The Mighty Mapogos

[LionKiss]

(11-06-2016, 08:50 PM)Majingilane Wrote:

(11-06-2016, 08:10 PM)fursan syed Wrote: Mapogos left Quality rather than Quantity.

So in what way are these lionesses better than others?

1)they escaped death from the majingilane under the guidance of an older lioness,
2)they have raised 9 out of 9 cubs to a sexual mature age, 2 of the 6 younger lionesses are already pregnant by the Matimbas
3) they produced another 12 cubs who I hope they will reach maturity too

what other lionesses have produced 21 cubs?
and what other lionesses have a 9/9 survival rate? Reply

[Tshokwane]

(11-06-2016, 10:23 PM)LionKiss Wrote: 1)they escaped death from the majingilane under the guidance of an older lioness,

Yes. And the same happens to countless others that survive a takeover. The success in this case is on the lioness, not necessarily on the subadults, at least not at first.

Quote:2)they have raised 9 out of 9 cubs to a sexual mature age,

3) they produced another 12 cubs who I hope they will reach maturity too

what other lionesses have produced 21 cubs?

and what other lionesses have a 9/9 survival rate?

True, to an extent. They certainly are good mothers.

But all of this depends on the males that protect them and their territory. 

Remember that they already had cubs with the Selati males, but they couldn't do anything to keep them from getting killed.

Still, I don't think you're going to call them of "less quality" just because they lost a set of cubs. Reply

[LionKiss]

(11-06-2016, 10:51 PM)Majingilane Wrote:

(11-06-2016, 10:23 PM)LionKiss Wrote: 1)they escaped death from the majingilane under the guidance of an older lioness,

Yes. And the same happens to countless others that survive a takeover. The success in this case is on the lioness, not necessarily on the subadults, at least not at first.

Quote:2)they have raised 9 out of 9 cubs to a sexual mature age,

3) they produced another 12 cubs who I hope they will reach maturity too

what other lionesses have produced 21 cubs?

and what other lionesses have a 9/9 survival rate?

True, to an extent. They certainly are good mothers.

But all of this depends on the males that protect them and their territory. 

Remember that they already had cubs with the Selati males, but they couldn't do anything to keep them from getting killed.

Still, I don't think you're going to call them of "less quality" just because they lost a set of cubs.

give me an example of the countless others that survive a takeover, of course it is the lioness who lead them to safety but they followed her instructions and were resilient enough to withstand the vicissitudes of their escape, they were very young cubs, 

4-5 months ago the 4 lionesses were chased by the Maitimbas, there is a Londolozi report and they escaped alone without the protection of the Males, Majingilane. The majingilane were in Idube

and NO they had no cubs with the Selatis, probably you are confusing them with the Xihmungwe Pride
in addition all those 9 youngsters have already shown and increased aggressiveness by chasing away other animals and being exceptional hunters, again there is a Londolozi report about it, above 

Reply

[LionKiss]

@Majingilane,
one more point,

you can't go against the nature, the Mapogos were exceptional Lions, they showed extreme behavior you can't deny this
and if you respect Nature, Biology, Genetics, Science you can't deny that their ancestors carrying their Genetic Code could have similar qualities. Reply

[Tshokwane]

(11-06-2016, 11:05 PM)LionKiss Wrote: give me an example of the countless others that survive a takeover

I hope this is a joke.

If it's not, then a belief based on just some decades of recorded history doesn't hold much ground against what millions of lions we know nothing of. Use to compare the examples of the prides of the Masai Mara, so many times filmed in the diary of big cats.

I will say it again. In general, the survival rate of cubs to adult life depends in a huge way of how well the dominant males protect the territory.

(11-06-2016, 11:05 PM)LionKiss Wrote: 4-5 months ago the 4 lionesses were chased by the Maitimbas, there is a Londolozi report and they escaped alone without the protection of the Males, Majingilane

Sure. So what about it? They're already adult lionesses.

Quote:and NO they had no cubs with the Selatis

That is correct, I was wrong. I forgot they used to live more to the east.

Quote:in addition all those 9 youngsters have already shown and increased aggressiveness by chasing away other animals and being exceptional hunters

I don't see how this has anything to do with what we're discussing. All lions must hunt. If they don't, they die. Reply

[Tshokwane]

(11-06-2016, 11:09 PM)LionKiss Wrote: @Majingilane,
one more point,

you can't go against the nature, 

True, which is why I don't want the antromorphization of some animals distort how they are truly.

Quote:the Mapogos were exceptional Lions, they showed extreme behavior you can't deny this

That is true.

Quote:and if you respect Nature, Biology, Genetics, Science you can't deny that their ancestors carrying their Genetic Code could have similar qualities.

Yes and no.

Their direct ancestors, their fathers, kicked the crap out of the dominant males when they tookover.

They were, however, much more successful in other regards, particularly when it comes to raising cubs to adulthood. Reply

[LionKiss]

(11-06-2016, 11:28 PM)Majingilane Wrote:

(11-06-2016, 11:09 PM)LionKiss Wrote: @Majingilane,
one more point,

you can't go against the nature, 

True, which is why I don't want the antromorphization of some animals distort how they are truly.

Quote:the Mapogos were exceptional Lions, they showed extreme behavior you can't deny this

That is true.

Quote:and if you respect Nature, Biology, Genetics, Science you can't deny that their ancestors carrying their Genetic Code could have similar qualities.

Yes and no.

Their direct ancestors, their fathers, kicked the crap out of the dominant males when they tookover.

They were, however, much more successful in other regards, particularly when it comes to raising cubs to adulthood.

This is the epitome of Anthropomorphization, you compare directly the Lions to a good human family with kids and cats and a nice house.

their direct ancestors have produced many lions who show a very mediocre or even below normal passive behavior like the Styx 

and in Biology and Genetics a quality could reappear after 2-3 generations and not in their direct ancestors.


and the Majingilane killed KT in 1 vs 4
while KT and MrT killed the 5th Majingilane in 1 vs 2

this is the only documented killings nothing else. Reply

[LionKiss]

(11-06-2016, 11:24 PM)Majingilane Wrote:

(11-06-2016, 11:05 PM)LionKiss Wrote: give me an example of the countless others that survive a takeover

I hope this is a joke.

If it's not, then a belief based on just some decades of recorded history doesn't hold much ground against what millions of lions we know nothing of. Use to compare the examples of the prides of the Masai Mara, so many times filmed in the diary of big cats.

I will say it again. In general, the survival rate of cubs to adult life depends in a huge way of how well the dominant males protect the territory.


Obviously you failed to come up with one single example

(11-06-2016, 11:05 PM)LionKiss Wrote: 4-5 months ago the 4 lionesses were chased by the Maitimbas, there is a Londolozi report and they escaped alone without the protection of the Males, Majingilane

Sure. So what about it? They're already adult lionesses.

there are several adult lionesses who fail to protect their prides when attacked by new males. Mangheni did not fail.

Quote:and NO they had no cubs with the Selatis

That is correct, I was wrong. I forgot they used to live more to the east.

Quote:in addition all those 9 youngsters have already shown and increased aggressiveness by chasing away other animals and being exceptional hunters

I don't see how this has anything to do with what we're discussing. All lions must hunt. If they don't, they die.


lions are hunters but Mangheni youngsters are much above average,

see my reply above in blue Reply

[sanjay]

Stop comparing Mapogos, Majingilane and Matimbas.
Focus on good debate and information. Reply

[LionKiss]

we speak about Lions, Lions fight each other to death,
it is not possible to avoid comparisons. Reply

[WLion]

(11-06-2016, 04:00 AM)Ngala Wrote: @WLion Welcome to the forum.

Left to right i think are: Dreadlocks, Pretty Boy, Makhulu and Rasta.

based from the photos, the lion second from the left seem to be the biggest one (broader head).
one on far left and far right seem like twin (PB and Rasta). cool input anyway. Reply

[Tshokwane]

(11-07-2016, 12:42 AM)LionKiss Wrote: we speak about Lions, Lions fight each other to death,
it is not possible to avoid comparisons.

The problem is that you let it blind you, instead of using it to learn how lions in general are, which is the reason for this and the other threads.

This is not for promoting the worship of "superior" lions, all we want here is to learn.

Like Sanjay says, the focus should be on good information on their lives. Reply

[LionKiss]

(11-07-2016, 03:18 AM)Majingilane Wrote:

(11-07-2016, 12:42 AM)LionKiss Wrote: we speak about Lions, Lions fight each other to death,
it is not possible to avoid comparisons.

The problem is that you let it blind you, instead of using it to learn how lions in general are, which is the reason for this and the other threads.

This is not for promoting the worship of "superior" lions, all we want here is to learn.

Like Sanjay says, the focus should be on good information on their lives.

you are off topic, here we speak about lions not about us, Reply

[fursan syed]

Rasta full power 

Picture Greg McCall Peat

*This image is copyright of its original author

Reply

[Pckts]

(11-07-2016, 03:00 AM)WLion Wrote:

(11-06-2016, 04:00 AM)Ngala Wrote: @WLion Welcome to the forum.

Left to right i think are: Dreadlocks, Pretty Boy, Makhulu and Rasta.

based from the photos, the lion second from the left seem to be the biggest one (broader head).
one on far left and far right seem like twin (PB and Rasta). cool input anyway.

"Broader head" doesn't necessarily mean "biggest lion" Reply