There is a world somewhere between reality and fiction. Although ignored by many, it is very real and so are those living in it. This forum is about the natural world. Here, wild animals will be heard and respected. The forum offers a glimpse into an unknown world as well as a room with a view on the present and the future. Anyone able to speak on behalf of those living in the emerald forest and the deep blue sea is invited to join.
02-14-2017, 08:36 PM( This post was last modified: 02-14-2017, 08:36 PM by Tshokwane )
(02-14-2017, 07:39 PM)Polar Wrote: There are plenty of reasoning skills a lion must possess in order to simply decide not to help his brother out and secure a territory instead, not to mention the sheer amount of reasoning intellect, environmental know-how, and physical intelligence (ass-kicking skills and how to use them) needed simply to control the territory.
Two things with this.
1- They are definitely intelligent. I'm not saying they're not. What I'm saying is that the way they think, they way they reason is based on the instincts imprinted in their DNA. They do not reason like we do, in an abstract way. That's the difference.
2- I don't think they're avoiding him. The thing is, they have to patrol anyway, and if they stayed at his side all day, everyday, then what would happen to the territory? What would happen to the prides and the young cubs they're looking after? Because let's not forget the primary reason they moved more east was to stay with the Mangheni pride.
So there's a lot of factors involved in this, and one more that's not mentioned anywhere else is that maybe it's Hip scar that's avoiding them. Maybe he knows he's weak and doesn't want to be a burden on them, so he stays alone.
02-14-2017, 09:19 PM( This post was last modified: 02-14-2017, 09:21 PM by Polar )
Maybe lions don't have the ability to reason in abstract terms such as us, but "abstract" to them might be different from "abstract" to us. There are lions (like bears and primates) who can appreciate nature's beauty and nature as it is, and quite possibly, to think about philosophical thoughts like we do (although probably not in the depth as we do), but they might do it somehow. Lions (and most other wild animals) reason more concretely, or less abstract, then we do simply because of mental patterns (DNA) and the need to survive in their circumstances, with carnivores being the most adaptable animal family along with hominids. Environmental and physical concerns are more reality-based and more practical than philosophical or creative-thought concerns, thus more concrete thinking.
Humans and especially modern humans, on the other hand, are more creative thinkers and are probably number one when it comes to creation. That is what makes us ultimately identifiable from most other species. We seem to be better at abstract thinking than concrete thinking since the creative, linguistic, and socializing portions of our brain are the largest. So it would make sense that lions don't always rely on instincts just as we don't always do so, either. In fact, most of our actions are still based on our natural instincts; relationships (female validation), sizing/eyeing up other men for possible competition, and other few instincts not listed.
DNA does play a very limited part in some of the mental wiring of lions and humans (the rest is from environment and experience), but lions tend to direct most of their intelligence from their concrete environment, while humans (especially modern ones) think more so of philosophical and creative concepts, although early humans thought much more concretely due to the need for survival and adaptation to physical environment.
I just remember the Sideliner's explanation which seems very good: by securing their territory, the brother allow Hipscar to perhaps recover his health and vigor. Hipscar is alone, thus he doesn't interfere with his brothers by being not a burden for them as Tshokwane says. Although this behaviour is able to be hard for some sensitive souls, it is clearly the best available option.
02-15-2017, 06:16 PM( This post was last modified: 02-15-2017, 06:20 PM by Fredymrt )
From londolozi Feel a Lion’s Roar
by Callum Gowar on February 15, 2017 0
One of the first things that fascinated me when I started guiding at Londolozi was the lion pride dynamics and working with tracker, Freddy Ngobeni, it was something I started learning about immediately. Upon my arrival, the Matimba male lions had established territory around the Londolozi Camps, a place that had previously been held by the Majingilane males. Although the Matimbas roared to mark their territory, it was rather sporadic and something that countless staff members mentioned was that when the Majingilane held this territory, they could be heard roaring from the airstrip almost every night. So a few nights ago, when this coalition of three were back on the Londolozi airstrip, I planned to spend the evening with them, hoping to hear what all the fuss was about.
*This image is copyright of its original author
Manjingi air sunset-2184
The calm before the storm. A Manjigilane male settles down on the airstrip with the magical sunset in the background.
The Majingilane coalition were left sleeping in the shade of a Tamboti tree thicket that morning in very close proximity to the airstrip. Needing absolutely no persuasion, Freddy Ngobeni jumped at the idea of potentially viewing the Majingilane brothers roaring on the airstrip as night began to fall.
We opted to gradually explore around the nearby dams and water holes, enjoying the deafening snorts and groans from hippos in the water whilst the crocodiles basked on the sunny banks. Knowing that the Majingilane males would only start getting active once the heat of the day had subsided, we continued on slowly, watching herds of giraffe and zebra feeding on the lush vegetation whilst the sun slowly began to set. Having reiterated the pre-arranged plan to my guests throughout our drive, our tactically delayed arrival at the airstrip was exciting and the energy on the vehicle was palpable.
*This image is copyright of its original author
Heron sunset silh-2176
Whilst driving towards the airstrip, we could not resist stopping to appreciate a silhouette of a Grey Heron in the beautiful setting sun.
As we arrived at the airstrip, one of the males walked purposefully towards the tarmac and his brother proceeded to follow, I hoped that this was the moment! Sitting there in silence, we heard the faint and distant calls of the Matsipiri males south and east of us. The Majingilane perked their heads up, listening intently to the distant roars and it didn’t take long before the Majingilane brothers felt compelled to respond. Their gut-wrenching roars bellowed through the night sky and their echoes reverberated around us. The intensity of the sound that comes from three large male lions dotted around you is something to behold. It felt to me as though shivers were running straight through my bones and the sound thundered in my chest.
*This image is copyright of its original author
Majigi airstrip sun-2199
One the Manjigilane males listens intently to the distant roars of the other male coalitions.
As they quietened and the silence settled on us yet again, we heard even fainter calls of the Matimba males further up in the northern reaches of the Sabi Sands. Listening intently to the distant calls of both the Matsipiri and Matimba males, the Majingilane brothers continued to respond and were heard roaring around the vicinity of camp throughout the night. We were literally watching and hearing the trio of coalitions settling their disputes and establishing territorial boundaries in this aerial battle for supremacy. The beautiful setting sun and darkening skies made for a beautiful landscape, the perfect backdrop for this dream sighting and experience
The three of them can do with a good meal tonight - to build up their strength for upcoming challenges to their throne. Really hope Hipscar gets a good meal from somewhere - he needs it most of all.
Rob says: "Judging by the last time we saw his tracks and the vulture and hyena activity it seems he died sometime in the last 36 - 48 hours. Tracks suggest that the three remaining Majingilanes have also dragged his carcass around during the early hours of yesterday morning, there is indication that they may have actually fed on the carcass but it is hard to determine due to the combined scavenger activity there."
History's most brutal killers, the Majingilane Male Lions
