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History's most brutal killers, the Majingilane Male Lions
History's most brutal killers, the Majingilane Male Lions
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History's most brutal killers, the Majingilane Male Lions
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I know, my real trade is history, especially ancient history.
Let just take one example, the one with the greeks at Thermopylae. If you know anything about the greeks, the first you learn is the way they fought. They fought together, in a phalanx formation. Together. All individualism was completely discouraged, especially among the spartans, and that made a difference with what happened for example in the time of the Iliiad, where individual achievements, personal glory, was more important. It was not so among the Spartans. They had a "collective" mind, and an example of it is seen in the treatment of one of the spartan hoplites that survived Thermopylae. He had been sick, and was unable to keep fighting, so he was sent back to Sparta. So, of course, being one of the only that survived where his brothers had died gained him a lot of animosity. People didn't talk to him, people ignored him completely. To them, he didn't exist. A year passed, and the greeks, under the command of the Spartan general Pausanias, fought in Platea vs the persian army commanded by Mardonius. In the fight, this man, called Aristodemus, was said to fight "with such fury that the Spartans regarded him as having redeemed himself." But they didn't reward him with any special honours, as they would do in a normal case. They considered Aristodemus had fought in a reckless way, in a suicidal way, charging like a berserker, mindlessly leaving the phalanx and killing some persians before they killed him. To the Spartans, there was more glory, there was more valour involved, when you fought still wishing to win and live. So we have these two separate warriors. The mindless brute who charges into battle regardless of strategy, with only one thing in mind, to kill and destroy. And the disciplined warrior, the Spartan that fights in a ordered way with his brothers in the phalanx, not seeking just his personal glory although he cares about that, but the glory of his city, of his brothers and fighting to win. It is wrong to draw parallels with humans and civilizations because they're lions. But, as @peter has said before, we are drawn to lions because there's something about them that calls us in a basic way, in the most basic of ways I would say, considering that once, we humans depended on the strenght of the men of the tribe(the coalition). 
I know that the Phalanx Formation was introduced by Alexander the Great around 340 BC the Battle of Thermopylea took place in 480 BC.
Spartans learned from very young age from their mothers that they can't retreat from the battlefield, namely the Spartan mother was saying to her son: "either you bring your shield back or you be brought back on your shield" meaning that either you win and bring the shield back to Sparta or you will be killed and you will be brought back on your shield, it was a tradition to carry dead warriors on their shield. so there was no other alternative, either you win or die but you will never surrender, you will never run away. KT and MrT have done it. Especially MrT who had the chance to leave with PB and Makalu and not to fight the Selatis. Majingilane have not, they always played safe and that's the reason they still go nice and strong. The follow a different strategy. 
Just read this about the majigilanes and matimbas this is a prime example of its all a numbers game in lion warfare cause even the biggest lion in sabi can't handle 2 majigilanes still have some fight good to hear about especially all 4
the majingilane are big lions too, extremely competent to organize their attacks, and two big lions against one (even bigger) is always uneven and against the single lion, since the two can attack from different angles simultaneously
 (02-24-2016, 11:06 PM)LionKiss Wrote: the majingilane are big lions too, extremely competent to organize their attacks, and two big lions against one (even bigger) is always uneven and against the single lion, since the two can attack from different angles simultaneously Absolutely, it is quite a daunting task to try and face one attacker head on while the other is constantly targeting your back side.
To post the article linked earlier.
Lion Warfare Update: Majingilane versus Matimba. By Amy Attenborough. Just two days ago, Sean Cresswell posted about the re-emergence of a badly injured Matimba male lion. It posed the question; where had this male been and who did he fight with? Although we can only surmise, it really is an interesting exercise to attempt to piece together what happened. Since then though, there have been further developments in the saga and this time we are sure of the culprits. On the evening of the 22nd February, the Matimba males were seen quite far west of their territory and roaring with a Mhangeni lioness, in Majingilane territory. This was an incredibly brave (or foolhardy) move, given the fact that one of the males was already injured and had just come out of a fight. The males roared while moving eastwards throughout the evening, and by about 10pm, the Matimba males were calling around the Londolozi camps, in the core of their territory once more. Although the Majingilane give us the impression that the[i]y have been prepared to cede their previously held territory around the Londolozi camps, its seems the calls of the Matimba’s in their territory earlier in the evening was just too much to bare. The result: two of the Majingilane coalition came east to seek the newer males out.[/i] The fight must have occurred very late that evening or in the early hours of the morning but what we have been left with is a fairly clear outline of what happened and who came out of it as the victors. On the morning of the 23rd, ranger Don Heyneke and tracker Lucky Shabangu found tracks just north of the Sand River, opposite the Londolozi camps that suggest that is where the big fight happened. Pieces of mane, blood, deep claw gouges in the ground as well as faeces litter the area. We don’t know which of the Matimba males were caught in this fight (possibly both) but when this coalition was found the next morning they were very far apart from one another. The blonder-maned Matimba male was eventually found in the south east of Londolozi, right on our eastern boundary and certainly not within their established territory. Although he is still carrying the scars of his last fight, it seems he has no new injuries and because he has been able to move that far, it seems his mobility is decent. The wound on his back is leaking quite profusely but these animals are incredibly tough and the fact that he is covering such large distances really is good news for the Matimbas. His current position, knowingly or unknowingly, is relatively close to where the Matshipiri males have been spending a majority of their time and this male would be wise to avoid calling or scent marking in this area. This green mark shows where the lighter-maned male was found on the morning of the 23rd, far from his territory around the camps and precariously close to Matshipiri held territory.  *This image is copyright of its original author The darker-maned Matimba male, however, was many kilometers away from his brother on the morning of the 23rd. He was found around the south western portion of Londolozi, lying about 300m from the Majingilane and not looking in a good state. Externally he didn’t seem to be carrying any major wounds from what we could see and he only seemed to have a wound on his paw. However, he was struggling to stand. When rangers saw him in the morning, he rocked and struggled before managing to get to his feet, gingerly walked a few paces before lying down once more. Whether this was from sheer exhaustion, stiffness from the previous evening’s forays or some internal damage, we can’t be sure but this male had certainly found himself in a precarious position. The two Majingilane males were resting up just to his north and looking strong and fit physically. They didn’t seem to have any injuries and rangers and guests were anxious to see what the evening of the 23rd would bring. The bottom pink maker represents where the Matimba male was resting during the day and the top, northern marker represents the Majingilane.  *This image is copyright of its original author Then almost by the book, the Majingilane started to get moving last night once the cover of darkness descended, and they began heading straight in the direction of the unsuspecting dark-maned Matimba male. As the distance between the coalitions lessened, the vehicles switched their lights off, thereby allowing the Matimba male to see the threat coming and so as to not give his position away. The Matimba male saw the two Majingilane brothers first and he leapt up and silently slunk away into the darkness (he was moving easily by this point and it seemed that if there were any injuries, they weren’t severe at all). What happened from here can really only be described as pandemonium. As soon as the two Majingilane smelt him they took off in his direction, the dark-maned Majingilane seeing him first and the male with the scar nose following just behind. The Matimba male disappeared at full speed and from here the Majingilane ran in circles trying to establish where he had gone. The roaring was continuous. The noise must have attracted the attention of the other two Majingilane brothers and they came from the west to join the fray. It was now four Majingilane versus one Matimba. Knowing full well that he didn’t stand a chance against such a force, the Matimba male desperately tried to elude the four brothers. For the next hour or so he managed to dodge them by looping in ever-widening circles and constantly changing direction whenever he heard them call. After losing sight of him, the Majingilane patrolled the area, sniffing, roaring and scent marking. After about an hour of zig-zagging, it seemed the Matimba male had finally lost his pursuers and he headed silently and swiftly south. He would stop regularly, turn and listen intently to the north to try to establish the position of the threat before turning and moving south again. We eventually left him around the deep south west; an area that him and his brother have been seen in once before but very far from where they are used to spending their days. The pink marker represents where we eventually left the Matimba male still heading south and the red marker represents where Don and Lucky had the tracks of a fight on the morning of the 23rd.  *This image is copyright of its original author As of this morning, all four Majingilane brothers were found back in the west, in the heart of their territory and seemingly unscathed. The two Matimbas were not found and we are sure that they are both hiding out in the south, attempting to find each other, licking their wounds and figuring out their next move. After what is now two battles won for the Majingilane, will the Matimba coalition attempt to face off their opponents again or will they learn from previous mistakes and steer clear? It seems, once again, that we will have to wait and see… Do you see what I mean now @LionKiss ? This time, it was a 2 vs 2 as you and many others always wanted, and yet the victors were the Majingilane again, in fact Hairy Belly is quite lucky to be alive. Great article, I'm looking forward to pictures of all the males now. Black Mane, credits to Cpar photography - Craig Parsons  *This image is copyright of its original author
It appears, we know for sure that Hairy Belly fought with the Majingilane, Black Mane & Scar Nose on Londolozi. Ginger's fight could have been with the Majingilane, Birmingham or Matshpiri's coalitions.
Quote: we know for sure that Hairy Belly fought with the Majingilane, Black Mane & Scar NoseTrue and not just Hairy belly, the fight was 2 vs 2, at least the beginnings of it. Then yes, it seems they got a hold of Hairy belly and beat him up. Quote:Ginger's fight could have been with the Majingilane, Birmingham or Matshpiri's coalitions.I'm leaning towards the Matshapiris being the culprits of it, mostly based on the outcome of the fight and Ginger surviving. Welcome to the forum @NCAT33 . I hope you enjoy it. 
I doubt the two Matimbas were involved in this altercation, and the article points out Ginger wasn't involved in the skirmish/fight.
"We don’t know which of the Matimba males were caught in this fight (possibly both) but when this coalition was found the next morning they were very far apart from one another." The rangers didn't see the fight, so there's no point to jump into conclusions on who was involved. But seeing that the fight took place "very late that evening (22rd) or in the early hours of the morning(23rd)" and that Ginger "was found on the morning of the 23rd" and "was many kilometers away from his brother". I find hard to believe Ginger had the energy to move as far after a "fight" or a "skirmish", and "it seems he has no new injuries"". In my opinion, Hairy Belly got caught alone sadly. (02-25-2016, 03:50 AM)NCAT33 Wrote: It appears, we know for sure that Hairy Belly fought with the Majingilane, Black Mane & Scar Nose on Londolozi. Ginger's fight could have been with the Majingilane, Birmingham or Matshpiri's coalitions. no the Majingilane are not involved in the fight with Ginger, (02-25-2016, 09:46 AM)vizions Wrote: I doubt the two Matimbas were involved in this altercation, and the article points out Ginger wasn't involved in the skirmish/fight. me too, I believe the last fight was 2 Majin vs Hairy Belly, Ginger left earlier for two possible reasons a) he was not fit to start a new fight or b) the 2 Majingilane didn't come to fight since it was a 2 vs 2, typical Majingilane mentality, this possibility is more probable. when Ginger left they 2 Majins came to fight but still Hairy Belly came out of a fierce fight unharmed. The 2 Majins called their 2 other brothers to chase him but still all 4 of them did not managed to corner him and kill him. I think this is the first time the Majins cannot kill or even injure severely a lion even in 1 vs 2 fight. The opinion of the rangers that "Hairy Belly got caught alone sadly" is an exaggeration, it would have been so if Hairy Belly was killed or even wounded seriously in the battle. I believe HB stayed intentionally behind to fight and size them up. and the most important is that the Rangers should do something and protect the cubs which are the innocent victims of those lion warfare. sooner or later there will be an other fight, dominant males will die and new will come but the cubs does not deserve to die, (02-25-2016, 03:05 AM)Majingilane Wrote: Do you see what I mean now @LionKiss ? This time, it was a 2 vs 2 as you and many others always wanted, and yet the victors were the Majingilane again, in fact Hairy Belly is quite lucky to be alive. it is not sure that it was a 2 vs 2 fight, most indications show that it was 2 vs 1, ginger didn't get involved, even the rangers have implied this HB came out alive and unharmed from an immense fight, probably the fiercest fight in his life so far, but the 2 Majins called the other 2 Majins to start a new attack, so 2 vs 1 was little difficult for them so they thought: "let's play it safe" since 4 vs 1 is a more successful strategy. nevertheless HB manged to trick them up all 4 and escape, completely unharmed. This is a typical Majingilane way of fighting but the out come is not, usually they kill or severely wound the other lion, this is not the case this time.
but we should not compare too much the human behavior with the behavior of the Lions when they fight.
All of them sooner or later will be ousted by younger males, this is what happens for thousand of years. humans don't fight as they used to fight 2000 years ago, it is so different Quote:I doubt the two Matimbas were involved in this altercation, and the article points out Ginger wasn't involved in the skirmish/fight.No, the article doesn't say this. It says that possibly both of them were involved, they just don't know. Quote:Ginger left earlier for two possible reasonsNowhere does it say he left earlier. Quote:b) the 2 Majingilane didn't come to fight since it was a 2 vs 2, typical Majingilane mentality, this possibility is more probable.So, let's see the actual article and compare it with this opinion of yours. On the evening of the 22nd February, the Matimba males were seen quite far west of their territory and roaring with a Mhangeni lioness, in Majingilane territory. The males roared while moving eastwards throughout the evening. So, both Matimba males were there, ensuing a clear challenge. How did the Majingilane responded? Its seems the calls of the Matimba’s in their territory earlier in the evening was just too much to bare. The result: two of the Majingilane coalition came east to seek the newer males out. A pretty clear answer, Black Mane and Scar Nose responded to the threat and moved towards the Matimbas. The fight must have occurred very late that evening or in the early hours of the morning but what we have been left with is a fairly clear outline of what happened and who came out of it as the victors. We don’t know which of the Matimba males were caught in this fight (possibly both) but when this coalition was found the next morning they were very far apart from one another. So, the Matimbas were moving and roaring together. The two Majingilane came to get them and suddenly Ginger finds himself kilometers away from his brother, almost in the border with Mala Mala. If he wasn't involved in the fight? Why did he move out that way, to a territory that is not his own and close to another threat, possibly the one that hurt him?... Now, I concede that he might have just run away when the two Majingilane came, leaving his brother alone to fight, but that only adds up to my point. Even if the fight itself was a 2 vs 1, the article shows the interaction between the two sets of males was a 2 vs 2. Quote:HB came out alive and unharmed from an immense fight. He was struggling to stand. When rangers saw him in the morning, he rocked and struggled before managing to get to his feet, gingerly walked a few paces before lying down once more. Whether this was from sheer exhaustion, stiffness from the previous evening’s forays or some internal damage, we can’t be sure but this male had certainly found himself in a precarious position. Quote:but the 2 Majins called the other 2 Majins to start a new attackThe noise must have attracted the attention of the other two Majingilane brothers and they came from the west to join the fray. So, it's clear the weren't calling the other two to "start a new attack". The attack was already done when the others came. Quote:2 vs 1 was little difficult for them so they thought: "let's play it safe" since 4 vs 1 is a more successful strategy.The Majingilane started to get moving last night once the cover of darkness descended, and they began heading straight in the direction of the unsuspecting dark-maned Matimba male. As the distance between the coalitions lessened, the vehicles switched their lights off, thereby allowing the Matimba male to see the threat coming and so as to not give his position away. The Matimba male saw the two Majingilane brothers first and he leapt up and silently slunk away into the darkness (he was moving easily by this point and it seemed that if there were any injuries, they weren’t severe at all). What happened from here can really only be described as pandemonium. As soon as the two Majingilane smelt him they took off in his direction, the dark-maned Majingilane seeing him first and the male with the scar nose following just behind. The Matimba male disappeared at full speed and from here the Majingilane ran in circles trying to establish where he had gone. The roaring was continuous. Do you see any indication there that Black Mane and Scar Nose where somewhat worried about Hairy Belly? If they were so afraid of making the move against the Matimba, then why they didn't waited until the other two came to attack the Matimba?... I will finish this response by quoting the last bit of the article. As of this morning, all four Majingilane brothers were found back in the west, in the heart of their territory and seemingly unscathed. The two Matimbas were not found and we are sure that they are both hiding out in the south, attempting to find each other, licking their wounds and figuring out their next move. After what is now two battles won for the Majingilane, will the Matimba coalition attempt to face off their opponents again or will they learn from previous mistakes and steer clear? I don't mind opinions. We all have them, and it's a part of what drives us to learn. But I like them to be based off Facts, not just a personal feeling on the matter. If we have an article like this one that gives the answers we're looking for, then we should use it and base our opinions off it. |
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