Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Printable Version +- WildFact (https://wildfact.com/forum) +-- Forum: Premier Section (https://wildfact.com/forum/forum-premier-section) +--- Forum: Articles Archive (https://wildfact.com/forum/forum-articles-archive) +--- Thread: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation (/topic-predation-of-adult-rhino-by-kaziranga-tigers-wii-expert-rabin-sharma%E2%80%99s-documentation) |
RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Pckts - 11-15-2019 (11-15-2019, 02:03 AM)Shadow Wrote:(11-15-2019, 01:37 AM)Pckts Wrote:(11-15-2019, 01:20 AM)Shadow Wrote:(11-15-2019, 01:03 AM)Pckts Wrote:(11-15-2019, 12:50 AM)Shadow Wrote:Calves are considered very young- newborns, considering a rhino calf weighs around 80-140lbs when born, 600kg would surely be a sub adult.(11-15-2019, 12:25 AM)Pckts Wrote:(11-14-2019, 07:38 PM)Shadow Wrote:600kg is no where near a calf, possibly a sub adult but still a huge beast.(11-13-2019, 03:27 PM)Rishi Wrote:(11-13-2019, 12:21 PM)Ashutosh Wrote: Great find @Roflcopters. I seem to recall another case of a tiger and rhino found dead alongside, but, in that instance there was scat discovered of a third tiger. The dead tiger was a sub-adult and the theory went that a big male had killed a female rhino, and this subadult was very much tucking into the kill when the big male discovered it doing so and killed it. Do you happen to know anything about that incident? Ok, that is talking about a "600kg carcass" which has already been significantly eaten could of been much more when intact and regardless, 600kg is far too heavy for a calf, you're talking about animal the size of a cape buffalo. RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Shadow - 11-15-2019 (11-15-2019, 02:43 AM)Pckts Wrote:(11-15-2019, 02:03 AM)Shadow Wrote:(11-15-2019, 01:37 AM)Pckts Wrote:(11-15-2019, 01:20 AM)Shadow Wrote:(11-15-2019, 01:03 AM)Pckts Wrote:(11-15-2019, 12:50 AM)Shadow Wrote:Calves are considered very young- newborns, considering a rhino calf weighs around 80-140lbs when born, 600kg would surely be a sub adult.(11-15-2019, 12:25 AM)Pckts Wrote:(11-14-2019, 07:38 PM)Shadow Wrote:600kg is no where near a calf, possibly a sub adult but still a huge beast.(11-13-2019, 03:27 PM)Rishi Wrote:(11-13-2019, 12:21 PM)Ashutosh Wrote: Great find @Roflcopters. I seem to recall another case of a tiger and rhino found dead alongside, but, in that instance there was scat discovered of a third tiger. The dead tiger was a sub-adult and the theory went that a big male had killed a female rhino, and this subadult was very much tucking into the kill when the big male discovered it doing so and killed it. Do you happen to know anything about that incident? This starts to be ridiculous. But calf isn´t used only about just born animals. When you look at greater one-horned rhinos, some sources talk about calves up to 1,5 years old, some even up to 4 years old. When we are talking about that small carcass, that estimated to be 600 kg, sounds like very young rhino even if tiger has been eating there 1-2 times. That carcass didn´t look like some week old and mostly eaten by scavengers. Maybe there are some more photos showing belly ripped open and most of meat eaten up already? That didn´t look like to be three quarters eaten for me. The greater one-horned rhinoceros (Rhinoceros unicornis), also known as the Indian rhinoceros, is a grey giant, second only to an elephant in size. An adult rhino usually weighs between 2-2.5 metric tonnes. Rhinos usually lead a solitary life, but they may also graze and wallow together. Calves follow their mothers for 1-3 years. Females are sexually mature between 5 and 7 years old, while males mature at about 10 years of age. http://www.wwfnepal.org/what_we_do/wildlife/rhinoceros/ Adult males live a solitary life. Groups consist of females and calves and mothers and their calves stay together for around 4 years. https://www.chesterzoo.org/our-zoo/animals/greater-one-horned-rhino/ RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Rishi - 11-15-2019 (11-15-2019, 01:20 AM)Shadow Wrote: Ok, sub adult for you and calf for me. Or maybe juvenile is right word then. I mean when adult female would be about 2,5-3 times heavier and adult male about 4 times heavier, sub adult sounds stretch too far for me. Or would you consider 50-60 kg male tiger as subadult maybe? When talking about greater one-horned rhino, 600 kg means a little child, no matter what word is used. (11-15-2019, 01:03 AM)Pckts Wrote: Calves are considered very young- newborns, considering a rhino calf weighs around 80-140lbs when born, 600kg would surely be a sub adult. What's there so debatable on this?... 600kg calf means about 1-year-old, ie definitely not a baby but cannot be considered as juvenile either. Human equivalent for it would be a child of 12-13 years. Its mother would be atleast twice its weight, closer to thrice. This is a 3-months-old calf, weighing near 230kg. *This image is copyright of its original author Another calf's 1st birthday, 635 kg. Size comparison: This rescue was one year & few months old, 600kg will be a about this size. *This image is copyright of its original author
RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Pckts - 11-15-2019 That bottom image is not close to a 600kg animal. RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Rishi - 11-15-2019 (11-15-2019, 09:18 AM)Pckts Wrote: That bottom image is not close to a 600kg animal. How do you know? But you could be right. It's a bit older than the 600kg captive calf aged 1 year. But it was rescued from floods, so isn't in best health. RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Pckts - 11-15-2019 (11-15-2019, 09:39 AM)Rishi Wrote:(11-15-2019, 09:18 AM)Pckts Wrote: That bottom image is not close to a 600kg animal. Because i know what a 200kg animal looks like and that Rhino calf may be more robust but its definitely smaller in frame and probably not much more robust overall. I'd say that youngster is in the 200kg mark at best. If you see a 600kg bovine, its massive and you're not mistaking it for a youngster of any animal. A good example is that cape bull that bowls over the elephant youngster. RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Shadow - 11-15-2019 My last comment concerning that 600 kg rhino carcass is, that whatever its called, it´s not the same or even close as adult rhino. When females are in average about 1600 kg and males 2200 kg it´s obvious, that 600 kg means a very small what comes to rhino. And that means also young one, inexperienced and much much easier target for predators when comparing to adults. That´s why that case isn´t so interesting, rhino calves that big are easy targets for biggest cats like tigers and lions, if for some reason separated from mother/other adult rhinos. Two other cases in this thread are then again very interesting ones and hopefully more information can be found out. RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Rishi - 11-15-2019 (11-15-2019, 09:44 AM)Pckts Wrote:(11-15-2019, 09:39 AM)Rishi Wrote:(11-15-2019, 09:18 AM)Pckts Wrote: That bottom image is not close to a 600kg animal. A rhino is not a bovine. They're of much more stout build with short legs & much larger volume. 200kg bovine would be much larger than a 200 kg rhino calf. And between 1ton water-buffalo/gaur bull & a 2ton cow-rhino the difference in height & length dimensions aren't that drastic... while a 1ton rhino probably wouldn't have reached puberty yet, being smaller than the smallest cows of 1.2-1.3ton. *This image is copyright of its original author I get what you're saying, but I think it's too much of apples & oranges in this case. Also we have no reason to doubt the multiple values states by the zoo, especially when both numbers make sense when compared age wise. RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Ashutosh - 11-15-2019 While we are discussing tiger coalitions, I have a very interesting case. At Dudhwa, 4 tigers, a male, female and two cubs killed an adult male rhino aged 20. And, this was supposedly captured on cameras. https://www.business-standard.com/article/pti-stories/tigers-kill-rhino-in-dudhwa-tiger-reserve-117030400336_1.html At Dudhwa, there were other instances of a single male tiger targeting rhinos in park’s animal centre. He killed a couple of cubs and a female. RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Pckts - 11-15-2019 (11-15-2019, 11:25 AM)Rishi Wrote:(11-15-2019, 09:44 AM)Pckts Wrote:(11-15-2019, 09:39 AM)Rishi Wrote:(11-15-2019, 09:18 AM)Pckts Wrote: That bottom image is not close to a 600kg animal. I'm well aware the difference in girth between the two but when you see a large bovine compared to a young rhino of that size you dont mistake it. Also the claim of that young one behind its mother of being 230kg seems unlikely when comparing it to these 2 below Heres a 289lb Rhino actually being weighed. My point was that a 600kg carcass wouldn't be what I consider a calf and the fact that the carcass is quite a bit devoured means it's most likely much larger than that. I'm not saying its a adult or anything else, just not a calf in my book. RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Shadow - 11-18-2019 One more photo concerning that 600 kg (estimated by Sharma) calf carcass. This photo shows in more clear way eaten part of it. *This image is copyright of its original author
RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Pckts - 11-18-2019 (11-18-2019, 10:47 AM)Shadow Wrote: One more photo concerning that 600 kg (estimated by Sharma) calf carcass. This photo shows in more clear way eaten part of it.Big animal, definitely not what I'd consider to be a calf but certainly not full grown either. Also like Rishi said, very rare for Tigers to start with the front, usually they prefer the rump but with a Rhino it may not matter. RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Shadow - 11-18-2019 (11-18-2019, 10:41 PM)Pckts Wrote:(11-18-2019, 10:47 AM)Shadow Wrote: One more photo concerning that 600 kg (estimated by Sharma) calf carcass. This photo shows in more clear way eaten part of it.Big animal, definitely not what I'd consider to be a calf but certainly not full grown either. Photos of this calf are good examples how perspective can make same carcass to look like small and big depending about is, that is object or animal used to comparison in front or behind. Big carcass: *This image is copyright of its original author Small carcass: *This image is copyright of its original author Big carcass: *This image is copyright of its original author Those photos are the reason why I trust mostly to it, what Sharma say, 600 kg heavy and that means a calf about 1 year old or a bit older. Nice prey and a lot of eat for a tiger. RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Pckts - 11-19-2019 (11-18-2019, 11:41 PM)Shadow Wrote:(11-18-2019, 10:41 PM)Pckts Wrote:(11-18-2019, 10:47 AM)Shadow Wrote: One more photo concerning that 600 kg (estimated by Sharma) calf carcass. This photo shows in more clear way eaten part of it.Big animal, definitely not what I'd consider to be a calf but certainly not full grown either. There is a big difference between a Tiger and Human being, of course a carcass will look smaller in front of a Tiger compared to a human and it never looked small to me even with the Tiger in front of the Carcass and the People behind the carcass. That's a big animal, a 600kg animal with that much meat removed (estimated) is huge, it's as large as most Buffalo bulls and if you've ever seen a Cape buffalo, you know they are big animals. In regards to it's age, I'm not sure if it's a year or a couple of years, since I assume the only thing you're going off of was the post about a 600kg Rhino in captivity celebrating it's first bday, but I've already posted a few animals that are being weighed and you can see just how large a 200kg Rhino is, something that is 3-4 times their size will most likely need more time to grow into it. Here you can see a one year old Rhino estimated to be 857lbs or 388kg "Baby White Rhino "Sawyer" Turns 1! Rhinoceros baby celebrates his birthday with rhino sized treats Natural Bridge, VA – August 24th – It's been one year since the Virginia Safari Park welcomed its first baby white rhinoceros, a monumental birth for a critically endangered species. The healthy baby boy was born after a 16-month pregnancy to “Samira” a 6 year-old female. Baby Sawyer weighed about 100 pounds at birth and has gained weight steadily. His zookeepers estimate he weighs roughly 875 pounds today, which is still relatively small compared to the weights of adult females like his mother, Samira, who weigh roughly 3,000 to 4,000 pounds and adult males that can weigh up to 5,000 pounds." http://www.virginiasafaripark.com/News/TabId/226/ArtMID/1002/ArticleID/26/Baby-White-Rhino-Sawyer-Turns-1.aspx and here is another one year old in the 800lb area "February 7 calls for celebration--at least at Cleveland's Metropolitan Zoo. The Zoo is celebrating the first birthday of baby rhino Lulu. Gaining 850 pounds in one year, the zoo says Lulu is thriving. " In honor of Lulu's special day and throwback Thursday, the zoo posted photos from her first mud bath. https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/local/cleveland/happy-birthday-rhino-at-cleveland-zoo-turns-1-year-old/95-c9301406-5a65-4198-b3f3-6244f5103a08#:~:targetText=February%207%20calls%20for%20celebration,from%20her%20first%20mud%20bath. And this is a 1 year old Wild Rhino My guess would be that Rhino is older than 1 for sure, it's a large animal. Especially if it's mother was no longer with it, it most certainly was older than that. RE: Predation of Adult Rhino By Kaziranga Tigers: WII Expert Rabin Sharma’s Documentation - Roflcopters - 11-19-2019 Quote:Golden tabby? I guess it happens. And there would be no reason for the male and the female to be aggressive towards each other after all, they are probably mates/already live along side each other, no? I couldn’t think of what to call her besides her coded name, so i figured i’d just call her golden tabby tigress. inspired by the topic on this forum about golden tigers and you’re right. they were most likely mates sharing the kill. @Dennis Quote:Great find @Roflcopters. I seem to recall another case of a tiger and rhino found dead alongside, but, in that instance there was scat discovered of a third tiger. The dead tiger was a sub-adult and the theory went that a big male had killed a female rhino, and this subadult was very much tucking into the kill when the big male discovered it doing so and killed it. Do you happen to know anything about that incident? you’re right, i decided to cross-check and it seems like this is the same account. Nov/7/2017 @Ashutosh A Royal Bengal Tiger and a Rhinoceros Found Dead in Kaziranga After the terrible incident of losing three one-horned rhinos in three days in Kaziranga, the park again mourned the death of one more rhino and a Royal Bengal Tiger. However, this time the reason for the death is not poaching but a brawl between the two animals which unfortunately lost their lives in the fight. The carcasses of the two animals of endangered species were found lying next to each other on Tuesday, Nov 7, 2017, by the forest officials in the Bagori Range of the park. The forest officials suspect the reason to be the fight between the two animals on the account that the rhino’s horn and the body parts of the tiger were intact. While the dead tiger is said to be a sub-adult male of about two-and-a-half-year, the rhino was a female of around 20 years. According to officials, another possible reason of the death of the animals could be that an adult tiger might have killed the rhino, and the sub-adult tiger strayed into the adult tiger’s territory and eyed a share of the rhino meat, reluctant to share, the older tiger might have killed him as well. The officials suggest this theory after finding fresh tiger droppings close to the two carcasses. Tiger predation is a common case in Kaziranga National Park, however, the death of both the animals is the rarest sight in the reserve. There have been around 472 rhinos due to tiger predation in Kaziranga National Park between the year 1982 and 2014 and the highest casualties of around 26 rhinos were reported in the year 2004. https://www.kaziranga-national-park.com/blog/royal-bengal-tiger-and-rhinoceros-found-dead-in-kaziranga/ so it seems like that was an Adult female and not an Adult male, either way. that was a massive animal estimated to be fully grown and about 20 years of age. if you watch the video, it’s hard to believe a tiger killed a rhino that big but the carcass was carefully examined under Kaziranga park director and Wildlife Institute of India and it was confirmed killed by a tiger. incredible. KZT085 killed both the rhino and the sub-adult male. |