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Human Behavior
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 (05-22-2016, 01:23 AM)Pckts Wrote: I'd hate to believe that the best chance of saving lions or any species would be killing them....any one of them. For a long time, we humans have deemed ourselves superior to every other existent life form. This thread was made to find the reason or reasons why humans think this, as well as other behaviors deemed special to modern humans. Agreed. It is better to just let natural selection take its place instead of "helping" the animals by repairing their injuries or killing them. In our past (at least in the societies/tribes respectful of nature), whenever a human would cross paths with a injured/nearly-dead animal, the human would pay his respects and leave the animal to its future fate. Now it seems like we want to actively "help" animals heal whenever we cross paths with one, even though it harms the injured animal's risks of foraging/hunting/grazing in the future (and possibly harms natural selection if the most fittest specimens find it near-impossible to hunt a single prey.) We, as humans, do not understand the impact that our actions display upon animals and nature in general. Conservation groups' efforts are only about preventing others from poaching and "helping" the animals. In other words, they would rather employ more forest guards and rangers (i.e. more control of natural landscapes/parks), than to leave the place alone. The short and most beneficial answer to conservation? To completely leave the natural landscapes alone. ------------------------------------------------------------ Another question would be: then won't that increase the frequency of poachers/hunters in the area? That would be the hardest question to answer. A lot of society's various "illegal profits" are geared towards the absorption and consumption of rich animal materials such as ivory, fur skins, and various bones. Most of the meat is simply thrown away because, as Peter mentioned earlier on an AvA forum, we already have a surplus of meat; why produce any more? We (and most societies) do not use all of the animal as Native Americans and some African/Pacific natives do. To the question in hand, the best way to reduce poaching/hunting is to either: -Gauge profits so that rare animal materials don't earn income or profit in any way. (which will prevent the poachers/hunters from getting incentives for trying to sell that rhino horn or lion tooth.) -Totally eliminate the monetary system and corruption of society. (Best solution to most world problems in general, including this.) These ideas would best solve a huge reduction in poaching/hunting, in my opinion. 
@Polar: about #37
Quite agree with you but I quote Einstein (I try to translate correctly): The world we created is the result of our level of reflection. But the problems it breeds cannot be solved at this same level. The solution seems to be very easy to say. But in practice how to modify the humans' behaviour (habits, poaching, illegal hunting ...), humans' psychology ? As you say the solution doesn't consist only in employing most forest guards and rangers (who could be corrupted) ie just reacting to the problem. We have to educate, to raise people awareness and so on, this is a big thorough work. You speak about the total elimination of the monetary system and the corruption of our society. Yes ! We are living under the banks' dictatorship, aren't we ? Do you propose the third world war ? You're american isn't ? You and I both are all belonging to the "occidental" world. I think you must be aware that it means, that this implies... Personly, I don't believe in the miracles. (05-22-2016, 11:55 AM)Spalea Wrote: @Polar: about #37 Agreed again. Humans, in general, blame their current state of psychology on others or "their natural tendencies." Some people say that humans are "naturally" evil. No. That is just an excuse to hide humans' lack of respect for each other and their apparent thought of superiority over one another. Humans want to be evil, there is not a "natural" state of emotional being that proves that humans need to be evil. The rest of the animals, including early humans/hominids, knew that being evil was only a temporary state of mind, not a natural state. In the early hominid days, if one group had a problem with another group, they would sort it out fairly quickly and forget/respect each other after that. It seems like when modern humans evolved, they started to hold grudges against each other and constantly pester each other into rage, hence widespread war and consistent fighting/hatred. Whether "occidental," "oriental," or even "tribal" is considered, the whole world's situation is the same: humans are never happy with what they currently have, at least, not happy for a long time. Soon they will want to get bored with what they have and aim for something "superior" in their view. Note that I used the word "want" instead of "need" in this instance, I think you already know why I used the former instead of the latter... ------------------------------------------------------------ Take a businessman, for example. He earns a million within five years. Most people would die for that amount of money, yet the businessman's goals hint at a trillion-dollar amount of total profit at his entrepreneurial prime. He doesn't care about just a million, he wants more and more and more and-- you get the drift. The problem? He does not know why he wants more; all he knows is that he wants more. No one really needs a trillion-dollar profit to live, yet if anyone had a choice between getting a million, a billion, or a trillion dollars for free, just about everyone would choose a trillion dollars simply because everyone wants the highest amount. Wanting more without knowing why you want more is quite dangerous, and ironically, it is why we perceive ourselves as superior to other forms of life and even our own form of life among different backgrounds. Humans always have that dangerous sense of self-entitlement (that is why "nature conservation groups" seek support, both monetary and publicly, so that they can be seen as more entitled to their landscapes and exercise total control over them). What do I propose to end this? -Not a war; that would only further tensions and allow the surviving people start the "human mistake" over again. -Not further governmental punishment/control; that will anger the people and cause a revolution or a war. (Most wars happen because of government, not because of the lack of it, as most people assume.) -Not passive governmental control; the ones who are used to enforced traditional values and strict government will wage anger against the liberal government and the people supporting liberalism. -Not governmental reform; the ones who are used to the older government will go berserk against the one who want to reform to the new government. Mass suicide? Human-effective deadly pathogen? A world conspiracy created to allow humans to spread, yet at the end, mind-controls them all into death? These are genius solutions, and as you said, improbable miracles. I do not believe much in miracles either. In all, we just don't have a "natural" state of mind, much like any other animal. We assume we do to simply cover our hideous tendencies, inconsistencies, and insecurities. 
@Polar: about #3
Very interesting but I just quote you don't see any solution at all. Indeed, in order to use again the Einstein's citation I believe that the problems we created could not be solved in the future, in a near future. You spoke about the banking system corruption and dictatorship. We - the occidental world, (US, Europe, Japan...) - create money from nihilo, from nothing, with usury. The money you use, the credit you open, is only a line of code written by your bank, but connected to nothing (connected to the gold, to the real funds of gold before) ! Well... To the US dollar (worthless ! Like the Euro, the Japanese Yen ) since 1971. Thus, we constantly create some debt. And we do nothing but trying to repay the debt... And that, that is impossible. All these countries are more and more in debt. They survive by constantly printing money. And the end will be ... a big world banking system collapse. Wellcome in a new economical Stone Age ! Perhaps, the wild animals (because this forum is dedicated to the wild animals isn't... ) could live free again on a devastated planet... But believe me, I wish I were wrong. (05-23-2016, 11:13 AM)Spalea Wrote: @Polar: about #3 This is all true. We started hyper-processing money called "credit" over the traditional gold standard adopted by the UN in the 70s and 80s. Again, you are right that "credit" is nothing more than money that has no value, yet is being traded almost as a commodity among the US Treasury, multi-national corporations/companies, and banks. (I don't know how it is in Switzerland or France, I am guessing the same.) Hopefully, there will be a collapse of money, and humans can finally learn from their materialistic and consumerist mistakes. (Seriously doubt it, though.) Money was simply never a good idea to begin with. Gold? No. Even though it can stabilize money to a gold standard, someone will always keep the means of gold production, meaning that someone controls the gold. One does not ever want someone to have control of a resource, regardless of the resource type. Historically, humans have used this idea to control others into giving their resources in order to trade a less valuable portion of their resource. At the end, the "controlling human" (we'll call him) will accumulate most of the others' resources while maintaining a portion of his own. You can see where this all will go... I post more in this thread about Greed/Greedy behavior of humans in general, and the posts will split into several parts.
@Polar:
I'm quite agree with you about gold. I don't believe either that, in case of stabilizing back money with the gold standard, that the control of the gold must be given to someone. By the way, we will never come back to the gold standard (a french expression says History never gets a refill of the same convenience food). But I don't know if you realize that a collapse of the money would imply numerous civil war, world war and so on. Of course after that as you say, the decimated humanity could learn from their past errors. The price to pay would have been considerably heavy. 
The collapse of the world monetary system - as we now know it - will result in nothing less than complete anarchy.
Once again, the word "greed" comes to mind. The most destructive force in humanity, bar none.  |
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