Tiger-Lion Coexistence in Eurasia between Middle Pleistocene and Holocene Epochs

[Sanju]

(04-09-2019, 11:16 AM)Spalea Wrote: I'm convinced too that tigers and lions coexisted before in such places like Gir forest. And also in other countries like Iran. We have just to take a look on their respective range/habitats during the pleistocene and holocene periods to be sure of that.

Even if tigers and lions don't prefer exactly the same biotops, they were able to intersect, to cross each other at the boundaries of these prefered biotops. A sort of mutual reconnaissance could have prevailed... I think it was unavoidable from time to time.

couldn't have said better myself. Aggressive interactions between "sympatric" predators due to direct competition of dietary overlap is common through out the world since life of dinosaurs or theropods. These encounters may or may not leads to fights and even rarely deaths. That totally depends. Both the apex predators or ultimate carnivores life style and social behavior is different. As Asiatic lion female group size is 4 to 6 and male is 2. Tiger usually live solo.

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

https://cbs.umn.edu/research/labs/lionresearch/faq

Coexistence means not friendship. It means just living in same place. Fights, encounters and deaths may not occur in large scale but can occur on small scale when inter-species competition exists.

Quote:Pocock thought that it was unlikely that serious competition between them regularly occurred, and that even if Indian lions and tigers met, the chance that they would fight for survival was as good as the chance that they would choose to avoid each other, and that their chances of success, if they were to clash, were as good as each other's.

https://archive.org/stream/PocockMammali...1/mode/2up

Like pocock said in most cases, lion outnumbers tiger, tiger avoids and always will be alert to avoid lions. Vice versa, lone lions will be on alert and avoids possible confrontation with tigers.
But accidental coincidence or confrontation may lead to fight (rarely death too) which may not end as death or escape with injuries. As animals can be anywhere in a given area at a given instant of time in the vast forest land or wilderness. But again these animal are versatile if needed but prefer to lived in their own habitats. Kuno is more grassier and plapur is forest"ier".

we all know life and death is continuous process, this natural competition should exist in a place which maintains balance in ecosystem for limited prey and water resources.

The deaths due to competition will replenish with new birth of individuals or cubs and will settle as a stable population at the carrying capacity of the reserve area.

Albeit, Tiger presence in kuno sporadic as one permanent male T 38 living for 9 yrs there. Others are transient males which live temporary as there is over 120 km gap b/w ranth and kuno with highly fragment forest links and river, highways and human limitation b/w them. This journey or migration can only be done by some males from ranth can but females won't. Hence, only man made translocation of tigers can start a breeding unit or metapopulation of tigers in kuno. If not these spilling ranth males only appear time to time wandering dying without mates continues. No permanent stable tiger population will exist in kuno.

(04-09-2019, 11:16 AM)Spalea Wrote: And that in a park that would quickly risk to become a too restricted place for these two apex predators... This park should be restructured, I think.

Kuno forest landscape is a huge area of nearly 3500 km2; in it 1200 km2 wildlife division and 800 km2 National park. There is plenty of space and prey for lions and tigers and their population will stabilized according to availability of prey.

Nevertheless after sometime it will be filled like many tiger reserves and lion reserves of Africa. It's universal and animals move out naturally after saturation of the population inside PAs. In this human world man-animal conflict is inevitable but the point here, humans should try their best to conserve them at least "in the" natural reserves.

To manage conflicts and preserve animals inside forests, forest dept administration is created in India. Reply

[smedz]

(11-10-2018, 06:53 PM)Sanju Wrote: This thread should be about the discussion of coexistence in b/w Lion and Tiger in Eurasian Wilderness in Late Pleistocene to Holocene's 19th century. Though they lived together only in small part of Europe continent i.e.., south-eastern Europe it is still a part of the continent.

Coexisted Ones:

• In Late Pleistocene:- Tiger Subspecies like Wanhesian or Panthera tigris acutidens---------with Pleistocene Lion species like ancient ancestral primitive lion like Panthera leo precursor like Sinhaleyus subspecies; Panthera vereshchagini or Beringian Cave Lion and  Panthera Spelaea (not fossilis).
  

• In Holocene:- Tiger Subspecies like Amur; Bengal; Indochinese and Caspian tiger (all come under tigris or mainland subspecies)---------------with Modern/Holocene lion subspecies like Asiatic lion (Panthera leo persica/leo) and European lion (Panthera leo europea/leo).
  

These coexisted for over 50,000-30,000 of years preferring different habitats in the same Ecoregion and it is the major reason for the implementation of Asiatic Lion Reintroduction Project to Madhya Pradesh’s Kuno and Rajasthan’s Sita, Khumbalgarh analogous to Yellow stone wolf reintroduction (apex predator) to restore ecological diversity and balance of open biomes.

In ecology, they are two types of Inter-species interactions in Animal communities which we can discuss here leaving others like Symbiosis, Mutualism, Parasitism  etc...

  1. Competition is one of the most ubiquitous of species interactions. It occurs any time a resource that is essential to growth and reproduction (e.g., food, shelter, nesting sites) occurs in short supply. The acquisition of the resource by one individual simultaneously deprives others’ access to it, and this has a negative effect on the fitness of individuals and the per capita growth rates of populations. Competition is thus an interaction that has mutually negative effects on the participants.

   2. Coexistence results when populations of several species that utilize the same limiting resources manage to persist within the same locality. Competition exists b/w all species occupying and functioning in a niche. Coexistence, helps in reducing the effect of competition but can't extinguish it completely. Coexistence theory is a framework to understand how competitor traits can maintain species diversity and stave-off competitive exclusion even among similar species living in ecologically similar environments. Coexistence theory explains the stable coexistence of species as an interaction between two opposing forces: fitness differences between species, which should drive the best-adapted species to exclude others within a particular ecological niche, and stabilizing mechanisms, which maintains diversity via niche differentiation.

Strategy for Coexistence:
It is the same like other territorial animals mainly Carnivorous mammals.

Pack-Pack (Both Social): This is the most successful match up  Lion-Dhole or Indian Wild Dog [in the past], Lion-Hyena (spotted/striped too sometimes forms clans), Lion- African Wild Dog, Brown Bear-Wolf, Hyena (spotted)-Wild Dog  etc.., you name it.

Solitary-Solitary: This is least successflul most of the time the superior one eliminates inferior due to competitive exclusion or extinction (eg: Bear Dog-Daeodon, in case of predatory  Dinosaurs competitions etc..,) Leopard-Cheetah, Leopard-tiger, Sloth Bear-Tiger, Black bear-Sloth bear, Brown bear-Black Bear, Puma-Jaguar, Spectacled Bear-Jaguar, Brown bear-Wolf, Tiger Shark-Great White, Lynx-Wolverine, Sun Bear-Tiger, Asiatic Black Bear-Tiger, Bear-Boar etc..., you name it.

Pack-Solitary: This combination is the one of the  most successful like Tiger-Dhole, Lion-Leopard, Tiger-Wolf, Leopard-Wolf, Leopard-Wild Dog genus, Puma-Wolf, Sloth bear-Wolf, Sloth Bear-Wild Dog, Striped Hyena-Asiatic Lion, Cheetah-Wild Dogs, Hyenas-Cheetah, Orca-Great White, Lynx-Wolf, Wolverine-wolf, Striped Hyena-Wolf (Arabian mainly), Asiatic Lion-Wolf (past)  are some of the examples of recent times and uncountable of such examples are there since Territorial animals evolution from Amphibians to Dinos to Birds and Mammals. Another Example is our discussion topic i.e.., Lion and Tiger coexistence or co-occurrence to avoid competitive exclusion.

Please once read this typical example of inter-specific interactions #152  #17 solitary-pack interaction in b/w wolf-dhole and striped hyena and wolf throughout Asia.

Did the wolves attack or lunge on the lone striped hyena, can't they win at the last at what cost? some pack members death? animals are not dumb. why would they? is it a prey? whats the need? is it an rival pack or even its own species/clade/genus/family in taxonomy?

Can't Dholes go on killing spree over jackals/foxes/similar packed and similar sized wolves in Asia?
Same questions:
Did the dholes attack or lunge on the small wolves packs, can't they win at the last at what cost? some pack members death? animals are not brainless. why would they? is it a prey? or whats the need? is it an rival pack or even its own species/clade/genus/family in taxonomy?

Even sometimes these interactions become mutualistic or symbiotic beneficial attachments like in #17.

Just don't say FIGHT C'mon bring them on. I don't want to see them fighting in putting both the same area in wild. Its dangerous, they are mortal enemies from past lives. Its revenge. (w**). Think!!!

Some of the animals particularly, Big cats are intelligent, they avoid unnecessary fights with other equally strong/more powerful animal species (except when the opposite animal type is inferior) at all costs which leads to injuries and sometimes death directly or indirectly due to infections of wounds occurred during brawls and damage to body parts bringing disability in either survival or hunting. They are extremely territorial towards conspecies. They do this to ensure the mating rights to ensure passage of  superior genes and to avoid competition for resources which are limited in a given particular area i.e.., territory or home range.

Any animal species particularly predators see other predatorial species as threat/prey(most of the time it is less likely)/competitor for resources. So, the superior one eliminates the inferior when given chance and the inferior one avoids confrontation or conflict/fight with the superior at all costs and controls competition by killing the juveniles as the other side does to do the same. when threatened for life; it's off-spring or stealing food, the inferior one leaves when there is an escape but when there is no escape fight is inevitable but this scenario is almost impossible in wild. inferior ones that are sick or injured or juveniles on either side to minimize the competition. Animals are not killing or fighting machines they know their life value which is important to continue their own race. yes, competitive exclusion or extinction may happen of an inferior species in inter-specific competition in a particular region partially or entirely but mostly that is in the case of solitary-solitary type conflict or competition in the same niche in the ecosystem.

Tiger-Lion not even prefer to live in the same habitat of the same region even if sometimes overlapped the Lion pride and Tiger don't risk to fight and one of them back off or flee based on the situation. This is addressed by wildlife institute of India, NTCA, IUCN, World Wildlife fund and Wildlife trust of India and many of wildlife conservation bodies or organizations at the national and international level, nature conservationists, experts, modern biologists and scientists, researchers in documents and books to support reintroduction of lions.

Tiger didn't play literally any I mean any role in lion isolation to Gir (No Tiger can be on a killing spree wrath on lion prides without doing their duties of nature like eating, mating etc.., and can't stand a chance against all of them no matter how big, and same goes to lion as they don't "lunge" and "chase" on tigers on site & speculations tiger is not cheetah, it will be caught and eaten. See tiger is not less in speed and they don't chase like it was their prey or other male "lion", it is completely an alien or a weird similar or even bigger sized thing or "species" in where closer to its species) it is the depleting arid habitats naturally and due to humans as humans settlements occur in arid regions as revenue lands (P.S. human civilization associated with water but not in modern times since technology development to utilize ground water) and killing spree of humans through hunting of both the keystone species of the same environment that is Lion and Cheetah of open environments which made the situation even worse for not only them but also other grassland species in decreasing their population resulting in local or sometime entire population extinctions due to ecological imbalance. Only, Indian Wolf remain as a keystone species for very little Indian grassland and scrublands ecosystems. It is also endangered and has only partial effectiveness in ecological functionality in maintaining herbivore population dynamics.

Lion and tiger don't fight for fun unlike in captivity, where the animals are starved and got no way to escape and avoid the fight but to fight until death. It's totally, different in the wild. Both succeeded to live together for thousands of years until 19th-century shortly after humans exterminated and separated them.

P.S. No "vs" information should be  allowed in this topic. Provide further information regarding the once coexisted areas in Europe and Asian nations, history about it, evidences, times to and fro i.e.., when to when, mechanisms or strategies of avoiding excess inter-species competition and impacts on populations, theory of coexistence etc..,
Opinions are welcomed in this thread...

Ah yes, and don't forget, another way predators coexist is to hunt at different times of the day. Example, cheetahs and painted dogs are diurnal animals while lions, leopards, and hyenas are night hunters. The cheetahs and dogs hunt during the day to avoid lions and hyenas. Granted, lions and tigers didn't avoid each other by doing that, but i thought that would be interesting. Reply

[Sanju]

(04-27-2019, 12:39 AM)smedz Wrote: Ah yes, and don't forget, another way predators coexist is to hunt at different times of the day. Example, cheetahs and painted dogs are diurnal animals while lions, leopards, and hyenas are night hunters. The cheetahs and dogs hunt during the day to avoid lions and hyenas.

Of course to avoid direct competition, animals adapt different type of strategies not only them, birds too employ different foraging time periods in a day and so on many kinds are there, Plants bloom or mature at different hours to avoid cross pollination/self pollination.

@smedz

(04-27-2019, 12:39 AM)smedz Wrote: Granted, lions and tigers didn't avoid each other by doing that, but i thought that would be interesting.

The same way lions, leopards and hyenas doing; Tigers, leopards, Indian wolf and Striped Hyena doing ...

Albeit, Tigers are thought to be mainly nocturnal animals and crepuscular predators, ("What is a Tiger? Ecology and Behaviour") but in areas where humans are absent, remote-controlled, hidden camera traps recorded them hunting in daylight. (https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b009smrg)

Where as Lion is usually more diurnal than other big cats, but when persecuted it adapts to being active at night and at twilight (crepuscular) or at dawn and dusk.

Lions have natural predator "competitors" but not any territorial rivals other than conspecies. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lion#Predator_competition)
The same goes for Tigers. (Tiger and it's Natural Competitors)

In the past, lions and tigers reportedly "competed in the wilderness", and didn't have territorial conflicts between them, where their ranges overlapped in Eurasia. Mlekopitajuščie Sovetskogo Soiuza. Moskva: Vysšaia Škola, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_vers...wilderness, Tiger and Lion)

And in case of Tiger_lion gause competitive exclusion principle or gause principle didn't occur even they had identical niches (required identical resources and habitats) they would attempt to live in exactly the same area and would compete for exactly the same resources. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Competitio...erspecific) It is because they have adapted some strategy to avoid competitive exclusion. That's why they coexisted for many years in Eurasia.

Gaur and Banteng coexist despite their direct competition or niche overlap and being species of same genus. So, if animals don't adapt and coevolve (According to evolutionary theory, this competition within and between species for resources is important in natural selection) to figure out how to live and avoid direct competition with fellow natural competitors it results in exclusion or extinction of inferior or weaker competition, if not they can coexist.

They are many evolutionary strategies to mitigate competition like large amount of offspring or growth rate, different habitat preferences, efficient mechanism to utilize resources, different foraging timings or lifestyle etc., etc.., (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Competitio...strategies) Reply

[smedz]

(04-27-2019, 10:21 AM)Sanju Wrote:

(04-27-2019, 12:39 AM)smedz Wrote: Ah yes, and don't forget, another way predators coexist is to hunt at different times of the day. Example, cheetahs and painted dogs are diurnal animals while lions, leopards, and hyenas are night hunters. The cheetahs and dogs hunt during the day to avoid lions and hyenas.

Of course to avoid direct competition, animals adapt different type of strategies not only them, birds too employ different foraging time periods in a day and so on many kinds are there, Plants bloom or mature at different hours to avoid cross pollination/self pollination.

@smedz

(04-27-2019, 12:39 AM)smedz Wrote: Granted, lions and tigers didn't avoid each other by doing that, but i thought that would be interesting.

The same way lions, leopards and hyenas doing; Tigers, leopards, Indian wolf and Striped Hyena doing ...

Albeit, Tigers are thought to be mainly nocturnal animals and crepuscular predators, ("What is a Tiger? Ecology and Behaviour") but in areas where humans are absent, remote-controlled, hidden camera traps recorded them hunting in daylight. (https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b009smrg)

Where as Lion is usually more diurnal than other big cats, but when persecuted it adapts to being active at night and at twilight (crepuscular) or at dawn and dusk.

Lions have natural predator "competitors" but not any territorial rivals other than conspecies. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lion#Predator_competition)
The same goes for Tigers. (Tiger and it's Natural Competitors)

In the past, lions and tigers reportedly "competed in the wilderness", and didn't have territorial conflicts between them, where their ranges overlapped in Eurasia. Mlekopitajuščie Sovetskogo Soiuza. Moskva: Vysšaia Škola, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_vers...wilderness, Tiger and Lion)

And in case of Tiger_lion gause competitive exclusion principle or gause principle didn't occur even they had identical niches (required identical resources and habitats) they would attempt to live in exactly the same area and would compete for exactly the same resources. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Competitio...erspecific) It is because they have adapted some strategy to avoid competitive exclusion. That's why they coexisted for many years in Eurasia.

Gaur and Banteng coexist despite their direct competition or niche overlap and being species of same genus. So, if animals don't adapt and coevolve (According to evolutionary theory, this competition within and between species for resources is important in natural selection) to figure out how to live and avoid direct competition with fellow natural competitors it results in exclusion or extinction of inferior or weaker competition, if not they can coexist.

They are many evolutionary strategies to mitigate competition like large amount of offspring or growth rate, efficient mechanism to utilize resources, different foraging timings or lifestyle etc., etc.., (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Competitio...strategies)

Oh yeah that's right! I remember reading about that in one of my Smithsonian books, thanks for the reminder. You're right, if competitors adapt some strategy to avoid competitive exclusion, they can live together just fine. They way lions and tigers did this sounds to be habitat selection. Lions ruled the open plains and dry forests while Tigers ruled the jungles and tall grasslands, that way they could avoid each other, hence why we don't have many accounts of the 2 animals fighting each other in the wild. So you can say that India, Iran, and the other countries with both animals were kingdoms with 2 kings. Reply

[Sanju]

@smedz Yeah it's true that they both have different habitat preference like Wolf interactions with American black bears are very rare, because of differences in habitat preferences. Interactions are rare as sometimes both can survive in other habitats too if they have to and during occasional venture to other habitats by chance. Likewise, Tiger-Lion. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolf#Enemi...ompetitors)

Even if they opt to live in same place despite habitat preferences. Bears and wolves "fight-kill-compete" but still coexist or live in same place through out 3 continents and arctic. In b/w Lion and Tiger also it is simply because, they both "almost" breed at same rate in a given area and time (based on carrying capacity- K), so despite occasional (based on situation and possibility) fights and competitive predation/elimination on cubs/adults, due to their reproduction speed, a stable population of both can be established even in the same area/eco-region/habitat. Thus making coexistence in the same ecosystem possible like it did.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Competitio...erspecific Reply

[Shadow]

Interesting to read so much speculation in a way, then again when speculation is based on speculation it starts to be really interesting This kind of topic is one of the best ones to create a lot of discussion where everyone can feel, that he/she is the one who is right and others wrong :) Reply

[Sanju]

@Shadow You can disagree with valid references.

Of course I created this thread to know everybody's opinions and take a look at every possible way how they coexisted, where and when they coexisted and what survival strategy they adapted, their population dynamics and Competition intensity etc.., (very little data available about this issue and everything I got is poured in this thread and BorneanTiger helped too)

So, obviously it will be with speculations and theories coz no body has a time machine to investigate the reality of how they coexisted at the same time no one is astrologer or fortune teller to predict future but scientists and biologists are inclined supporting they could coexist again...

I already stated opinions are welcomed but if anybody wants to debate, they should represent reliable data and sources supporting their theories. Plain statements should only be said by mentioning "IMO". Not only opinions new data about their range overlap and time periods or historic records is also appreciable.

Only thing that is not allowed is nobody should deny that they coexisted in Eurasia coz they did and second is Tiger V Lion debate (they did fight once but no need to discuss who wins all the time, who lose, who is king of jungle, minister of jungle etc.., in this thread). If you don't like this thread and feel waste of time, you're free to ignore. :) Reply

[Shadow]

(04-27-2019, 11:11 PM)Sanju Wrote: @Shadow  You can disagree with valid references.

Of course I created this thread to know everybody's opinions and take a look at every possible way how they coexisted, where and when they coexisted and what survival strategy they adapted, their population dynamics and Competition intensity etc.., (very little data available about this issue and everything I got is poured in this thread and BorneanTiger helped too)

So, obviously it will be with speculations and theories coz no body has a time machine to investigate the reality of how they coexisted at the same time no one is astrologer or fortune teller to predict future but scientists and biologists are inclined supporting they could coexist again...

I already stated opinions are welcomed but if anybody wants to debate, they should represent reliable data and sources supporting their theories. Plain statements should only be said by mentioning "IMO". Not only opinions new data about their range overlap and time periods or historic records is also appreciable.

Only thing that is not allowed is nobody should deny that they coexisted in Eurasia coz they did and second is Tiger V Lion debate (they did fight once but no need to discuss who wins all the time, who lose, who is king of jungle, minister of jungle etc.., in this thread). If you don't like this thread and feel waste of time, you're free to ignore. :)

I didn´t deny anything. Just pointed out, that some disagreements are such, that no matter how much debating it is impossible to say who is right and who is wrong. Like issue with territorial behavior. Until we have in some place lions and tigers side by side, no-one knows really. Of course if you have some good information from past how it was, that is a different thing. Reply

[Shadow]

(04-27-2019, 11:54 PM)Shadow Wrote:

(04-27-2019, 11:11 PM)Sanju Wrote: @Shadow  You can disagree with valid references.

Of course I created this thread to know everybody's opinions and take a look at every possible way how they coexisted, where and when they coexisted and what survival strategy they adapted, their population dynamics and Competition intensity etc.., (very little data available about this issue and everything I got is poured in this thread and BorneanTiger helped too)

So, obviously it will be with speculations and theories coz no body has a time machine to investigate the reality of how they coexisted at the same time no one is astrologer or fortune teller to predict future but scientists and biologists are inclined supporting they could coexist again...

I already stated opinions are welcomed but if anybody wants to debate, they should represent reliable data and sources supporting their theories. Plain statements should only be said by mentioning "IMO". Not only opinions new data about their range overlap and time periods or historic records is also appreciable.

Only thing that is not allowed is nobody should deny that they coexisted in Eurasia coz they did and second is Tiger V Lion debate (they did fight once but no need to discuss who wins all the time, who lose, who is king of jungle, minister of jungle etc.., in this thread). If you don't like this thread and feel waste of time, you're free to ignore. :)

I didn´t deny anything. Just pointed out, that some disagreements are such, that no matter how much debating it is impossible to say who is right and who is wrong. Like issue with territorial behavior. Until we have in some place lions and tigers side by side, no-one knows really. Of course if you have some good information from past how it was, that is a different thing.

Damn, I mixed up with threads, I thought this was the one with those discussions about territorial behavior My mistake Reply

[Sanju]

(04-27-2019, 11:54 PM)Shadow Wrote: I didn´t deny anything.

(04-27-2019, 11:54 PM)Sanju Wrote: Only thing that is not allowed is nobody should deny that they coexisted in Eurasia

you didn't do anything wrong or deny anything. :)  I'm just once again announcing rules to everybody.

(04-27-2019, 11:54 PM)Shadow Wrote: Just pointed out, that some disagreements are such, that no matter how much debating it is impossible to say who is right and who is wrong. Like issue with territorial behavior. Until we have in some place lions and tigers side by side, no-one knows really. Of course if you have some good information from past how it was, that is a different thing.

exactly that's why I find this topic interesting and eager to know everybody's thoughts about this (most of the people can't even digest imagining two famous cats together in one place as both are strongly attached to culture and symbolism). Territoriality is a different topic though, there is no scientific study (there's no need to do too as it is pointless) or proof that intraspecific territoriality exist in b/w bigcats. Albeit, this is coexistence thread. Reply

[Sanju]

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

By Johnsingh, A.J.T. (2006). "Kuno Wildlife Sanctuary ready to play second home to Asiatic lions?". Field Days: A Naturalist's Journey Through South and Southeast Asia

That Behavioral and ecological strategy to avoid competitive exclusion in an area can be studied in Kuno to give an idea of how the competition and co-occurrence (or coexistence) was in between Lion and Tiger in the recent past. Reply

[BorneanTiger]

See these: https://wildfact.com/forum/topic-on-the-...5#pid91115, https://wildfact.com/forum/topic-lions-a...7#pid91147, https://wildfact.com/forum/topic-lions-a...3#pid91143

2 heads of tigers (I assume Bengal tigers) next to a stuffed lion (incorrectly called a 'tiger') at the zoo of Bahawalpur in Pakistan, where the Asiatic lion and tiger occurred in the past, judging from the works of Kinnear (1920) and Nowell and Jackson (1996, referencing Roberts (1977)):
           

Also note that in the document posted by @tigerluver, the specific subspecies of tigers which were believed to have inhabited Pakistan was the Bengal tiger (Panthera tigris tigris), not the Caspian tiger (Panthera tigris virgata), a close relative of the Amur tiger (Panthera tigris altaica) which inhabited neighbouring Afghanistan and Central Asia, despite the fact that Pakistan is considered to be both in the Palearctic Biogeographic Realm of Central and Western Asia and the Indo-Malaysian Biogeographic Realm of Monsoon Asia:

  schnitzler2019.pdf (Size: 1.16 MB / Downloads: 1)
   
   
   

Map of tigers by Nowell and Jackson (1996):

*This image is copyright of its original author

Reply

[BorneanTiger]

See this, it looks almost natural, barring the fence: https://wildfact.com/forum/topic-zoos-ci...#pid112677 Reply

[BorneanTiger]

A Mughal painting of an Indian Dervish with the 2 species (the yellow cat appears to have stripes, rather than rosettes, plus it's as big as the brown cat) at the Kupferstichkabinett Berlin, circa 1650 (around the time of Shah Jahan, who built the Taj Mahal, and had hunted lions in the area of Burhanpur, in what is now Madhya Pradesh): https://wildfact.com/forum/topic-lions-a...#pid121981 Reply