Amur Tigers

[Apex Titan]

@GreenGrolar 

Quote:None. However, a male brown bear is certainly capable of killing a similar size land semi predator, another bear:

Well, of course.

Quote:Golden eagles also hunt red foxes and coyotes occassionally and martial eagles do kill jackals.

Yes, but not with regularity. 

Amur tigers frequently (and habitually) hunt bears, thats the difference.

Quote:Because the tiger being a full time predator is rank as predator over the brown bear and also hunts them (mainly subadults, young adults and adult females). It does not make sense the call an omnivore an apex predator especially when it is in a similar region as a huge full time carnivore. Golden eagles do not prey on Eurasian black vultures, however, there are records of black eagles killing chicks of griffon vultures (although adult griffons are capable of repelling black eagles which have to gang up in pairs to snag a chick - Vultures of Africa by Peter Mundy) and occasionally kill adults (Scottwolverine1111 posted that accounts). One animal seems to be called a predator over another animal even if the largest of its kind is avoided or generally avoided.

Exactly, thats my point. The reason why the tiger is widely regarded by the natives, as well as by the white European Russians (biologists, zoologists, researchers, hunters, general public etc) as the undisputed lord of the Amur-Ussuri taiga forests, is simply because the tiger is the apex predator at the top of the food-chain that actively hunts and kills the bears in this region. 
See Pavel Fomenko's new recent interview, which I posted in the tiger extinction thread.

As the regions top predator, the Amur tiger is the dominant carnivore in the ecosystem. 

Here's another good source:

In the Russian far east and Northeast China (Manchuria) the tiger, for tens of thousands of years, has been the top predator. To the aboriginal Manchu-Tungus people tigers are the masters of the taiga. In the Amur-Ussuri region the Nanai, Udege, Orochi and Ulchi peoples revered Amba, the tiger, as a totemic animal.

Udege were often called 'Tiger people'. Natives were so much in awe of the tiger that they did not even dare mention its name. If they came upon tiger tracks in the forest, they would bow respectfully and quietly retreat.

*This image is copyright of its original author

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=SoAM...&q&f=false

Quote:By the way, here is another translation:

The Amur tiger centre instagram profile.

Translation:-

User:-"Is an adult male brown bear stronger than an adult male tiger? Tigers prey on them. So i am wondering....?"

Amurtigercentre:-"Hello! It depends that on which male bear and on which male tiger. But a tiger has once been seen eating an adult male they prefer to disperse as no one wants injuries."

User:-"Well, do tiger generally prey on adult male brown bears? And do they kill bears on regular basis?"

Amurtigercentre:-"No, we are not aware of such cases. On regular basis- definetly not, on himalyan-yes."

Interesting, so the Siberian Tiger Center know of a case of a tiger feeding on an adult male brown bear. They implied that the tiger killed the adult male brown bear. So thats a possible, and likely recent killing of an adult male brown bear by a tiger.

Also, remember one thing, the Siberian Tiger Center only monitor tigers in the Amur region. In the Amur region, there's barely any tigers there, only about 4-5 individuals. Most of the Amur tigers are in the Primorsky and Khabarovsk regions of Russia. So the frequency of tiger predation on brown bears in the region monitored by the Siberian Tiger Center, will be very low anyway.

Remember, Seryodkin and Pikunov reported that tiger predation is the main natural cause of brown bear mortality in Sikhote-Alin (Primorye region). In the reserve Tkachenko studied tigers in (1992 - 1995) brown bears made up 18.5% of the tigers diet and Himalayan black bear made up 14.8% in the tigers diet:

*This image is copyright of its original author

"In Lazovsky Reserve in the feeding of the tiger, only Himalayan black bear was recorded (Zhivotchenko, 1981; Khramtsov, 1993). According to other studies performed in middle Sikhote-Alin, it attacks this species more seldom than the brown bear (Bromlei, 1965; Kostoglod, 1977; Seryodkin et al., 2005). Apparently, such a contradiction is explained by the difference of individual ecological conditions in areas where studies were performed. However, the fact that the Himalayan black bear of any sex and age is a typical prey of the tiger is obvious (Sysoev, 1960, 1966; Gorokhov, 1973; Kostoglod, 1977, 1981; Khramtsov,1993; Seryodkin et al., 2005; Yudin and Yudina, 2009; author’s unpublished data)."

https://www.semanticscholar.org/paper/Sp...be361da82a

The frequency of tiger predation on brown bears varies from region to region. Some studies and observations made by biologists showed that brown bears were hunted and killed more often than black bears and vice versa, so it depends on certain factors.

I also posted plenty of scientific information proving that brown bears are regularly hunted by tigers in summer and autumn. The Siberian Tiger Center, who monitor only a few tigers in the Amur region, cannot tell you the full picture of tiger predation on brown bears, because there's plenty of scientific information and reports from numerous biologists & researchers, (from other regions) that confirms that brown bears are frequently hunted and killed by tigers, especially during the summer and autumn months.

Quote:Just out of curiosity: which bear do you think will beat a Siberian tiger in a fight to death more often than not? Only the larger male brown bear and a polar bear will be able to beat a Siberian tiger, Bengal tiger, and African lion in my opinion, the other bears are too small. (A little off topic: While polar bears are less aggressive than grizzlies, they become aggressive during mating season and the older males will stand their ground - video and account posted on the polar bear thread. While there are accounts of grizzlies killing subadults, no record of mature male polar bears being killed. Ursus Artos posted an account on old carnivora that young males prefer to mate with younger females. Therefore grizzlies probably give mature male polar bears a wide breath during mating season but go for the young but not full grown sexually mature ones). The only other bear that can win might be the exceptionally large American black bear at 600 pounds and above.

My opinion is similar to what the Russian experts and biologists recently said about tigers vs brown bears. I favor the tiger over even a much larger bear of any species, simply because the tiger is a far superior killing machine, better armed for killing/combat (deadlier weaponry), much faster, more agile, more powerful (explosive), ferocious and has much greater precision and efficiency than a bear.

I believe (like Batalov certainly does) that Ochkarik, who's estimated to weigh around 180 kg, killed and ate the huge male brown bear 'Chlamid', who was estimated to weigh between 350-420 kg. So if a moderate-sized male tiger can slaughter a massive male brown bear twice his own weight, then I definitely think a tiger would defeat a much larger bear of any species, more often than not.

Russian biologists, zoologists, naturalists and even local hunters know that some big male brown bears (400-600 kg) can outweigh even a big male tiger by several hundred pounds, in spite of this, most of the experts, as well as experienced hunters in the taiga, heavily favor the tiger to win a fight against a huge male brown bear. Why do you think that is?

And when both the tiger and bear are of similar-size (and equal size) and weight, the tiger will dominate the fights and almost always win. Why? because in history, there's never been a single reliable case ever, of a bear ever killing a similar-sized tiger in a fight to the death. Whenever the tiger and bear were of similar size, the tiger always kills and eats the bear. This is what history consistently shows. Bears need a size and weight advantage to stand a chance in a fight against a big cat, because the felids are just too armed, fast, agile and superior killers.

Here's what Colonel Kesri Singh (Who had personal experience with tigers and lions) had to say about the tiger: "Some northern bears are larger, but they lack the tigers tremendous five-fold armament - to say nothing of his agility."

*This image is copyright of its original author

https://archive.org/details/onemanandath...and+tigers

Quote:Also in addition to the account of tigers depressing the population of black bears and brown bears in China due to predation, it seems that female brown bears choose to give birth to cubs in an area where there is a lack of tiger presence. Male brown bears also prefer to be in an area with an abundance of females:

Yes, this is a possibility.

Another possibility is that the female brown bears could have migrated to other areas to avoid being preyed on by tigers, as we know, tigers hunt adult female brown bears more often than they hunt bear cubs. This is what modern research and studies show. Reply