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Curious. If they are willing and able to take on single males and take an interested in the region. This may shift the power dynamic in the region conciderably. It will be interesting to see how the PCmales will react.
04-21-2023, 04:21 PM( This post was last modified: 04-22-2023, 12:00 AM by Tr1x24 )
(04-21-2023, 03:04 PM)lionuk Wrote: This morning the three Kambula young males and sister were seen attacking the Nkuhuma male
(04-21-2023, 03:38 PM)Duco Ndona Wrote: Curious. If they are willing and able to take on single males and take an interested in the region. This may shift the power dynamic in the region conciderably. It will be interesting to see how the PCmales will react.
Holy, that was intense.
Looks like NK had a kill, so this was more of a scrap over a kill then anything else, with Kambulas "testing" their strenght in a fight.
Boys still need mature and grow a bit to be ready to challenge for territory , NK is still slightly bigger then them and they struggle to keep him at bay in 3 vs1 , they are still not ready for 2 bigger PC males or any other coalition in Sabi Sands atm ( might change in few months, when youngest male catches up).
Wonder what happened after? Did NK left, or they all shared a kill?
Looks like NK’s rear left leg was bitten, would have puncture wounds to heal. If this is how it ended, seems KYMs need time.. Probably even up to a year to challenge any present day coalition in SS. Wonder how Selatis and Southern Avocas became formidable at such an early age. Have a feeling, they had gone through many tussles likes these before they turned formidable. In fights like these, every member of the coalition need to trust each other and stand up. Even if one loses courage and backs off or runs, its over.
At least two of the KYMs here are a few months past 4, around the age when Selatis and S.Avocas made their mark.
04-21-2023, 06:36 PM( This post was last modified: 04-21-2023, 06:48 PM by Tr1x24 )
(04-21-2023, 05:59 PM)Horizon Wrote: Looks like NK’s rear left leg was bitten, would have puncture wounds to heal. If this is how it ended, seems KYMs need time.. Probably even up to a year to challenge any present day coalition in SS. Wonder how Selatis and Southern Avocas became formidable at such an early age. Have a feeling, they had gone through many tussles likes these before they turned formidable. In fights like these, every member of the coalition need to trust each other and stand up. Even if one loses courage and backs off or runs, its over.
At least two of the KYMs here are a few months past 4, around the age when Selatis and S.Avocas made their mark.
There is no rule in this, some males mature sooner, some later.
Usually when they reach 4.5 - 5 yrs of age, most of them are ready.
Some mature earlier, and are ready to challenge territory at 4 - 4.5 yrs old, depends on many factors ( numbers, situation in the area etc.)
Selatis, when they killed mr T , where around 4.5 and some close to 5.
S.Avocas also where around 4.5 yrs old when they had scraps with Matshapiris and become territorial at around 5, when they pushed half year younger Tsalalas off.
These guy are still young, youngest will just turn 4, so they have time.
For example, 2 BDMs are 1 year older then them and are only now in recent months started to claim territitory.
This is not a race, many young males got killed because they challenge territorial males too soon.
Scraps like these is valuable experience in this ages pre territorial challenge.
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(04-21-2023, 06:36 PM)Tr1x24 Wrote: depends on many factors ( numbers, situation in the area etc.)
Agreed.
(04-21-2023, 06:36 PM)Tr1x24 Wrote: Selatis, when they killed mr T , where around 4.5 and some close to 5.
Thought Selatis were younger than 4.5 and looked like that during the encounter. May be, I could be wrong here?
(04-21-2023, 06:36 PM)Tr1x24 Wrote: S.Avocas also where around 4.5 yrs old when they had scraps with Matshapiris
When S.Avocas tried to tracked down a very impressive Matshapiri male (and may be his injured brother as well) for the first time, they weren’t 4.5 I believe. Very likely, they were around the age of the two older KYMs here.
(04-21-2023, 06:36 PM)Tr1x24 Wrote: This is not a race,
Yes, it isn’t a race. I don’t wish to see these morbid fights, I am glad NK survived. Just curious on how and why some young coalitions turn battle hardened and stubborn so early in their lives while most other young males struggle and don't lose their fear. As we saw recently, the 3 young black rock males around 3.5 caught out one of the huge Salas and tried to finish him off, was a narrow miss. The ones that killed Bob Jr too didn’t even look 4.5.
Not trying to say one scenario is a great outcome and the other is bad. Just interested in the process, on how and why some of these nomadic males evolve and gain confidence quickly.
And the fact is, the two older KYMs and the younger 4 are taking their time.
04-21-2023, 08:55 PM( This post was last modified: 04-21-2023, 09:48 PM by Tr1x24 )
(04-21-2023, 08:21 PM)Horizon Wrote: Thought Selatis were younger than 4.5 and looked like that during the encounter. May be, I could be wrong here?
Ok you are right, they where a bit younger, fight happened in march 2012 ( i taught it was mid 2012), Selatis are born around late 2017- early 2018 in couple litters.
So yea, depends in which months are exactly born.
(04-21-2023, 08:21 PM)Horizon Wrote: Just curious on how and why some young coalitions turn battle hardened and stubborn so early in their lives while most other young males struggle and don't lose their fear. As we saw recently, the 3 young black rock males around 3.5 caught out one of the huge Salas and tried to finish him off, was a narrow miss. The ones that killed Bob Jr too didn’t even look 4.5.
Not trying to say one scenario is a great outcome and the other is bad. Just interested in the process, on how and why some of these nomadic males evolve and gain confidence quickly.
There is no simple answer to this, its mix of many factors.
Its about their "characters", which they develop partly thru genetics and rest they gain thru learning experience and enviroment they live in since 1st day they where born.
(04-21-2023, 08:21 PM)Horizon Wrote: And the fact is, the two older KYMs and the younger 4 are taking their time.
We dont know what 2 older Kambulas are doing in Kruger.
As for other 4, no , they are not taking time, if we know that on average males over 4.5 - 5 yrs start to challenge territory and become territorial after that.
2 Talamatis are their age and also didnt make any moves yet, 6 Birmingham breakaway (some even older) and Nkuhlus are also their generation, still no moves yet.
Those who did it before that ,at around 4 yrs are exceptions and minority.
I think confidence is key here. They need to prove to themselves that they can stand up for themselves in a conflict. This confidence may come early due to some early luck in fights and shifts the local lion dynamics. But can also take years or never develop if the lions experience a traumatic event.
If those youngsters managed to beat up Nym then thats going to be a huge boost in confidence for them. It may be big enough for them to make the mental switch from running around scared to moving around seeking opportunities. Perhaps big enough for them to try and start messing with the Ximhungwe and Othawa pride.
(04-21-2023, 11:04 PM)Duco Ndona Wrote: I think confidence is key here. They need to prove to themselves that they can stand up for themselves in a conflict. This confidence may come early due to some early luck in fights and shifts the local lion dynamics. But can also take years or never develop if the lions experience a traumatic event.
If those youngsters managed to beat up Nym then thats going to be a huge boost in confidence for them. It may be big enough for them to make the mental switch from running around scared to moving around seeking opportunities. Perhaps big enough for them to try and start messing with the Ximhungwe and Othawa pride.
K6 was unsure on when to get into the fight the other two head and paws in first I think he was born sept 2019 the youngest male once he gets older or the 4th male rejoins them they be pretty formidable
Birmingham Coalition Male Lineage
