, but it shows he is feeling confident with his condition being good and his limp getting better. Anyway as I usually say, many males escape getting caught by 2 males because often the attacking coalition doesn't put enough effort, being satisfied with just asserting their dominance... And this was a territorial challenge made by Tumbela who was roaring, even then PCM didn't put the effort. This isn't the first or even second time he got caught by the PCM. Edit: And I almost forgot to say, these videos show again how big the PCM are, although not among the tallest, they have long bodies and are very bulky, especially Makhunga he looks like a bear, huge difference in bulkiness between him and Tumbela.
@Robot00 Mr.T and KT weren't any different. More aggressive or not they were just like other lions, once they caught their brother, the old Rollercoaster male and gave a beating before letting him go.
Iiirc they also caught the remaining Manyeleti male and he also escaped. It's not always lions to go for the kill in these situations. @Tr1x24 ? PCM attacked him because he challenged them. He roared, he was very vocal according to rangers, and PCM heard him. Nhenha died for the same reason, roared and got attacked. You don't accept that lions don't follow a strict pattern when engaging in confrontations, you think just because Nhenha got fatally wounded, every time PCM catch a male, the same result must happen, when in reality it's just normal for lions to not risk going for the kill regardless of how much they think the rival is a threat. And don't forget, even if PCM think he isn't a threat to them, he is to their female and cubs. Tumbela "isn't" healthy because of the PCM, that wound on his hindlimb and later badly scarred back was from being caught by PCM on at least 2 occasions, but you denied it happened, saying "if they had caught him he'd be dead" and refused to believe he was caught because he was alive, now he gets caught again and you say "well he is like Limper, not a threat and didn't challenge them" when he is literally a threat to females, cubs, and DID challenge them. Reason he escaped now, again, was because, as I've said multiple times, a lion's mood when attacking seems to be random, sometimes they go for the kill, sometimes they'd satisfied with simply asserting their dominance, it happened countless times with healthy lions attacked and being allowed to go. Edit: as for Tumbela's status as "unhealthy", Limper KNP and the last Nharhu male had much worst limp, often couldn't even support the leg, still they were dominant and dominated other healthier males in clashes and fights, Tumbela's slight limp wouldn't make PCM think he is weaker than any other healthy lion, on Limper Tumbela's case he was on death's door and died a few days after that. 
I view it like this, any lion that doesn’t belong to the resident coalition or pride caught in their territory is viewed as a challenger, doesn’t make much difference if they’re roaring and directly seeking out the males or just finding refuge. The thing this would change is the outcome of the attack from the resident males should it happen, obviously the more aggressive males tend to get a harsher beating. Tumbela is definitely a threat maybe not to the males but their offspring all throughout the West, for whatever reason they’re not taking him as serious as they should.
One reason why he was spared might be because the PCmales respect him as a neighbour and this was just a territorial scruffle with no intentions of gaining territory.
The PCmales wanted the airport, so they took it. Alternatively. The PCmales may have dumped all of their points in ambush and surprise tactics but little in actual combat. So once these tactics fail to give a final blow, they don't really know how to handle the situation next. Skorro by surrendering offered them a way to end the fight. So they backed off. 
I believe that Skorro Jr taking a submissive posture aided in their backing off, but I also think the fact that he was able to bite both of them in the face helped too, akin to what Corky the Hyena did to Dark Mane. When Corky bit Dark Mane in the lip, and briefly held on, he stopped attacking and began pulling away trying to free himself, PCMs did the exact same thing, that, obviously, would hurt like crazy.
Lions survive these types of encounters, often without major damage, all the time, it's just how it is.
Even in a 2v1 scenario, it's not always the attacking coalition will have the bloodlust to do lots of damage like in the Avoca v DeLaporte or PCM v Nhenha fights, or finish the job like the Mapogo v 5th Majingilane fight. These fights to the death are exceptions, most of the time the stronger party is happy with just asserting their dominance because even in a 2v1, there're risks of injuries. 
Call me crazy but I don't think Skorro Jr is a spent or sickly/unhealthy lion. The limp he has isn't that severe, it was earlier on but he has somewhat recovered and was looking in great shape just a couple days ago. I think he gained the respect of the PCMs in that little bit of fighting and they weren't prepared or willing to deal with him on that day. He can't threaten their reign so they let him go on this particular day, he's not a limper where it's clear that it's a lion who can't fight back.
@sik94
No, you're right, he's perfectly healthy, he is an average nomadic lion looking like what an average nomadic lion looks like, and only looks "thin" in the fight because he is next to PCM who are very big and bulky. Look at the video by Mwk85 from a few days ago, post 1,196: https://wildfact.com/forum/topic-the-tum...on?page=80 He's in perfect shape and there's a very insignificant limp I can barely perceive... Males have been dominant and strong while unable to support one of their legs, defeating 100% healthy lions, so this is not an excuse to call him unhealthy. Hell, a sickly male would never be roaring, claiming a territory, especially in PCM territory, he's roaring because he's feeling strong and confident. I've no idea where this narrative that Tumbela is unhealthy comes from.
Nkuhuma male, credits to @andreasithole.
 *This image is copyright of its original author Injuries he got a while ago on his back have healed well:  *This image is copyright of its original author
There are plenty if videos of him looking terrible. So lets not suggest he is 100 percent healthy. Its probably more a Limper type of scenario. Who also was seen limping one day and climbing trees the next.
He also probably isnt the most mentally gifted lion of the Savanna. Antagonizing the PCmales was a stupid move even if 100 percent healthy.  (10-12-2023, 06:31 AM)Mapokser Wrote: Nkuhuma male, credits to @andreasithole.If only he was a strong will fighter as opposed to a strong lover, he'd be very formidable. He's such a big guy. Anyone can see he's up there in size 
@Mapokser
1. You are claiming that with every lion vocalizing he is trying to challenge for territory, we dont understand lion roars that well and we dont know what Tumbela meant with his vocalizing. How do you know that he didnt just try to locate Ximhungwes?? 2. As for fights, yes, not every fight or outcome is the same, because of many reasons. My theory is that Nhenha/NK where existential threat for PCMs, they first ousted them and then Nhenha/NK few times returned and challenge them, PCMs did what they need to secure their rule, by eliminating 1 of their threats. Remaining NK or Tumbela are not existential threats, as they cant defeat them as solo males, so PCMs intensity towards them will not be the same. If a coalition of 2 or more, or lets say 4 Kambulas invade PCMs, intensity will be high, as thats direct existential threat to their rule, if they catch 1 Kambula, they will try to eliminate him, and not let him go after 5 sec as they did with Tumbela. Its all about how lions percieve the fight. Is it worth or important for them to waste energy and risk injury to kill this lion, leopard, hyena etc., if it is, they will kill it (as they could Tumbela there) , if not, they will let him go. 3. As for "if Tumbela is not threat to them, it is to cubs and females". Males dont care much about that stuff, just look how PCMs "care" about their offspring in Mhangeni pride, they dont even visit them that often. Males care about their territory, when they lose territory, they are out, they dont stay and protect their offspring, like females. 4. I didnt deny that PCMs catch Tumbela before, I just want evidence. With social media there is so much false info around or invented narratives. I just want someone to confirm this story, how do we know that maybe 4 Kambulas, or 2 Talamatis who hanged there at that time, or even Mhangenis didnt attack him. 5. As for Tumbela health, even before this injury, he looked quite skinny on occasions, you add to that leg problems and thats a reason for concerne. On few sighting he looked scary thin. Weight problems + leg problems are symptoms for a disease, "black spot" disease has that symptoms, which many lions here had. I hope its only injury, but i dont think we can say it with 100% that it is, just compare him from 2022 and now, that male was one of the most impressive males in Sabi Sands. Ok, he is nomad now, so life is tough, but we are not vets to claim that he is 100% healthy besides that leg injury, who nobody saw how he got it or if even it occure as injury. 6. In the end we dont know with 100% certainty what is going on, we dont know what lions think and why they behave like that, we dont know what Tumbela is up to, why PCMs look like tolerate him to extend, about Tumbelas health etc. Your and my opinions are basically speculations, and might be completley wrong. I like Tumbela too, im just point out what i see
Skorro Junior Tumbella and NK could have made a collation, but strangely they broke up. Since then NK has had solo nomads who are worthy of unionization but still seems to be alone. He is a big man and has been in a fight, but he always seemed to lack confidence.. It's such a sad scene for Tumbella to be attacked. Many people on the internet are enthusiastic about a strong and large union of numbers and, like Mapogos, hope that all the lions fight mercilessly, brutally killing and bleeding their opponents... In reality, lions are not so common as to kill or eat their opponents so cruelly. We will never know what the lions are thinking now, nor do we know what they are thinking. However, I am so heartbroken and depressed to see Tumbella being attacked today and NK's eye injury (although it happened a long time ago).. I wish Tumbella and NK would form a coalition and trust each other and regain their confidence.. I'm so depressed..Forgive me if I am grammatically rude in English because I use Google Translator. Thank you to friends of all forums.
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