There is a world somewhere between reality and fiction. Although ignored by many, it is very real and so are those living in it. This forum is about the natural world. Here, wild animals will be heard and respected. The forum offers a glimpse into an unknown world as well as a room with a view on the present and the future. Anyone able to speak on behalf of those living in the emerald forest and the deep blue sea is invited to join.
(10-01-2014, 09:46 AM)'GuateGojira' Wrote: I am agree with you Peter, personality and health state of animals also influence in the sedation.
About the cases posted here by Pckts, these are EXCEPTIONS, not the rule. Again, those news from the web are always sensationalists and focus more in the tragedy and ignore the GREAT advantages of the studies developed. Just because ONE cougar died in a sample of 20, this doesn't mean that radiocollars are bad. Again, to say that radiocollaring is bad is just a product of paranoia, just that. Sadly, when in all world, animals are still captured, just the crazy dudes of India don't allow that. At some point, that attitude is hypocrite, because like the case of Dr Chundawat, rangers ignore and attack scientists until the truth slap them in the face, yes DON'T FORGET PANNA PEOPLE!!!
"paranoia"
That is not paranoia, these are proven, actually happened and for no reason. You tried to agree with Richardli that sedation or collaring was minimal risk, yet there are tons of examples to prove that it is huge risks. For all species, Lions, leopards, Jags, Pumas, tigers, Rhinos, Elephant, Seal, Clouded Leopard, etc...
What are these animals lives worth to you?
You say you love them, yet you are willing to have a few die as long as most survive. What about the amount of stress they have placed on them, what about the attitude change they have towards human beings, what about the example it sets for humans in the future?
Have a little foresight here, saving these animals doesn't come from knowing how large they are, it comes from protecting their habitat and stopping the unnecessary killing of them.
Simply as that.
YES, it IS paranoia, a ridiculous and biased paranoia.
In your mind, all operations on humans most be canceled because some people have died. However, this is NOT the case, at all.
You say that there is “tons” of evidence against radiocollaring, but the only thing that you have is “your” opinion and a few sensationalist news reports that ONLY focus on the dead animal and IGNORE completely the entire studies and the full sample of captured animals that live very well.
I have provided the opinion of the greatest tiger scientists ever, like Dr Sunquist, Dr Karanth and Dr Chundawat. In fact, if Dr Schaller would have the money, he would probably would capture some tigers in his study of 1960, that is sure.
In science, we can’t use feelings. Check how many tigers are now safe because scientists study them with REAL science. Modern conservation is alive thanks to those scientists that take the risk and wined in the final fight. Of course that any life is precious, but those “less than 5 tigers” that died in over 40 years capturing tigers, were just ACCIDENTS and scientist learn from that.
About the stress, you are using this point like if it was something relevant. Those animals have little stress, the sedatives used simple calm the animal, scientists make little to no noise and contrary to the cases in captivity described by Peter, there are no reports of tigers in India been badly sedated. Read the book “Tiger Moon”, where Fiona Sunquist describes how some tigers even returned to its bait after the sedation. Those tigers were just fine and well, reproduced excellently and those Nepalese studies provided over 70% of modern tiger knowledge.
Finally, those cases of tigers aggressive toward humans in Ranthambore is NOT for the radiocollaring, is because the LACK of respect of people and park rangers for those tigers. Ranthambore, in fact, is one of the worst places for tiger-human relation, because people and park rangers there normally use unsafe distances with those tigers and like any human, tigers have they own personality. So, this is not excuse for radiocollars. In fact, there was not a single case of aggression of the Sauraha male or Madla against humans, just to mention two cases, and those were prime dominant males too.
"In your mind, all operations on humans most be canceled"
Once again, WE must protect them from US!
Do you know what I am saying?
We must protect them from POACHING by us. What does that mean?
It means, forest officials must be payed and allocated weapons to compete against the poachers, they must be given far more money that these gov'ts make from exploiting these animals through tourism. Not so they can INTRUDE on the animals, so they can STOP POACHING!
So please stop misinforming others about what I am saying, because it is absolutely false!
You also have no idea if Ranthambhore is any more or less aggressive towards humans, tigers where just moved from Bandhavargh to stop so much human tiger conflict, the only reason Ranthambhore has more conflict is because its the most popular tourism zone in India and easiest to see tigers, and the most people go there. Hence more interaction between the two species.
Eyes on or hands on? A discussion of human interference
