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Amur and Kaziranga Tigers - Habitat and Prey Analysis

Canada GrizzlyClaws Offline
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#16

(11-16-2014, 01:29 AM)'sanjay' Wrote: So, Captive Amur tigers ( in good condition ) are larger than big wild Kaziranga tigers ?
Note:- I am asking about only dimension and size, I know wild counterparts are way ahead than captives.


 

We don't know the exact weight of those Kaziranga giants, while some freak specimens among the captive Amur tigers can comfortably outclass any modern big cat.

So presumably, i say yes. So far the giant captive Amur tigers can undisputably produce the largest feline specimens.
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United States Siegfried Offline
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#17
( This post was last modified: 11-16-2014, 05:44 PM by sanjay )

It's all about food intake.  While the density of tigers in Kaziranga is high, so is the density of prey animals there.  It is that simple.  The most robust individual tigers simply are the dominant males laying claim to the best hunting in the park.  If it feeds, it wll grow.  Even if wild Amur tigers have the potential to be larger than the tigers in Kaziranga, few of them enjoy the "all you can eat" buffet of prey that their southern cousins do.

http://www.aaranyak.org/reports/Kazirang...t_2009.pdf

 
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sanjay Online
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#18

Wow, what a great find Siegfried . TFS
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United States chaos Offline
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#19
( This post was last modified: 11-16-2014, 08:07 PM by chaos )

(11-16-2014, 05:41 PM)'Siegfried' Wrote: It's all about food intake.  While the density of tigers in Kaziranga is high, so is the density of prey animals there.  It is that simple.  The most robust individual tigers simply are the dominant males laying claim to the best hunting in the park.  If it feeds, it wll grow.  Even if wild Amur tigers have the potential to be larger than the tigers in Kaziranga, few of them enjoy the "all you can eat" buffet of prey that their southern cousins do.

http://www.aaranyak.org/reports/Kazirang...t_2009.pdf

 

 


The link isn't working. Is this problem just on my end?
 
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sanjay Online
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#20

Its fine, Can you post the link you are seeing in your browser  ?
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United States chaos Offline
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#21

(11-16-2014, 08:21 PM)'sanjay' Wrote: Its fine, Can you post the link you are seeing in your browser  ?

 


~~http://www.aaranyak.org/reports/Kazirang...t_2009.pdf
It kicks me offline. Don't know why
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United States Siegfried Offline
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#22

http://www.aaranyak.org/reports/Kazirang...t_2009.pdf
http://www.aaranyak.org/reports/kazirang...t_2009.pdf

Try either of these.
 

 
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United States chaos Offline
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#23

The issue's on my end. None of them work. Thanks anyway buddy.
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sanjay Online
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#24

Chaos, it may be issue with your browser or system.
If you really need it, I can send it to your email (registered with wildfact), just confirm me if you want
 
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United States chaos Offline
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#25

Its not a biggie Sanjay. Thanks a bunch anyway.  
 
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United States Pckts Offline
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#26
( This post was last modified: 11-18-2014, 01:36 AM by Pckts )

(11-14-2014, 07:37 PM)'Amnon242' Wrote: GrizzlyClaws: I think that doesn´t answer my question....

Let´s say that wild amurs are 190-200 kg, wild bengals are 210 kg.

Captive bengals are 185 kg, while captive amurs are around 220 kg....and some captive amurs reach extreme sizes...

Why is that?

BTW Peter gave his opinion in Premier League...

 

I have always said that its the ability for Amurs to put on fat that makes them larger in captivity. But lets also remember, the only place with actual captive pure bred Bengals is India. India also had a huge issue with being unable to feed tiger properly, which seems to be changing slowly but surely. But since we really don't know the body measurements of any Pure bred Bengals or even very few pure bred AMurs as well. Its to hard to really say one is larger or smaller than the other in captivity.

Copters and Gaute both said the same, more or less.
I agree with them as well.

@chaos, in regards to your lean muscle being more athletic than a bulk robust animal.
While I don't like using Humans to compare to animals, I figure it suits this argument fine.

If you take the top 40 RB's of all time in the NFL, none of them have a BMI lower than 25% which is actually quite high, but what does that mean? It means they need to carry mass and power for the job they do, infact many NFL athletes are actually considered obese by normal standards. But they are far more "athletic" than any other human beings, this is because you need mass to power a large body and be explosive. Tigers need to be robust to power a huge frame, they need to be able to explode and overpower large animals. They also need to be able to make sharp cuts since most of the time they may never see the prey until they are very close and will need to be able to stop that mass or turn on a dime. That is why a large tiger doesn't mean its more or less athletic than a smaller one. Just depends on what they need from their surroundings.
 
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United States chaos Offline
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#27

(11-18-2014, 01:26 AM)'Pckts' Wrote:
(11-14-2014, 07:37 PM)'Amnon242' Wrote: GrizzlyClaws: I think that doesn´t answer my question....

Let´s say that wild amurs are 190-200 kg, wild bengals are 210 kg.

Captive bengals are 185 kg, while captive amurs are around 220 kg....and some captive amurs reach extreme sizes...

Why is that?

BTW Peter gave his opinion in Premier League...


 

I have always said that its the ability for Amurs to put on fat that makes them larger in captivity. But lets also remember, the only place with actual captive pure bred Bengals is India. India also had a huge issue with being unable to feed tiger properly, which seems to be changing slowly but surely. But since we really don't know the body measurements of any Pure bred Bengals or even very few pure bred AMurs as well. Its to hard to really say one is larger or smaller than the other in captivity.

Copters and Gaute both said the same, more or less.
I agree with them as well.

@chaos, in regards to your lean muscle being more athletic than a bulk robust animal.
While I don't like using Humans to compare to animals, I figure it suits this argument fine.

If you take the top 40 RB's of all time in the NFL, none of them have a BMI lower than 25% which is actually quite high, but what does that mean? It means they need to carry mass and power for the job they do, infact many NFL athletes are actually considered obese by normal standards. But they are far more "athletic" than any other human beings, this is because you need mass to power a large body and be explosive. Tigers need to be robust to power a huge frame, they need to be able to explode and overpower large animals. They also need to be able to make sharp cuts since most of the time they may never see the prey until they are very close and will need to be able to stop that mass or turn on a dime. That is why a large tiger doesn't mean its more or less athletic than a smaller one. Just depends on what they need from their surroundings.
 

 

We've danced to this tune already. My position stands on its merits, although I respect your opinion.
 
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Canada GrizzlyClaws Offline
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#28

(11-18-2014, 01:26 AM)'Pckts' Wrote:
(11-14-2014, 07:37 PM)'Amnon242' Wrote: GrizzlyClaws: I think that doesn´t answer my question....

Let´s say that wild amurs are 190-200 kg, wild bengals are 210 kg.

Captive bengals are 185 kg, while captive amurs are around 220 kg....and some captive amurs reach extreme sizes...

Why is that?

BTW Peter gave his opinion in Premier League...


 

I have always said that its the ability for Amurs to put on fat that makes them larger in captivity. But lets also remember, the only place with actual captive pure bred Bengals is India. India also had a huge issue with being unable to feed tiger properly, which seems to be changing slowly but surely. But since we really don't know the body measurements of any Pure bred Bengals or even very few pure bred AMurs as well. Its to hard to really say one is larger or smaller than the other in captivity.

Copters and Gaute both said the same, more or less.
I agree with them as well.

@chaos, in regards to your lean muscle being more athletic than a bulk robust animal.
While I don't like using Humans to compare to animals, I figure it suits this argument fine.

If you take the top 40 RB's of all time in the NFL, none of them have a BMI lower than 25% which is actually quite high, but what does that mean? It means they need to carry mass and power for the job they do, infact many NFL athletes are actually considered obese by normal standards. But they are far more "athletic" than any other human beings, this is because you need mass to power a large body and be explosive. Tigers need to be robust to power a huge frame, they need to be able to explode and overpower large animals. They also need to be able to make sharp cuts since most of the time they may never see the prey until they are very close and will need to be able to stop that mass or turn on a dime. That is why a large tiger doesn't mean its more or less athletic than a smaller one. Just depends on what they need from their surroundings.
 

 


Some giant captive Amurs are very fit, but they have just reached the prehistoric size.

In my opinion, they may have carried the remaining gene of the prehistoric tigers, and not sure if other tigers carry this type of gene as well.
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Israel Amnon242 Offline
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#29
( This post was last modified: 11-18-2014, 07:21 PM by Amnon242 )

Quote:Some giant captive Amurs are very fit, but they have just reached the prehistoric size.

Exactly.


Anyway...I think that opinion of Peter makes sence. Bengals (especially those from Assam) need raw power, while Amurs need a combination of agility and power. Bengals deal with big buffalos and even rhinos and elephants, while amurs deal with bears and huge boars...and raw power itself is not enough in fight against such opponents. But when tiger hunts buffalos or smaller rhinos/elephants, he probably doesn´t need to be extra agile - strenght is the most important factor in a fight against such oponents.
 
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Roflcopters Offline
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#30

kind of off topic but here's two of my favorite Bengals (Overfed) 


*This image is copyright of its original author


Notice the other huge male to the left


*This image is copyright of its original author


male from the Van Vihar Zoo

 
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