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Size comparisons - Printable Version

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RE: Size comparisons - Dark Jaguar - 04-24-2021

Top: Cerrado female Jaguar

Bottom: Cerrado male Jaguar


Camera trap photos taken at same place.

credits: Brasília é o Bicho

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RE: Size comparisons - Maritimus77 - 04-28-2021


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RE: Size comparisons - AndresVida - 04-29-2021

I tried to make some size comparisons

102KG empty Jaguar vs ALLEGED 103KG baited Namibian Leopard

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Wild amur Tiger compared to a man

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Now some comparisons hand made by me


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Amur Tigers compared to man

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Size difference between a female leopard and a male leopard (Anderson)
The female is ridiculously small lol

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Average African Lion skull vs American Lion skull

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RE: Size comparisons - Dark Jaguar - 04-30-2021

As a tribute to the National Caatinga Biome day in Brazil which was yesterday April 28th.


TOP: Vitória Adult Caatinga female Jaguar

BOTTOM: 43 kg Lampião Adult Caatinga male Jaguar (RIP Beast)

credits: Rafael Garay


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*This image is copyright of its original author



Both were captured on a campaign of Caatinga jaguars conservation by CENAP/ICMBio at Serra da Capivara (PI) - Northeast Brazil.

credits: Gediendson

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43 kg Lampião adult Caatinga male Jaguar's paw and human hand.


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RE: Size comparisons - Dark Jaguar - 05-02-2021

From the Florida Museum


Side by Side Skulls

Skull on the Left:  Nile Crocodile from Uganda Skull (Estimated to be from a 15 ft (4.57 m) Specimen)

Skull on the Right:  Black Caiman Skull (Estimated to be from a 16 ft ( 4.84 m) Specimen)

Source and Credits: Florida Museum  https://twitter.com/floridamuseum/status/953753600991334400

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RE: Size comparisons - Balam - 05-04-2021

@"Khan85" this comparison of yours is way off:


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WEIGHT:

GuateGojira and I had a debate about this some time ago, he calculated the most recent average weight for Sumatran tigers as 116.7, excluding runts which may have represented decayed individuals:


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Our table for Pantanal jaguars has their average at around 108 kg, with runts and sub-adult individuals counted, the one thing correct in your image is the maximum weights:


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BODY LENGTH:

Here are the body length measurements gathered by Almeida:


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The head-to-body length for an average male from the Pantanal would've to have been 150, not 140 cm, and that is between the pegs. Through personal communication and recently publicized information we know that one of the heaviest males captured recently had a total body length of 250 cm in his latest capture, he's represented as M1 in this table where information from his first and second capture is included:


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My question is, what are your sources for the body length of the Sumatran tigers, and do you know the measuring method for them?

SHOULDER HEIGHT:

The tallest jaguar measured by Almeida on a straight line and without counting the paw had a height of 81 cm, the tallest jaguar measured under scientific standards by Peter Crawshaw had a shoulder height, also on a straight line and without counting the paw, of 80 cm. Your value of "maximum" shoulder height is completely wrong for the jaguar.

In regards to the tiger, once again can you show us the sources for the measurements as well as the measuring method?

GREATEST SKULL LENGHT:

The greatest skull length for a Pantanal jaguar gathered by Almeida was 324 mm, not 290 mm, that's the average gathered by Hoogesteijn and Mondolfi:


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The greatest skull length for Sumatran tigers according to Mazak and grooves is 339 mm. What your image shows are LS averages rather than greatest dimensions:


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Overall you're shown what could be considered an average male jaguar with dubious and below-average measurements in certain areas against an above-average Sumatran tiger. I'll be expectant to see what are your sources to back up that comparison.

RE: Size comparisons - tigerluver - 05-05-2021

@Balam, quick clarification on “greatest skull length.” That term refers to the measurement rather than saying what the maximum skull length found in the sample in question is. As in, the greatest length of the measured skull, from the prosthion to inion in cats. It’s interchangeable with “total skull length.”

RE: Size comparisons - Balam - 05-05-2021

(05-05-2021, 12:23 AM)tigerluver Wrote: @Balam, quick clarification on “greatest skull length.” That term refers to the measurement rather than saying what the maximum skull length found in the sample in question is. As in, the greatest length of the measured skull, from the prosthion to inion in cats. It’s interchangeable with “total skull length.”

You're correct, my point is that the image in question should've mentioned it was an average measurement considering that the measurements for other portions of the body were inputted as maximums.

RE: Size comparisons - Charger01 - 05-05-2021

@Balam 

Quote:GuateGojira and I had a debate about this some time ago, he calculated the most recent average weight for Sumatran tigers as 116.7, excluding runts which may have represented decayed individuals:
Alright, thanks for the clarification. I wasn't updated on that

For the average weight of adult males, I used only the data from Almeida hence the difference of 2.77 kg

Quote:The head-to-body length for an average male from the Pantanal would've to have been 150, not 140 cm, and that is between the pegs.
Yeah, will correct that. For total length, I took help from Guate's chart


As for the shoulder height, I never mentioned the shoulder height of the tallest jaguar. Only the average


Quote:In regards to the tiger, once again can you show us the sources for the measurements as well as the measuring method?
Again took some help from Guate's charts. And as I already said, I wasn't aware of the changes in the average weight


It was not intentional on my part. I haven't gone into much details of jaguars right now. After Tigers and Lions, I decided to study more about bears. As I learn more about jaguars, I will correct my mistakes.

RE: Size comparisons - Balam - 05-08-2021

Man on a horse and Mexican jaguar follows:


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By NICTE-HA

RE: Size comparisons - AndresVida - 05-09-2021

The newly discovered Big Cat had a monstrous size, as big as today's bears.

Machairodus lahayishupup.

Shoulder Height : 140 cm
Body Size : Average 274/318 kg (209-427 kg)

It hunted Rhinos in North America 


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Newly Identified Species of Saber-Toothed Cat Was So Big It Hunted Rhinos in America
Machairodus lahayishupup (white background)
http://www.sci-news.com/paleontology/machairodus-lahayishupup-09619.html

RE: Size comparisons - Balam - 05-12-2021

Reposting from here:

JAGUAR TIERS DIVIDED BY ECOTYPES
I've made this comparative image as a guideline of jaguar morphology and groupings based on the biome they inhabit. I've seen many people confusing biomes and jaguars from different places, or grouping populations in size classes with other populations that don't belong together, hopefully this will help.

Comments:
  • The SH of jaguars from tier B is taken from one male of 110 kg captured in Porto Primavera, a seasonally flooded area between the Cerrado and At Forest that doesn't belong to either eco-region. In theory, this area would be placed in tier A but since it is so small and by now it has been completely lost due to anthropogenic factors I'm basing the maximum SH recorded in this area for jaguars from tier B who are the closest in proximity and similar maximum weight (P. Crawshaw).
  • Jaguars from the Yungas do not have any recorded weight so far, they are placed under tier C due to them belonging to a similar biome as the other eco-regions, but based on estimates from the team of Red Yaguarete, these jaguars could likely be slightly larger than those form tier C in averages and maximums thanks to the preservation of their habitat.
  • Maximum SH estimates for tiers C to E follow the same statistical trend as those from tier A.

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RE: Size comparisons - DinoFan83 - 05-13-2021

Zygolophodon and 'Megalosaurus' ingens.

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RE: Size comparisons - Balam - 05-20-2021

@tigerluver could you help me estimating the SH of this Llanos male? You've done some great job in the past estimating the heights of male cats in comparison to surrounding females and since SH information from Llanos jaguars, especially Colombian ones, is completely absent I'd thought gauging it based on these nice pictures could be useful:


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For the wither heights around the hip area for cattle, the only information I was able to gather comes from the paper: Comparisons of Angus-, Braunvieh-, Chianina-, Hereford-, Gelbvieh-, Maine Anjou-, and Red Poll-sired cows for weight, weight adjusted for body condition score, height, and body condition score, Arango et al. 2003.


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The particular breed shown here is Brahman zebu which is absent from this study but we could use this table nonetheless considering they overlap in size with some of the breeds showcased here such as the Angus cattle. Adult females have a general weight of 500-700 kg, judging by the well-developed horns on the first cow we can infer this is a mature individual so I would take into consideration only the cattle from years 4 to 8, with hip heights of 125 to 128 cm. Let me know what you think!

RE: Size comparisons - tigerluver - 05-20-2021

@Balam, here are the ratios:


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Using 128 cm hip height for the cow, the shoulder height of the jaguar would be 69 cm (239 px/128 px * 128 cm) and body length 141 cm (264 px/239 px * 128 cm). I feel this too small and maybe we're underestimating the cow.