There is a world somewhere between reality and fiction. Although ignored by many, it is very real and so are those living in it. This forum is about the natural world. Here, wild animals will be heard and respected. The forum offers a glimpse into an unknown world as well as a room with a view on the present and the future. Anyone able to speak on behalf of those living in the emerald forest and the deep blue sea is invited to join.
--- Peter Broekhuijsen ---

  • 5 Vote(s) - 4.4 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
The Birmingham Males

Croatia Tr1x24 Offline
Top Contributor
******

(12-16-2021, 12:44 AM)Duco Ndona Wrote: If he didnt abandon them. He is going to have a big problem waiting for him if he returns now. 

He could in theory wait things out and try to rejoin the pride once the Nwaswitshakas leave. But at one point the pride is no longer going to accept him back.

It would also be delay of execution. The Nwaswitshakas learned that there are good mating opportunities in that region and would be back for more soon.

N'waswitshakas are not leaving, they are now fully dominant males along Sand River, from Sabi Sabi to MalaMala Main Camp.. They are seen regularly in those areas for 1 month now (since their invade at the beginning of November), roaring, scent marking, pursuiting and mating with Kambula females. 

Something like this :


*This image is copyright of its original author


In that time, they abandoned (for now atleast) their territory in Lion Sands and KNP, as we saw S. Avocas moving in Lion Sands and roaring few weeks back, aswell as Plains Camp pride subadults..
7 users Like Tr1x24's post
Reply

Canada Mdz123 Offline
Contributor
*****
( This post was last modified: 12-16-2021, 01:54 AM by Mdz123 Edit Reason: Typo )

(12-16-2021, 01:39 AM)Tr1x24 Wrote:
(12-16-2021, 12:44 AM)Duco Ndona Wrote: If he didnt abandon them. He is going to have a big problem waiting for him if he returns now. 

He could in theory wait things out and try to rejoin the pride once the Nwaswitshakas leave. But at one point the pride is no longer going to accept him back.

It would also be delay of execution. The Nwaswitshakas learned that there are good mating opportunities in that region and would be back for more soon.

N'waswitshakas are not leaving, they are now fully dominant males along Sand River, from Sabi Sabi to MalaMala Main Camp.. They are seen regularly in those areas for 1 month now (since their invade at the beginning of November), roaring, scent marking, pursuiting and mating with Kambula females. 

Something like this :


*This image is copyright of its original author


In that time, they abandoned (for now atleast) their territory in Lion Sands and KNP, as we saw S. Avocas moving in Lion Sands and roaring few weeks back, aswell as Plains Camp pride subadults..

3 of 4 males have been making occasional returns to keep an eye on their prides but still they spend most of their time in Mala Mala. Gore tends to stay back with the prides but does go north with his brothers
4 users Like Mdz123's post
Reply

Slayerd Offline
Regular Member
***

(12-16-2021, 12:44 AM)Duco Ndona Wrote: If he didnt abandon them. He is going to have a big problem waiting for him if he returns now. 

He could in theory wait things out and try to rejoin the pride once the Nwaswitshakas leave. But at one point the pride is no longer going to accept him back.

It would also be delay of execution. The Nwaswitshakas learned that there are good mating opportunities in that region and would be back for more soon.
Why would he return to N'waswitshaka? The N'waswitshaka have never been seen around the 3 Kambula mothers. There is no evidence of the N'waswitshaka being around the 3 mothers so Nhenha wouldn't be "returning" to them. The N'waswitshaka are still mostly in Sabi Sabi and only returned briefly. The only lionesses they have been around is Kambula #6 the infertile lioness and #4 who is theorized to be pregnant with Avoca cubs.
1 user Likes Slayerd's post
Reply

Duco Ndona Online
Contributor
*****

The rest of the pride was reported to be closeby during that encounter.
Reply

Slayerd Offline
Regular Member
***

(12-16-2021, 07:06 PM)Duco Ndona Wrote: The rest of the pride was reported to be closeby during that encounter.

There are 23 other members of the pride. 4 lionesses, 7 cubs and 12 sub adults. I don't believe the speculation that they killed Kambula cubs because the N'waswitshaka were never reported in the Eastern parts of the reserve and the N'waswitshaka wounds were either cause by themselves or the Avocas. Ubuso had bites on his back and scratches on his face and Amahle had a limp. No other wounds before or after which is why it's unlikely they killed Tinyo and are the reason the cubs died.
2 users Like Slayerd's post
Reply

Canada Mdz123 Offline
Contributor
*****

Remember there could be many reasons how Tinyo died, if he is at all…

He could have been caught and cornered by hyenas while he was alone, or even he was infected by bovine TB… Although that is unlikely since he didnt show symptoms in his last sighting. Even illegal poaching is a possibility of his death cause.

Since lions can rapidly lose condition, for example, in mid-November last year, Junior Nkuhuma was in great condition, in early-December he was dead. This means that even Tinyo was in decent condition in his last sighting, he could by dead already.

We can never know anything about how Tinyo died without finding his body, which might never happen since he’s been missing and nobody found traces of him.

As of right now, I consider Tinyo to be “missing”, wont consider he is dead until at least a couple of months or confirmation from Mala Mala.
3 users Like Mdz123's post
Reply

United States sik94 Offline
Sikander Hayat
****

(12-16-2021, 11:09 PM)Mdz123 Wrote: Remember there could be many reasons how Tinyo died, if he is at all…

He could have been caught and cornered by hyenas while he was alone, or even he was infected by bovine TB… Although that is unlikely since he didnt show symptoms in his last sighting. Even illegal poaching is a possibility of his death cause.

Since lions can rapidly lose condition, for example, in mid-November last year, Junior Nkuhuma was in great condition, in early-December he was dead. This means that even Tinyo was in decent condition in his last sighting, he could by dead already.

We can never know anything about how Tinyo died without finding his body, which might never happen since he’s been missing and nobody found traces of him.

As of right now, I consider Tinyo to be “missing”, wont consider he is dead until at least a couple of months or confirmation from Mala Mala.
Jr Nkuhuma is a bad example of this probably but agreed.
1 user Likes sik94's post
Reply

1ofCourage Offline
Regular Member
***

(12-12-2021, 04:41 PM)Tonpa Wrote: Nhenha in Singita yesterday 


Was Nhenha looking for the Tsalala lioness and sub?  How would he know that the mother is dead now?
He used to spend time with them.
2 users Like 1ofCourage's post
Reply

Duco Ndona Online
Contributor
*****

Perhaps his sons. They don't seem to be too keen on spending time with him. 

Though he could also be just searching for food while overthinking his options.
Reply

United States BA0701 Online
Super Moderator
******

(12-17-2021, 02:01 AM)1ofCourage Wrote:
(12-12-2021, 04:41 PM)Tonpa Wrote: Nhenha in Singita yesterday 


Was Nhenha looking for the Tsalala lioness and sub?  How would he know that the mother is dead now?
He used to spend time with them.

Hope he doesn't bump into the PC boys out there.
1 user Likes BA0701's post
Reply

Slayerd Offline
Regular Member
***

(12-17-2021, 02:21 AM)Duco Ndona Wrote: Perhaps his sons. They don't seem to be too keen on spending time with him. 

Though he could also be just searching for food while overthinking his options.

I disagree, the videos that we've seen show the males being extremely fond of their father. I've seen 4 of the 6 coming up to him and rubbing against him. The video also shows them following him and not the reverse. I think Nhenha himself chose to leave the subs because the Singita rangers said he left Singita but they were still on the property meaning he chose to leave them
2 users Like Slayerd's post
Reply

Chris Offline
Regular Member
***

(12-17-2021, 04:22 AM)Slayerd Wrote:
(12-17-2021, 02:21 AM)Duco Ndona Wrote: Perhaps his sons. They don't seem to be too keen on spending time with him. 

Though he could also be just searching for food while overthinking his options.

I disagree, the videos that we've seen show the males being extremely fond of their father. I've seen 4 of the 6 coming up to him and rubbing against him. The video also shows them following him and not the reverse. I think Nhenha himself chose to leave the subs because the Singita rangers said he left Singita but they were still on the property meaning he chose to leave them

You are absolutely right! They’ve shown throughout the evidence that we have, that the bond between Nhena and his sons is a strong bond that can fare very well in the future.
1 user Likes Chris's post
Reply

Chris Offline
Regular Member
***

It’s amazing how lion dynamics change rapidly. A few months ago, both Tinyo and Nhena were slowly pushing the subadults out from the pride. But as new males have come and put pressure on the Birmingham boys, they changed completely. And now we can see from a full scope that Nhena may very well see his days as the dominant males of the pride to an end and soon will have to be nomadic. Why not strengthen a bond with his sons and form a coalition? It’s truly amazing the possible scenarios that can happen! 
Now once again we have to stay patient and wait for Tinyo. The lion world is full of surprises!
2 users Like Chris's post
Reply

Duco Ndona Online
Contributor
*****

Have they also showed that bond after they went nomadic? That can make quite a difference. 
Afterall, not that long ago he was pushing the subs away. 

Its not a good sign that now, when reinforcing those bonds is most important, he is seen alone.
1 user Likes Duco Ndona's post
Reply

Chris Offline
Regular Member
***

(12-17-2021, 02:37 PM)Duco Ndona Wrote: Have they also showed that bond after they went nomadic? That can make quite a difference. 
Afterall, not that long ago he was pushing the subs away. 

Its not a good sign that now, when reinforcing those bonds is most important, he is seen alone.

I did not understand your point. The Birminghams are not nomadic yet. The Kambula pride is divided at the moment. But you can see Nhena bonding with his sons which is an indicator that he knows it’s only a matter of time when they will be pushed out and may very well form a coalition with his sons.
Reply






Users browsing this thread:
2 Guest(s)

About Us
Go Social     Subscribe  

Welcome to WILDFACT forum, a website that focuses on sharing the joy that wildlife has on offer. We welcome all wildlife lovers to join us in sharing that joy. As a member you can share your research, knowledge and experience on animals with the community.
wildfact.com is intended to serve as an online resource for wildlife lovers of all skill levels from beginners to professionals and from all fields that belong to wildlife anyhow. Our focus area is wild animals from all over world. Content generated here will help showcase the work of wildlife experts and lovers to the world. We believe by the help of your informative article and content we will succeed to educate the world, how these beautiful animals are important to survival of all man kind.
Many thanks for visiting wildfact.com. We hope you will keep visiting wildfact regularly and will refer other members who have passion for wildlife.

Forum software by © MyBB