Request here to join invite only forum

[peter]

(07-13-2019, 11:07 PM)Sully Wrote: Are there any updates on when you will start accepting again?

The new section is more or less finished, but I'm not done in the preparation department. The first post will be on the size of Amur tigers. I intend to compare them to Indian and Nepal tigers. In order to get there, I have to go over everything I have and do a number of tables. As those interested need to pay to see them, they have to be good. Might take a while.

As to an invited-only debate in the trainer tread.

Some weeks ago, there was a bit of animosity in the tiger thread. As Cooper was involved again, he was banned. After the ban, I got pm's of posters visting other forums. They said (parts of) my posts were posted and discussed at another forum. I visited the forum and read a few posts. I also read a post of Kathlee, a member of Wildfact. Kathlee, a former trainer, apparently posted at other forums as well. In one of her posts, used in the forum I visited, she said she was a bit disappointed about Wildfact. One reason was her mentors had been discredited. Another was her credibility had been questioned. 

After reading her post, I read the trainers thread over here. I didn't see anything out of the ordinary. What I saw was quite the opposite; after she had posted, she got a warm welcome from different posters. One of them was yours truly. In order to encourage her, I posted a list with questions.

So why did she say her mentors had been discredited at Wildfact? And why did she say her credibility had been questioned? And why did she not contact us and decided to complain about Wildfact elsewhere?

When I was trying to find answers to these questions, new questions popped up. Why, I wondered, would an experienced trainer decide to discuss big cats at a place loaded with people who, as a result of a lack of knowledge, decided for preference? A place where reality is regarded as fiction? And why would she, on top of that, want to discuss fights with them? Of all people? 

I decided for music a long time ago. Would I be willing to talk music with someone who just burned and looted the last music school in Amsterdam? 

All, and I mean all, directors, handlers and trainers I interviewed didn't want to talk about fights. Those able to overcome their distrust, to a degree, only opened up after they decided they could trust me. Meaning I wouldn't use the info I got. In all cases, it took many hours, if not days, to get them to talk and all of those who lost animals felt bad about it. They had known the animals killed in fights intimately, knew these animals relied on them and felt they had let them down.    

I know some trainers have a very different attitude, but they are the exception and often have clear motives. Talking money here. Beatty, for example, knew how to sell his act and the books he wrote. Kathlee, as far as I know, didn't write a book.  

What I'm saying is I'm not sure about her. Not at all. I never saw a direct answer to the questions I asked and she didn't seem interested in a conversation about things often discussed by trainers. There's something peculiar about her, meaning I have a few questions. But I decided against it.

Was she another creation of those banned? Was it another attempt to get access to Wildfact and discredit the one often used by tiger posters in debates? Another attempt to create a bit of animosity? And, perhaps, eliminate a competitor? Far-fetched? Our experience says no.  

Lions, tigers and fights often attract people who easily beat a decent toothache. I know, because I saw many of them in facilities and in organisations in which big cats featured in some way or another. They like the thrill, Sully. Raw, authentic power. And danger. Not too close for comfort, but danger it is. At the expense of others, of course. You would be surprised about the number of people interested in lethal fights. 

When you debate big cats and fights at a forum, you think you debate people guided by knowledge, common sense, logic and real interest. People who know about these animals. Not so. Experience says you often debate people with more aliases than you can think of. They're clever and can lead you into alleys you never heard of. They don't care about animals, but something else. This is why we decided against lions, tigers and fights.

Why not focus on the world around you? We're interested in the attempts to reintroduce wolves, birds of prey and lynxes. We want to know a bit more about big cat sightings and those who know about them. The UK has a lot of natural history museums that have big cat skulls. You could post a list with natural history museums. Not the well-known museums, but the smaller ones. I might want to come over and measure these skulls. You could also try to locate those who hunted big cats almost a century ago in British India. And those who stayed to start a safari business or something like that. My guess is there is a lot of information in the UK. Attics, that is. What you find, would contribute to more knowledge about a period all but unknown to most of us. See what you can do.

If you want to contribute to the trainer thread, find trainers willing to talk about their experiences. Remember we don't want general statements, but good information, details and specifics. We want to know why they got to conclusions and we want to know all about the animals involved in conflicts. When you find a trainer, prepare questions. Take your time. Record the conversation if possible. When they disagree, make notes. When you got something of interest, post it. My advice is to interview as many trainers as possible. Based on my experience, I'd say most of them would be willing to talk, provided they can trust you. Ask them for permission to use their answers over here. Good luck. Reply