There is a world somewhere between reality and fiction. Although ignored by many, it is very real and so are those living in it. This forum is about the natural world. Here, wild animals will be heard and respected. The forum offers a glimpse into an unknown world as well as a room with a view on the present and the future. Anyone able to speak on behalf of those living in the emerald forest and the deep blue sea is invited to join.
09-19-2023, 07:56 AM( This post was last modified: 09-20-2023, 03:00 AM by peter )
(09-19-2023, 06:18 AM)GuateGojira Wrote:
(09-16-2023, 03:17 PM)peter Wrote: According to Heptner and Sludskij ('Die Saugetiere der Sowjet-Union') and Mazak ('Der Tiger'), Caspian tigers were often seen, and shot, in the Altai Mountains in the recent past (about two centuries ago). Photograph A. Kudrin:
*This image is copyright of its original author
Define irony, you live in a particular area but instead of using the name for you, they use it for your brother of an entire different area (Amur).
So, in theory, "altaica" should be better for the Caspian tiger, while the Amur one should be "amurensis" or something like that.
In order to prevent confusion: Guate (referrting to the previous post) was referring to the scientific names of the Caspian and the Amur tiger.
The Caspian tiger was known as Panthera tigris virgata, whereas the Amur tiger is known as Panthera tigris altaica. Do 'virgata' and 'altai' correspond with the region both subspecies inhabit (Amur tigers)/ inhabited (Caspian tigers)? Not really. Seen from this perspective, both 'virgata' and 'altaica' are somewhat confusing. You can find more information about this problem in V. Mazak's 'Der Tiger' (1983, pp. 12-20).
Recent research, by the way, says the now extinct Caspian tiger and the Amur tiger are very closely related, if not one and the same.
Here's a few maps to illustrate the problem Guate referred to.
1 - This map (tiger distribution at the end of the 19th century) is from Mazak (1983). The Caspian tiger (Panthera tigris virgata) inhabited the region between the Black Sea (in the extreme west) up to, and possibly including, the Altai Mountains (extreme east), whereas the Amur tiger (Panthera tigris altaica) inhabited the region between the Sea of Japan (extreme east) and Lake Baikal (extreme west), most probably also reaching the Altai Mountains.
Meaning Caspian tigers reached western China, Mongolia and the Altai Mountains (in the extreme east), whereas Amur tigers reached the Altai Mountains and possibly Mongolia. Also meaning individuals of both subspecies most probably met at one stage. Finally meaning a lot of things are unclear.
Same for Pocock's hypothesis ('Tigers', 1929) regarding subspecies. Those opposing his proposal to distinguish between 8 subspecies say it's based on a few samples of every 'subspecies' only. They have a valid point.
On the other hand.
Tigers roamed over much of Asia before humans entered the stage and created barriers that proved to be impenetrable. The 'cline proposal' (referring to size) is more or less correct, but it also is a fact (referring to Pocock's proposal) there are significant differences between all 8 tiger subspecies (referring to accurate descriptions and, in particular, skulls). Meaning tigers adapted to local conditions. This process apparently had an effect on the (size and shape of) the skull and the size of local populations. The average size of Caspian and, in particular, Amur tigers suggest prey density isn't the only factor affecting size.
Historic records strongly suggest both Caspian and Amur tigers had a tendency to move north in the days they still could:
*This image is copyright of its original author
2 - This map is from Heptner and Sludskij ('Die Säugetiere der Sowjet-Union'). The black lines (at the bottom and at the right) represent the northern borders of the distribution of Caspian and Amur tigers in the former Sowjet-Union at the end of the 19th century. The black dots represent locations where tigers were seen (or shot) in the recent past. The reports used go back to the Middle Ages.
The map shows tigers roamed widely over much of Asia north (and west) of the Himalayas and the Gobi Desert not so long ago:
*This image is copyright of its original author
3 - In this (more recent) map, historic records have been grouped into the subspecies distinguished by Pocock ('Tigers', 1929). There's a clear distinction between Caspian and Amur tigers, but the first two maps (see above) strongly suggests Caspian and Amur tigers both reached the Altai Mountains not so long ago:
The Caspian Tiger (Panthera tigris virgata)
