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Bears
Bear Strength
Bear Strength
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Bear Strength
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I know, not the most reliable source but they get the definition right. @Polar I've been reading some of your posts before I join but there is a part I don't really understand, you said in one of your post that some type of slow twitch muscle fiber present in bear (type I iirc) was more suited for brute strenght than any other type, (fast twitch or slow twicht). What make him more suited for this sort of task?  (05-01-2017, 04:11 AM)HyperNova Wrote: @ Haven't visited this thread in almost a WHOLE year lol. @HyperNova, if you are still active here, Type Ib fibers are more suited for sustained, more-linearly growing muscle force (slow strength) and those are part of the Type I fiber family. Originally, there was only one Type I muscle fiber that was theorized, and that was Ia muscle fiber for consistent endurance (barely any force produced), but new research is showing another type that incorporates Type II characteristics which is Type Ib. 
Credits to Keremeos Review.
Grizzlies destroy bear-proof bin: It wasn’t a record-setting time, but the two Yukon grizzly bears at the BC Wildlife Park in east Kamloops were eating lunch in short order on Wednesday. Each year at the park, WildSafe BC tests bear-bin products to determine just how impervious they really are to a bruin. No bin is considered to be fully bear-proof, so in order to be certified bear-resistant through WildSafe’s program, this year’s plastic compost bin — equipped with eight locks on the lid — needed to withstand the bears’ efforts for an hour without any food shaking loose. Zookeeper Danielle Rogers loaded the bins with items such as dog food, fruits, meat and fish, as well as a few additional incentives, including peanut butter and jam. “Basically, what we’ve got out there is their regular diet and the additional [incentives] would be stuff we use to attract them over to it,” Rogers said, noting that after many tests, the bears can lose interest. But there was plenty of interest in this bin. The 270-kilogram (600-pound) Knute and his 160-kilogram (350-pound) sister Dawson came running over to check it out. The grizzlies started off by licking some of the peanut butter smeared around the locks, which led them to roll the composter, nibbling and clawing at it. Knute seemed to lose interest quickly, but a persistent Dawson kept at it, rolling the bin around their enclosure. When Knute tried to tag back in, Dawson was quick to push him away and even jumped on top of the bin when he got too close. Nearing the 30-minute mark, a stealthy Knute managed to sneak back on the job. After more rolling, and with some of the latches having already been broken off, he pulled away one final latch with his teeth and peeled the lid back. A cheer rang out from the crowd that had gathered and the two bears began to feast after about a half-hour on the job. The record for the bears is well under the minute mark, WildSafe BC provincial co-ordinator Frank Ritcey told KTW. Having been opened after just 30 minutes, the bin failed to pass the test, so it will go back to the manufacturer, which will need to strengthen the weak points. “They’ll redesign it, send it back and we’ll re-test it,” Ritcey said, noting the bins seldom pass the bear test on the first try. “We’ve had as many as three tests to get a product through,” he said. But Ritcey said he was impressed with how well this bin fared. “One of the things that I learned from the test is that the plastic and the design of the bin itself is very rigid. The bears were not able to compress that at all,” he said, noting the latches were the Achilles heel. “That’s what they’ll have to redesign, is how that latching system works, but the integrity of the walls and the lid were intact,” he said. WildSafe BCs testing program is run in association with the North American Testing of Bear Resistant Products every year at the BC Wildlife Park. Containers that last an hour of contact time receive official certification and are posted on the WildSafe BC website. “The BC Wildlife Park here is an incredibly valuable resource for the province,” Ritcey said. “Without a testing program like this, people wouldn’t know what a bear-resistant bin really is. You’ll find a lot of products that are marked as being wildlife resistant and bear resistant and they’re really not.” Most of B.C. is bear country and most residents would benefit from having certified bear-resistant garbage cans and composter, Ritcey said. The bin tests show just how easy it is for bears to break into a container, Rogers said, noting some people think a bungee cord will be enough to keep them out. “That kind of thing doesn’t work,” she said. “If you can see that a unit has a full locking system on it and a bear can still get it open, then you realize that when you’re dealing with your curbside container, just sticking a bungee cord on there isn’t going to work.” Have you ever wondered how strong a grizzly bear is? Well as you can see, Knute, the male grizzly bear at the park, has no issue making this large tire move.
10-23-2018, 03:04 PM
( This post was last modified: 10-23-2018, 04:42 PM by Shadow
Edit Reason: addition
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What comes to bear strength and tests, those tell maybe something. But I find it odd, that we know next to nothing even about documented tests like the one in start of this thread. No photos showing test wall and conditions, not even some drawing to demonstrate what it was all about. Not too much details so, that someone could for instance repeat same test in same conditions and compare. It is actually quite difficult to make too much conclusions about tests, which are not known too good. Maybe there is somewhere more information about that test. I admit, that I looked at it only breafly, but some "wall" was dragged and in some way pulled upwards I think. No comparison with some strong man for instance doing exactly same things. Odd.
But here is a video, which demonstrates quite good, that bear is pretty strong and capable. "Action" starts to heat up in about 1:35. I would say, that quite impressive wrestling there. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SqqG_LUss0 Ps. I checked again that power test. That lifting a barbel with 387 kg weight was truly impressive from that bear. That is a weight, which most men couldn´t even hope to lift at all, I mean not lift even half an inch from ground, only get back hurt badly if trying too hard. That lift is maybe most impressive show of strength I can remember from any mammal compared to size of that bear. Dragging and pulling heavy objects is much easier than many realize, but actually lifting like in that test. That is undeniable strength. When reading that text, it gives strong indication, that bear wasn´t even close to maximum with that weight. When comparing that to Eddie Hall, who deadlifted 500 kg practically fainting after that lift and suffered afterwards about multiple symptoms caused by extreme effort. And which is most ever lifted by a man and at the time Hall was himself about 180 kg or so. Here we have a bear 83,7 kg, who lifted with ease 387 kg and might lift even double or triple that weight if really trying hard (if we believe what those scientists said). That is quite something. 
I have watched that video numerous times. It shows the strength and wrestling ability of the grizzly she-bear as well as her courage and determination to feed her cubs and herself. Also, those caribou antlers are sharp. I could almost hear "the gears grinding" in the bear's head - bears are thinkers. Great video Shadow.
(10-23-2018, 04:21 PM)brotherbear Wrote: I have watched that video numerous times. It shows the strength and wrestling ability of the grizzly she-bear as well as her courage and determination to feed her cubs and herself. Also, those caribou antlers are sharp. I could almost hear "the gears grinding" in the bear's head - bears are thinkers. Great video Shadow. Adult predators show quite good their experience and it was obvious, that this bear understood danger with antlers. Anyway here we could see a predator making an attack without surprise element and practically "wrestling" opponent to fall down. Not an easy task to do when prey is bigger than predator. And before someone rush to say "that it bite also that caribou", I would add, that I know it and I saw it, but this was still impressive. Still when I read that research from Russia, it is maybe even more surprising. I mean many times people talk about gorilla making comparison how many times stronger it is than a human (never it is quite clear if comparison is to average man or someone really strong and we never have anything where to compare actually). Then here we have a test showing, that bear lifts 4,6 times it´s weight and wasn´t even close to maximum. There we have one very comparable result from a bear now. Anyone can go to gym and test. But I think, that this is quite unknown test though. I find it surprising when knowing how interested so many are about animal strength. And there we have a 83,7 kg bear showing to be most probably stronger, than strongest man ever. And I don´t mean now about that pound for pound alone, but I mean, that how much it can lift actually compared to a man, who lifts more weight from ground than anyone else. Those scientists seemed to think, that it could have lifted anything between 770-1100 kg. Even if they would be wrong, we have a fact, that this bear lifted about 400 kg just like that, effortlessly. I think, that it is quite safe to assume, that at least anything between 500-600 kg would be possible and that alone is quite something. I think, that most untrained men weighing 84 kg would have hard time to lift even 100-120 kg. Someone trained would lift maybe 140-160 kg. Trained powerlifters (with steroids... oh, sorry, of course they are all "clean" ;  ) then more, but still nowhere close to what this bear did there.1 pound is 0,454 kg, so 400 kg is about 881 lbs.  (10-23-2018, 05:23 PM)Shadow Wrote:(10-23-2018, 04:21 PM)brotherbear Wrote: I have watched that video numerous times. It shows the strength and wrestling ability of the grizzly she-bear as well as her courage and determination to feed her cubs and herself. Also, those caribou antlers are sharp. I could almost hear "the gears grinding" in the bear's head - bears are thinkers. Great video Shadow. You should read through our discussion on this starting around post #39 "The pull test showed that both bears needed to exert full force or almost full force to pull that weight and did fairly close to each others time. I have seen my coach pull massive trucks, so I'm a bit jaded there. What I am surprised about is the deadlift weight of 387 kg for a bear weighing 85kg and he did it with ease and could of doubled or tripled that weight. We have a 125lber (maybe smaller) and he pulls around 525 on the dl... Or about 54kg to pull 240kg. So very close to the Bears pull, the difference is that is his max while the bear could of possibly doubled or tripled that. So it is safe to say that these two bears are at least double the strength of an equal sized professional power lifter or roughly triple the strength of a comparable male human." Obviously overall the bear will be much stronger compared to a man lb for lb, but really you should only compare men in great physical condition, not the "average man" because even a captive animal still is an active animal when compared to a man, animals never sit behind a desk for 8 hours a day and stuff their face, their diet is regimented and they're day consists exercise, sleeping and eating. It's obviously not comparable to the true wild but compared to the average man, it may as well be. Aside from lifestyle differences, you also have morphological differences that make it impossible to compare human strength to bear strength. To be honest, I believe men would compare far better to pulling strength than lifting strength of a Bear, but even then its still going to favor a Bear, regardless.
One problem ( one of many ) in comparing human strength with animal strength is the fact that the man knows and understands the contest. How do you get a wild animal to "give it his all"? And, how do you know when he does?
(10-23-2018, 09:01 PM)Pckts Wrote:(10-23-2018, 05:23 PM)Shadow Wrote:(10-23-2018, 04:21 PM)brotherbear Wrote: I have watched that video numerous times. It shows the strength and wrestling ability of the grizzly she-bear as well as her courage and determination to feed her cubs and herself. Also, those caribou antlers are sharp. I could almost hear "the gears grinding" in the bear's head - bears are thinkers. Great video Shadow. I don´t know what you mean by that, that I should read your discussion from starting post. I now commented mostly about that research and especially that lifting there, because it is very easy to compare to humans. There is no need to make it too complicated, when we are having there a bear lifting a barbell from ground. So we can easily compare that strength to normal... should I say "lazy ass" man, then it is pretty easy to compare to someone who is more active and have decent condition and then again also compare to strongest there are. I have noticed that sometimes people make actually quite simple things complicated. Here we have now a very simple test, bear lifting almost 400 kg from ground easily and weighing about 84 kg. So we have there easy comparison to humans with different conditions. We really don´t have too much this kind of information about many animals, instead a lot of speculation. That is why I am in a way surprised, that this test seems to be quite unknown. About pull tests some extra info would be nice to know. now there is space for speculation. (10-23-2018, 09:06 PM)brotherbear Wrote: One problem ( one of many ) in comparing human strength with animal strength is the fact that the man knows and understands the contest. How do you get a wild animal to "give it his all"? And, how do you know when he does? It is. What comes to this test and which is, as I have said, interesting. Here we have a very unambiguous test, where bear lifted impressive weight with ease. So even without giving all, it made it crystal clear, that it is way stronger than human, no matter if that human is average man or strongest there is. And this test is so simple as it can be, no guessing about surface where something was pulled or was there wheels and if not, what material was pulled item and what kind of friction.... I demonstrate what I mean by documentation. This video leaves nothing unclear. This is also a test, which anyone can repeat anytime and be sure, that results are comparable. Of course it is a competition, but I am amazed how little we have footage or even photos of some tests. With footage like this there would be a lot less "what if" and "but". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBy9Bz6NrXE Btw. I think, that bear wouldn´t do that same what those horses do.
Great information Shadow. And I agree that a bear could not out-pull one of hose huge draft horse.
(10-23-2018, 09:40 PM)Shadow Wrote:(10-23-2018, 09:01 PM)Pckts Wrote:(10-23-2018, 05:23 PM)Shadow Wrote:(10-23-2018, 04:21 PM)brotherbear Wrote: I have watched that video numerous times. It shows the strength and wrestling ability of the grizzly she-bear as well as her courage and determination to feed her cubs and herself. Also, those caribou antlers are sharp. I could almost hear "the gears grinding" in the bear's head - bears are thinkers. Great video Shadow. I'm not disagreeing, I just wanted to make sure you were aware of the different muscles and technique used to do a Deadlift (what the bear did) compared to a squat or a pull. I also wanted to show you that a man is capable of deadlifting the same ratio as the Bear used in this experiment, but the ease of which the Bear did it obviously confirms that isn't the maximum for the Bear & the man I used to compare is the upper tier of strength for his size. On a side note, I feel fairly confident that a Gorilla would be able to deadlift far more weight to bodyweight ratio than a Bear would simply off of it's morphology. A Gorilla has long arms, short legs, a huge back and biceps and extremely strong hips and thus they wouldn't need to lift the weight as far off the ground and they are technically built superior to a Bear for this task, but I would never say that a 200kg Gorilla is stronger than a 200kg Bear, both would have certain tasks that they could outperform the other.
Grizzly compared with Gorilla:
 *This image is copyright of its original author  *This image is copyright of its original author
(10-23-2018, 10:42 PM)Pckts Wrote:Yes, I noticed, that no disagreement there. I wanted to "highlight" this deadlift (or kind of), because we have so many testings, which are badly documented and results are pretty much always arguable. We can have some figures but everything else is more or less unclear and almost impossible to compare one test to another. Even this russian test is from 2003 and no photos or video footage. I keep that astonishing and not in the good way. Old saying is, that one picture tells more than a thousand words and it is so many times so true.(10-23-2018, 09:40 PM)Shadow Wrote:(10-23-2018, 09:01 PM)Pckts Wrote:(10-23-2018, 05:23 PM)Shadow Wrote:(10-23-2018, 04:21 PM)brotherbear Wrote: I have watched that video numerous times. It shows the strength and wrestling ability of the grizzly she-bear as well as her courage and determination to feed her cubs and herself. Also, those caribou antlers are sharp. I could almost hear "the gears grinding" in the bear's head - bears are thinkers. Great video Shadow. Luckily this one test was as simple as it was and they actually managed to make the bear to do it and looks like, that also so, that animals were treated ok. At least they made it lift only that 387 kg and not forcing it to go to limits. Or maybe they didn´t have room to load more weights to that barbell  I mentioned gorilla, because it is so often praised about it how strong it is. Strong it for sure is, I don´t doubt that. Still in videos, which I have been able to find, I have seen bears doing more impressive things showing strength compared to what can be found of gorillas. Brotherbear mentioned some old document, where gorilla broke bamboo. It would be very interesting to see that footage, but I know, that there are many old documents, which are not in youtube or anywhere in internet and very hard to track down decades afterwards. It is just, that many zoologists say, that gorilla bites bamboo before breaking it making it easier to bend and break. So those old footages would be very interesting to see to check things which maybe were missed when watching something with less critical view than later when more information about animals. I can´t say if gorilla is stronger than bear or vice versa. It can be as you assume, but that is speculation as so many other things. That is why I was happy to notice this thread and that test from Russia. It would be very interesting if researchers would some day develop some comparable test, which different animals could carry out in decent way so, that they might even kind of have fun while doing it. Like those horses on video, damn they were eager to pull But what comes to bear strength, this one test proved to me, that even "steroid boosted" men are not at same level. I assume, that that test is legit by science community. |
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