Comparing Cats: A Discussion of Similarities & Differences

[Luipaard]

Quote:You posted this same study on another forum as if it supported your claims.

I'm sorry, where exactly did I post this? Also, that study gives a jaguar skull length of 204-302 mm whereas the leopard skull length is 170-273 mm thus they overlap in this regard

This is the study I think you're talking about: IDENTIFICATION OF MID-SIZE CAT SKULLS

Quote:1. Leopards have completely different skulls, the excerpt from Mauricio Anton clearly highlighted these differences, you wanting them to be the same will not alter this fact.

The book clearly mentions that the jaguar's skull is proportionally wider compared to other cats as in all cats, not just leopards. How exactly does that make the skull 'completely different'? You realise that they're from the same genus right? In India they even mistook a tigress skull for a large male leopard so how exactly is a jaguar 'completely' different when a (small) tigress skull isn't?

Quote:2. They don't "completely overlap in length and width", jaguars completely outclass leopards in both regards at maximum levels because they are much larger cats at maximums and no population of leopards has proportions in skull length and width that match that of any jaguar population.

Read my first paragraph; they clearly overlap in dimensions. Just because they don't at maximums doesn't mean they don't in general.

Quote:The largest Persian leopard skull is the same length as the largest Mexican jaguars skull and yet it is narrower in breadth.

Mind posting that particular Mexian jaguar's dimensions?

Quote:the outliers usually reach 280-288 mm in length and are a far cry away in width

They're not a far cry away at all. The widest leopard skull is either 191 mm or 200 mm depending which type of source you consider reliable. That's very close or greater than the average width of the average male jaguar skull from the largest populations. Again it depends which source you go by.

Quote:The major differences are not only the forehead but the proportions in width and breadth, the height of the skull, and jaguars also have relatively larger lower canines, smaller p3, and shorter m1, according to Seymour (Panthera onca, 1989).

Again they overlap completely so you'll have leopard skulls being larger, heavier and taller than a jaguar skull.

Quote:You will see what suits your biases, because those skulls look completely different to anyone that sees them from an objective point of view, and they would look even more opposite when an overview from above the two is given where the width of the skulls becomes apparent. I know you're fond of "photographic evidence" but you cannot dismiss mathematical and empirical data because it doesn't suit you, your subjective interpretations will never trump the objective data, and the same could be said between jaguar and lion skulls, completely different.

I think you should compare these two Pantherinae skulls to cougar and cheetah ones. Perhaps then you will understand the difference in build and structure. It's also funny that you speak of data since I've clearly proven they overlap in dimensions. What I posted wasn't subjective but came directly from a scientific study.

Quote:His body size is close, the skull size difference is what makes Diablo appear much larger, but I will confirm the leopard weight since visual interpretations are not always accurate. Btw 60-65 kg is higher than the average weight of an Indian or Sri Lankan leopard and about the same as the average for a Persian leopard, since you like to speak of 100 kg being the benchmark to go by Pantanal jaguars, then that same benchmark is applied to leopards based on scientific publicized averages.

What? You clearly said on another forum that Shazam looks bigger than he really is because he's standing on a sand bank. Now all of a sudden he's 90% the size of the jaguar? You know well that an 80kg leopard is a large male, are you seriously telling me Shazam is a large individual? Not even close.

The reason I estimate him 60kg-65kg is because he's captive and captive animals tend to be bigger due to being overweight although Shazam seemed in pretty good shape for captive animal standards.

I'm not sure what wild leopard average weights have to do with my estimation of Shazam's weight but you're incorrect. For example, Indian male leopards in Maharashtra, central India averaged 63,4kg (source: Morphometry of Leopards From Maharashtra, India) so theoretically speaking Shazam is the size of an average Indian male. I'm okay with that. Reply