ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - THE TIGER (Panthera tigris)

[Apex Titan]

@peter 

I agree with mostly everything you said about male brown bears and male tigers usually avoiding each other, your argument is consistent with modern scientific research. However, I think we should also consider some other factors. When biologists find the remains of brown bears killed and eaten by tigers, in most cases, they just find the remains in the tigers scat. No carcass. In many cases, sometimes the biologists can't even determine which species of bear was killed and eaten.

So, just say if a experienced male tiger occasionally (or rarely) hunts and kills an adult male brown bear, what are the chances of biologists finding the remains of the bear? A male brown bear could be killed and devoured by a tiger, and all the biologists will find is some brown bear remains (bone fragments, fur etc) in the tigers feces. They won't be able to determine which bear was killed. The STP (Chapter 19) study also reports a case of a brown bear killed and eaten by a tiger, where the researchers were unable to determine the bears gender or age.

Matyushkin (1992) found the remains of an adult brown bear killed by a tiger, but again, the gender of the bear was not specified. Maybe he couldn't determine the sex of the bear from the remains. But it shows, that many brown bears (including adults) have been killed and eaten by tigers, in which the gender was not known, or unable to determine. So its possible (and not out of the question) that in some of these cases, it could be adult male brown bears hunted and killed. Not all adult male brown bears are larger than a male tiger, some are smaller and lighter in weight, weighing only 180 - 200 kg.

Also, I've never seen a single biologist, researcher, zoologist or any scientific publication or study, that stated that adult male brown bears (including large males) are "immune" to tiger predation. In fact, I've only seen scientific sources state: "Tigers prey on adult brown bears.".... without excluding adult male brown bears.

Note, I posted a confirmed case (from a scientific study) of a tiger that hunted and killed a male brown bear of unknown age. Again, its possible, that this male bear was an adult male brown bear killed. Biologist, E.N. Smirnov also reported a case of a tiger persistently hunting down a 'large brown bear', which could have likely been a large male brown bear. There's also the other account I posted of a tiger hunting, attacking and badly mauling a 'huge brown bear'. All these accounts I posted on the previous pages of this thread.

Even a leading authority on Amur tigers, like Miquelle, had to change his opinion (previous assumptions) on tigers hunting bears. As more of his recent studies found that tigers regularly hunt and kill bears during the summer months.

STP project biologists (Seryodkin, Miquelle, Kerley etc) never found any cases during their entire study period, of juvenile tigers/tigresses hunting bears, but many recent reports from the Amur Tiger Center, has found and confirmed many cases of young, inexperienced immature tigers and tigresses actively hunting and killing bears, adult bears included. Which shows that even experienced biologists, are always learning more and more new unknown behaviour of tigers, that they didn't know even in 20+ years of studying them in the field.

Seryodkin, Miquelle etc ... are the same biologists that stated; only male tigers can afford to confront and eat bears regularly. But far more recent reports (2017-2021) clearly debunks this statement/assumption. Tigresses, including youngsters, actively hunt bears too, and far more frequently than 'Siberian Tiger Project' biologists previously thought. So, there's still some unanswered questions.

As to your proposal (remarks I should add to my summary), I only wanted to give a brief summary of what Aramilev stated in that video. I wasn't intending on going into details and giving a long explanation because I was saving that for another post I was going to do (I told you about) about male brown bear vs male tiger interactions, analysis based on evidence, where I will also compare their weaponry and skills. You also did a good job of explaining some of this stuff in your post.

Also, except for Krechmar, I haven't seen (nor heard) of a single biologist, zoologist, researcher or naturalist that favours the male brown bear in a fight. Honestly, not one. In addition to Aramilev, there's Yuri Dunishenko, Kucherenko, Rukovsky, Bazhenov, as well as most Russian naturalists and Russian hunters, that all favour the tiger, and report that the tiger is the usual winner in a fight against a brown bear. I think its important that we also acknowledge this fact.

From what I've seen, many forum posters (laymen) tend to favour and badly overrate size/weight advantages, and ignore the vital importance of killing skills, speed, agility and weaponry etc. Whereas most highly qualified and experienced experts, biologists and zoologists, tend to favour the animal with superior predatory skills, weaponry, agility and speed.

I also found it interesting that Aramilev stated that Himalayan black bears in the Ussuri region, can weigh up to 250 kg, which more or less confirms what I said, and the numerous sources I've read, that the Ussuri black bears are the largest subspecies of Asiatic black bears in the world. In general, their larger than their southern Asian counterparts. I'm gonna make a post discussing the size of bears hunted by tigers in the Russian Far East. With some pictures and videos of adult male Himalayan black bears and adult female Ussuri brown bears.

@Matias 

Just to add a bit extra....

Aramilev was interviewed on this subject last year by 'RUSSIA BEYOND'. Interestingly, not only does Aramilev strongly favour an adult male tiger over a very large male brown bear in a fight, but according to him, a fight between a very large male brown bear and tigress or small (young) tiger is an even fight, with only a slight edge to the bear. In a fight between two heavyweight rivals, (big male tiger vs big male brown bear) naturalists would back the tiger.

Russian zoologist, Timofey Bazhenov also stated, in a fight between a tiger and brown bear, as a rule, the tiger wins:

*This image is copyright of its original author

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