Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars

[Pckts]

(12-24-2019, 09:26 AM)chui_ Wrote:

(09-11-2019, 12:52 AM)Pckts Wrote:

Quote:The jaguar hunted by Ken Vaughn was not weighed – so the weight of 330lb would be incorrect not inconclusive – because it does not exist (do you need further clarification?). The guy (Almeida) who recorded all these jaguars did not weigh any jaguar close to that weight, nor did he believe they could reach that weight.

We know that is wrong. Also, what page does he make this claim? I have the book now and I have seen no such claim from him as of yet.

Just saw this now. Keep in mind Almeida published 2 books.

Here you go, page 63 of Tony Almeida's 1976 book. I already posted the previous page (p 62) from this book on page 5 of this thread. 

To be fair he is probably being overly conservative here.

*This image is copyright of its original author

Maybe he made that assessment before his later hunts which I assume is why he mentions Rafeals 148kg Jaguar which was empty *or as close to empty as we can be sure of* as well as the 130kg Jaguar estimated by him to be empty.

Also, I have a question in regards to the 148kg Jag he speaks of.
He said it was from Venezuela but this Jaguar was weighed in Brazil

Are they different ones?

Quote:Of course his estimate for that jaguar’s weight would be with empty stomach. Why would you estimate the weight of an animal including stomach content?

Stomach content is relevant for actual recorded weights because a scale doesn’t know how much of the weight it is registering is just meat in the belly of the animal. So we need to consider stomach content in that context not with estimates.

If he specifically mentions Empty and his opinion is that Jaguars don't get over 130kg Empty, he is obviously saying that Jaguar is a very large individual and at least 130kg since you can only go up from empty.
If we are to look deeper, what good is it to estimate empty?
The odds of you actually catching a cat that has 0 food content in it's belly are slim to none.
If you want to make mention that the cat was on a bait and gorged itself, that is another issue but trying to guess the amount a cat has eaten just off of fleeting images is pointless.
Even individual cats don't look empty the same way, some can be much more drastic in their appearance than others. 
Chota Munna vs Umarpani is a good example, both go through summer months and drop a significant amount of weight but CM looks far slimmer than Umarpani no matter the time of year.
Both these cats live in the same Zone in Kanha and have dominated that area for years, so their a good gauge to compare. 

I don't believe stomach content is relevant for the reason mentioned above, how can anyone really know how much a cat has eaten unless you bait them or their is a fresh kill nearby. Better to assume all captures have similar content unless the extraordinary circumstances mentioned here are found. 

Quote:It’s been a while since I’ve read through his books in detail but I recall reading that he hunted mostly in the northern Pantanal. Maybe you can check that.

40 individuals from the "Northwestern Part of the Pantanal"

Quote:I find it hard to believe these jaguars have increased in size by 30% (from 100 to 130kg) over the last few decades. The Pantanal jaguars have always enjoyed abundant prey, both natural prey and plenty of easy to kill cattle (much bigger than any natural prey!) so this sudden increase in size seems a bit far fetched.  You guys have posted a few weights and estimates from social media of some big males and are making conclusions, I’ll be convinced when I see properly published data (preferably with some info on stomach content).

6 males captured in the southern Pantanal between 2003 and 2004 averaged 99.7kg, very similar to Almeida's figure.

"By Richard Mann

RIO DE JANEIRO, BRAZIL - The Pantanal, the world's largest tropical wetland area, is now home to more than ten million caimans (Caiman crocodilus yacare). In the 1980s, this species became the preferred target of the skin leather trade, which killed at least 5 million specimens."


"In the 1980s, the species was "heading for oblivion" due to frequently being hunted for its skin;[9] hunters often went to water holes containing many yacare caimans and shot large numbers of them. They utilized the skin for leather and left the other parts of the carcasses at the water holes.[9] Although the species is covered with bony osteoderms, which had previously made it uncommon to be hunted for leather, it has some less bony spots which can be used for leather.[5]:582 This practice caused the caiman's population to drop by the millions. In 1992, a ban was issued in Brazil that prohibited the trading of crocodilian skins. This resulted in a significant increase in its population, with about 10 million specimens living in the Pantanal alone as of 2013"


"The yacare caiman was listed as endangered throughout its entire range under the predecessor of the Endangered Species Act (Act) of 1973 on June 2, 1970 (35 FR 8495)."


The Caiman were hunted to almost Extinction, Jaguars too, it wasn't until the early 90s did you actually start to see a positive turn in their numbers and even so they were still hunted "illegally" which wasn't enforced.
Even to this day, the most prolific hunter to ever step foot in the Pantanal lives  just a few miles away from Porto Jofre and can easily be hired to go hunt. 

Also the cattle killer claim has more to do with sex of the Jaguar and location, in places like the South Pantanal, Farmers do bait the Jaguars quite a bit to get them to come out so they can take pictures of them on land since it's harsher terrain and less modernized for tourists. In places in the North Cattle Killers are usually Females with cubs and only during the Flood Months, even Almeida mentions this aswell. There are no cattle that walk through the meeting of the 3 rivers, it's just vast wetlands, deep and dense with vegetation that no large herbivore can trek easily. When you go through the Pantanal, you'll never see a Cow when you're boating through, when you get back to the highway after travelling by boat back to Porto Jofre, you'll see them all over and some times those will be taken by Jaguars.  
They do have Introduced Water Buffalo which are now hunted by the locals since they're considered a nuisance and not seen easily by Safari. But they cause more of a threat to Jaguars than the other way around, they're notorious cub killers.

And Jaguars didn't increase from "100kg to 130kg"
He already found Jaguars there he believed to be 130kg Empty, just not as frequently that they are found there now. 
There is a direct correlation to the protections provided to both Jaguars and their Prey and since both numbers have rebounded dramatically, we now see the increase.
An Average then of 100kg to 116kg for N/S Pantanal now. *This number is not official btw, this is based off the published weights of Panthera and Oncafari*

Almeida also mention that he considered mature males to be from 4 years and up but he specifically mentions that they continue to put on mass, quite a bit actually far past the age of 4 so his number could be stunted by age in comparison to the ones mentioned in recent times. 
For instance, you had Brutus captured at a young age *4 I believe* and he was about 110kg and now they estimated him to be 130kg. Source is Oncafari

*This image is copyright of its original author

He also Included Runts in his averages as well

*This image is copyright of its original author

Lastly, I can't say this this enough, the meeting of the 3 rivers is going to be the best place on earth for large Jaguars.  
The protection offered there and sheer amount of Caiman has made them the best of the best. Reply