There is a world somewhere between reality and fiction. Although ignored by many, it is very real and so are those living in it. This forum is about the natural world. Here, wild animals will be heard and respected. The forum offers a glimpse into an unknown world as well as a room with a view on the present and the future. Anyone able to speak on behalf of those living in the emerald forest and the deep blue sea is invited to join.
08-29-2022, 06:22 AM( This post was last modified: 08-29-2022, 08:48 PM by peter )
APEX AND VIDA
In order to get to a debate, good information, overview, true interaction and respect are needed. Not easy at the best of times. Today, debatingwise, we're rapidly going downhill just about everywhere. In order to prevent problems over here, we decided for a few rules. Every member has to respect them.
I read a few posts. What did I see? I saw selection, a lack of overview, a lack of respect and, as a result, a total mess.
APEX
I know you like to go for it, but in order to get to a bit of overview, you need both eyes. If you cover one, the result will be distortion. If you want to debate, you also need consistency. Example.
Professionals (most biologists) never found evidence of an adult male brown bear killed by an adult male Amur tiger. That is to say the evidence found didn't meet the(ir) threshold. Amateurs (like members of a forum), however, got to a different conclusion (referring to incidents described by rangers, hunters, naturalists and biologists). In your posts in the tiger extinction thread, you decided to join the amateurs. For good reasons, of course.
Professionals also never found evidence of adult male brown bears displacing adult male Amur tigers. Amateurs, however, did. This time, you decided to join the professionals. Again for good reasons, but one could conclude your stand is inconsistent and be close.
When you join a debate, both eyes and consistency are needed. That and an open mind. The reason is reality often is much more interesting than preference and all the rest of it. Life is very complex. Mammals, furthermore, are able to change their behaviour over time. You just never know.
Interactions between tigers and brown bears in the Russian Far East are interesting. Interesting enough for a debate on a forum? The answer is yes. The problem is it takes two to tango. If one of the two isn't interested in information you consider as reliable, it's game over. Accepting that part of interaction, as you know, beats using a heavy tank to force a decision. The advice is to sell the tank and to approach problems in a different way from now on. There are different ways to get to Rome. Remember it always is about good information in the end.
What our readers and members think, is up to them. They can discuss the information you post elsewhere. You most probably noticed quite a few members of forums are prepared to ignore, dismiss or twist reliable information about reality if it doesn't suit their agenda. This is humans for you. Let it go and focus on facts. This forum is about the natural world, not something else. Over 50 million views say this policy is appreciated. If you find something of interest, you can post it in the tiger extinction and the Amur tiger thread. Both threads have a lot of views. My advice is to use the opportunity offered and to stay away from 'debates'.
VIDA
In contrast to what you seem to think, you're, preferencewise, not different from others interested in a specific animal. A major difference (referring to post 69 in particular), however, is you're prepared to use both insult and manipulation. Example.
In the last paragraph of post 69, after offering a lot of praise first, you appealed to a few mods and one of the co-owners. The other co-owner (the one who invited 'Apex' to post in the tiger extinction thread) wasn't mentioned. A deliberate attempt to create tension between both co-owners and the mods in order to get it your way? The answer is in your PM to our mod Lycaon: you will remove the insults and the attempts to manipulate when we give in (and ban Apex). This means it was a result of a deliberate decision.
More than enough to qualify for a permanent ban, but that's apart from Grizzly. He made you feel welcome and twice raised your reputation. You used it to manipulate him. I respect Grizzly, meaning you can stay. From now on, however, we'll watch you closely. Next time you decide to manipulate or insult a mod or member, it's game over.
CONCLUSIONS
The debate has been concluded.
All posts up to post 69 will remain. The others, apart from this one, will be deleted.
Lycaon will close the thread for a week.
Apex takes a break of a week in order to visit his grandmother.
Vida takes a break of 2 weeks in order to answer the question why he decided to manipulate a mod who supported him and raised his reputation.
