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Brown bears and smilodon comparisons.

Australia GreenGrolar Offline
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( This post was last modified: 06-24-2019, 07:25 PM by GreenGrolar )

According to a credible bear enthusiast named Warsaw: 

Contrary to expectations based on their robust limbs, Smilodon kittens show the typical pattern of growth found in other large felids (such as the Ice Age lion, Panthera atrox, as well as living tigers, cougars, servals, and wildcats) where the limb grows longer and more slender faster than they grow thick. This adaptation is thought to give felids greater running speed. Smilodon kittens do not grow increasingly more robust with age. Instead, they start out robust and follow the ancestral felid growth pattern, while maintaining their robustness compared to other felids. Apparently, the growth of felid forelimbs is highly canalized and their ontogeny is tightly constrained.

carnivora.net/showthread.php?tid=6057&page=12

I am not sure which book its from but this is what he posted on Carnivora. Yet there are other data which says a smilodon has more robust bones than the brown bear. Could anyone help give me clarity on this? Thanks.
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Australia GreenGrolar Offline
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( This post was last modified: 11-13-2019, 10:09 AM by GreenGrolar )


*This image is copyright of its original author


Estimated visual comparison.
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Australia GreenGrolar Offline
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@GrizzlyClaws may I get your input on the comparison between these two animals? Thanks. The smilodon populator actually has more powerful forearms and denser bones than other big cats.
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United States GrizzlyClaws Offline
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(12-19-2019, 06:49 PM)GreenGrolar Wrote: @GrizzlyClaws may I get your input on the comparison between these two animals? Thanks. The smilodon populator actually has more powerful forearms and denser bones than other big cats.

I don't feel really competent in this domain, maybe @tigerluver could do you a favor about the limbs comparison.

But from what I read in some paper, some Smilodon populator specimens got its limb robusticity exceeded that of the Brown bear.

Let's us take a look about the comparison of the entire skeleton. IMO, S.populator could have slightly upper hand in term of the limb bones. However, the torso domain would still go to the Brown bear. As anatomically, the bear got quite different body structure from feline as a plantigrade animal, it has more centered toward the leverage of the torso.



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*This image is copyright of its original author
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United States tigerluver Offline
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(12-19-2019, 06:49 PM)GreenGrolar Wrote: @GrizzlyClaws may I get your input on the comparison between these two animals? Thanks. The smilodon populator actually has more powerful forearms and denser bones than other big cats.


From Christiansen and Harris (2005) and Campione and Evans (2012) we can show a comparison.

Campione and Evans (2012) report a bear humerus 400.5 mm long and 146.25 mm in circumference (robusticity index 0.365). The closest in length humerus reported by Christiansen and Harris (2005) is 387.5 mm long and 155 mm in circumference (robusticity index 0.4). So from this small sample size, Smilodon populator is more robust in the humerus. In the femur, the bear femur was 445.5 mm long and 126.25 mm in circumference (index 0.28). The longest S. populator femur in Christiansen and Harris (2005) was 390.4 mm long and 113.5 mm in circumference (index 0.29). S. populator was front heavy while bears are more balanced so that skews the comparison somewhat. Nonetheless it appears S. populator bone-wise is more robust.
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