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The biggest dinosaurs that lived on Earth

United States tigerluver Offline
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#31
( This post was last modified: 09-01-2016, 05:57 AM by tigerluver )

A gigantic new dinosaur from Argentina and the evolution of the sauropod hind foot

Another competitor for the historical world record of mass. Check out this humerus (UNCUYO-LD 301):

*This image is copyright of its original author


Using Campione and Evans equation, the specimen was estimated to weigh 60.4 metric tons, edging the very robust Dreadnoughtus estimates based on the same equation. The authors do point out that a new volumetric estimated Dreadnoughtus to be closer to 40 metric tons, thus Notocolossus may have been a bit more than that. Nevertheless, new doesn't necessarily mean better but the volumetric equation is very convincing, and thus maybe 42-45 tons would be a more accurate weight for the new Notocolossus.
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United States tigerluver Offline
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#32

To start, this is the study that asserted that the simple regression equations provided by Campione and Evans produced overestimates for giant sauropods:
Downsizing a giant: re-evaluating Dreadnoughtus body mass

Their point was that when you model a Dreadnoughtus, there's no way it can realistically carry 60 tons of mass with the given frame. They then estimate a maximum weight of Dreadnoughtus specimen to be 22-38 metric tons. 

Now let's focus on the new Notocolussus. It is estimate to be 60.4 metric tons by the Campione and Evans equations, so slightly heavier than Dreadnoughtus. Using the volumetric method, Notocolussus would likely be estimated to around 24-40 metric tons. Quite a discrepancy between the two methods.

Perhaps there is a way we can visually interpret which estimate was more likely.

First, I scaled an elephant skeleton so that its humeral length equal that of a giant sauropod (Notocolossus in this case).


*This image is copyright of its original author

From this comparison, which do you think will be heavier? To me, the sauropod seems to have a bit more surface area which may result in more weight, but then the pneumatized (hollowed) vertebrae of the sauropod could also undo the added weight. 

Now, we can do a simple isometric comparison. Disclaimer, I highly doubt an elephant and a sauropod scale isometrically whatsoever, but we can get a rough range of possibility from this simple procedure. 

An Asian elephant (ZMUC 1399) from Campione and Evans (2012) weighed 3,534 kg and had a humerus of length 830 mm and midshaft circumference of 310 mm. Notocolossus had a humerus length of 1760 mm and a midshaft circumference of 770 mm. Isometrically relating each corresponding value calculates as follows:

Length-based mass = (1760 mm/830 mm)^3 * 3,534 kg = 33,700 kg
Circumference-based mass = (770 mm/310 mm)^3 * 3,534 kg = 54,200 kg
Averaging to ~44 metric tons.

With the sauropod known to have adaptations to reduce mass for its frame that the elephant lacks, clearly 61 metric tons does seem like a hefty overestimate.
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Guatemala GuateGojira Offline
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#33

They could be large, but none of them surpass the figure of c.83 tons of the Argentinosaurus.
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United States tigerluver Offline
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#34
( This post was last modified: 09-11-2016, 02:03 AM by tigerluver )

Argentinosaurus huinculensis 

I see the 83 metric ton estimate for Argentinosaurus, nearly twice that of the other titans. Such deserves an investigation. To begin, here is the giant Argentinosaurus specimen's records.

Original description: Un nuevo y gigantesco sauropodo titanosaurio de la Formacion Río Limay (Albiano-Cenomaniano) de la provincia del Neuquén, Argentina

English translation of the above is attached to this post. 

The mass estimation: March of the Titans: The Locomotor Capabilities of Sauropod Dinosaurs


The fossils:

*This image is copyright of its original author


*This image is copyright of its original author


*This image is copyright of its original author


*This image is copyright of its original author


*This image is copyright of its original author


*This image is copyright of its original author


Attached Files
.doc   Bonaparte&Coria_93.doc (Size: 77.5 KB / Downloads: 1)
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India brotherbear Offline
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#35

https://www.livescience.com/63695-giant-...osaur.html  
 
'Thunderclap at Dawn' Dino's Totally Metal Name Honors Colossal Size

By Laura Geggel, Senior Writer | September 27, 2018 11:50am ET
 Grizzly  - Boss of the Woods.
        
  
             
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Canada DinoFan83 Online
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#36

Apatosaurus is pretty underrated in terms of weight. The OMNH 1670 specimen would have been 80 tons when full grown, and OMNH 1331 about 95 (scaling up)
Not to mention CM 3018, the holotype, would be about 40 tons 
And OMNH 2162
https://svpow.com/2017/05/23/omnh-2162-probable-dorsal-2-of-the-big-apatosaur/

https://svpow.com/2018/01/28/omnh-1331-another-big-apatosaurine-caudal/
https://svpow.com/2017/12/20/omnh-1670-a-fat-shark-the-past-and-the-future/
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Guatemala GuateGojira Offline
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#37

(09-30-2019, 03:10 PM)DinoFan83 Wrote: Apatosaurus is pretty underrated in terms of weight. The OMNH 1670 specimen would have been 80 tons when full grown, and OMNH 1331 about 95 (scaling up)
Not to mention CM 3018, the holotype, would be about 40 tons 
And OMNH 2162
https://svpow.com/2017/05/23/omnh-2162-probable-dorsal-2-of-the-big-apatosaur/

https://svpow.com/2018/01/28/omnh-1331-another-big-apatosaurine-caudal/
https://svpow.com/2017/12/20/omnh-1670-a-fat-shark-the-past-and-the-future/

Apatosaurus (and also Brontosaurus, I guess) where short but very robust dinosaurs. I am not surprised that they had such a big weights. Interestingly, the longer but much lighter build Diplodocus weighed about half of what Apatosaurus reached.

Thanks for sharing.
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Canada DinoFan83 Online
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#38

(09-30-2019, 07:58 PM)GuateGojira Wrote:
(09-30-2019, 03:10 PM)DinoFan83 Wrote: Apatosaurus is pretty underrated in terms of weight. The OMNH 1670 specimen would have been 80 tons when full grown, and OMNH 1331 about 95 (scaling up)
Not to mention CM 3018, the holotype, would be about 40 tons 
And OMNH 2162
https://svpow.com/2017/05/23/omnh-2162-probable-dorsal-2-of-the-big-apatosaur/

https://svpow.com/2018/01/28/omnh-1331-another-big-apatosaurine-caudal/
https://svpow.com/2017/12/20/omnh-1670-a-fat-shark-the-past-and-the-future/

Apatosaurus (and also Brontosaurus, I guess) where short but very robust dinosaurs. I am not surprised that they had such a big weights. Interestingly, the longer but much lighter build Diplodocus weighed about half of what Apatosaurus reached.

Thanks for sharing.

True! Apatosaurus is a VERY solid animal; I'd in fact say the difference between Diplodocus and Apatosaurus is like the difference between a spoon and a twig.
At 21 meters, Apatosaurus is 20 tons. Meanwhile, Diplodocus is 20 tons at 34 meters. And at or near length parity (say, the big 34 meter Diplodocus that was thought to be Seismosaurus vs the OMNH 1331 or OMNH 1329 Apatosaurus), the difference is immense - 20 vs 95 tons. 
In and of itself, Apatosaurus is a pretty big animal overall - we have no mature specimens aside from OMNH 133 and possibly OMNH 1329.
So, I think a weight range of 20-95 tons is good. The mean is 57.5 tons, about the same as Sauroposeidon.
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Canada DinoFan83 Online
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#39
( This post was last modified: 11-06-2019, 11:23 PM by DinoFan83 )

Mamenchisaurus sinocanadorum - 35 meters and 75 tonnes. One of the biggest dinosaurs of all and quite possibly Asia's largest dinosaur

*This image is copyright of its original author

75 tonnes may even be an underestimate. Scaling a 25 meter, 25 tonne Mamenchisaurus anyuensis to 35 meters gives an animal of 85 tonnes.
This sauropod was enormous!
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Canada DinoFan83 Online
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#40
( This post was last modified: 10-19-2019, 06:33 AM by DinoFan83 )

Looks like a sauropod we once thought was relatively small is actually enormous.
Forget Argentinosaurus, forget Notocolussus, forget Patagotitan, Barosaurus is probably the 'king', at an estimated 100 tonnes!
https://svpow.com/2016/09/16/how-horrifying-was-the-neck-of-barosaurus/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barosaurus#Description

Honestly, this animal would squash Tyrannosaurus rex like a piece of litter.
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Australia GreenGrolar Offline
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#41

Personally, I beleive that the souropods have an extremely strong skeleton in order to sustain their immense weight and their tails are made like powerful whips. I doubt any predator would dare attack the largest of souropods.
https://greennature.proboards.com/

GreenEarthBirds - a forum focused on birds.
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Switzerland Spalea Offline
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#42

I just quote this from wikipedia:

" Barosaurus was an enormous animal, with some adults measuring more than 26 meters (85 feet) in length and weighing more than 20 metric tons (22 short tons).[2] There are some indications of even larger individuals, probably over 50 meters long and with a mass around 100 tonnes making it possibly the largest known dinosaur.[3] Barosaurus was differently proportioned than its close relative Diplodocus, with a longer neck and shorter tail, but was about the same length overall. It was longer than Apatosaurus, but its skeleton was less robust.[4]"

Thus Barosaurus seemed to be built like an diplodocus: very long body but light frame.

Argentinosaurus would have been 35 meters long and weighed 80 tons. Bruhathkayosaurus 34 meters long and 90 tons. Built like the apatosaurus they seemed to be more robust animals. Other dinosaurs seemed to enjoy the same frame: brachiosaurus, paralititan, sauroposeidon... Als were titanosauridae.

I know that, mostly of you don't like wikipedia but we are just speculating from a few bones discovered. Thus no reason to get excited about them and drag some definitiv judgments.

Diplodocus was a "slight" sauropod, but if he could use its tail like a whip, the blow could be fatal for any predator. If I say that for a diplodocus, as concerns the bigger sauropods it was even more true. I truly think that adult sauropods couldn't fear any predator, except perhaps if they hunted in pride, but even so they should have prefered to attack a juvenile one or a wounded adult...
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Malaysia johnny rex Offline
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#43

(10-19-2019, 03:27 PM)Spalea Wrote: I just quote this from wikipedia:

" Barosaurus was an enormous animal, with some adults measuring more than 26 meters (85 feet) in length and weighing more than 20 metric tons (22 short tons).[2] There are some indications of even larger individuals, probably over 50 meters long and with a mass around 100 tonnes making it possibly the largest known dinosaur.[3] Barosaurus was differently proportioned than its close relative Diplodocus, with a longer neck and shorter tail, but was about the same length overall. It was longer than Apatosaurus, but its skeleton was less robust.[4]"

Thus Barosaurus seemed to be built like an diplodocus: very long body but light frame.

Argentinosaurus would have been 35 meters long and weighed 80 tons. Bruhathkayosaurus 34 meters long and 90 tons. Built like the apatosaurus they seemed to be more robust animals. Other dinosaurs seemed to enjoy the same frame: brachiosaurus, paralititan, sauroposeidon... Als were titanosauridae.

I know that, mostly of you don't like wikipedia but we are just speculating from a few bones discovered. Thus no reason to get excited about them and drag some definitiv judgments.

Diplodocus was a "slight" sauropod, but if he could use its tail like a whip, the blow could be fatal for any predator. If I say that for a diplodocus, as concerns the bigger sauropods it was even more true. I truly think that adult sauropods couldn't fear any predator, except perhaps if they hunted in pride, but even so they should have prefered to attack a juvenile one or a wounded adult...

I personally think those robust sauropods are much heavier than gracile sauropods such as diplodocids. It's like comparing elephants to giraffes.
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Switzerland Spalea Offline
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#44

(10-19-2019, 03:37 PM)johnny rex Wrote:
(10-19-2019, 03:27 PM)Spalea Wrote: I just quote this from wikipedia:

" Barosaurus was an enormous animal, with some adults measuring more than 26 meters (85 feet) in length and weighing more than 20 metric tons (22 short tons).[2] There are some indications of even larger individuals, probably over 50 meters long and with a mass around 100 tonnes making it possibly the largest known dinosaur.[3] Barosaurus was differently proportioned than its close relative Diplodocus, with a longer neck and shorter tail, but was about the same length overall. It was longer than Apatosaurus, but its skeleton was less robust.[4]"

Thus Barosaurus seemed to be built like an diplodocus: very long body but light frame.

Argentinosaurus would have been 35 meters long and weighed 80 tons. Bruhathkayosaurus 34 meters long and 90 tons. Built like the apatosaurus they seemed to be more robust animals. Other dinosaurs seemed to enjoy the same frame: brachiosaurus, paralititan, sauroposeidon... Als were titanosauridae.

I know that, mostly of you don't like wikipedia but we are just speculating from a few bones discovered. Thus no reason to get excited about them and drag some definitiv judgments.

Diplodocus was a "slight" sauropod, but if he could use its tail like a whip, the blow could be fatal for any predator. If I say that for a diplodocus, as concerns the bigger sauropods it was even more true. I truly think that adult sauropods couldn't fear any predator, except perhaps if they hunted in pride, but even so they should have prefered to attack a juvenile one or a wounded adult...

I personally think those robust sauropods are much heavier than gracile sauropods such as diplodocids. It's like comparing elephants to giraffes.

Quite agree ! There are two kinds of body frame among sauropods: very long and slight (diplodocus, mamenchisaurus...) and very heavy and robust (apatosaurus and titanosauridae...).  Barosaurus seems to be built like a giraffe-sauropod, for taking up your comparaison.
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Canada DinoFan83 Online
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#45

(10-19-2019, 03:37 PM)johnny rex Wrote:
(10-19-2019, 03:27 PM)Spalea Wrote: I just quote this from wikipedia:

" Barosaurus was an enormous animal, with some adults measuring more than 26 meters (85 feet) in length and weighing more than 20 metric tons (22 short tons).[2] There are some indications of even larger individuals, probably over 50 meters long and with a mass around 100 tonnes making it possibly the largest known dinosaur.[3] Barosaurus was differently proportioned than its close relative Diplodocus, with a longer neck and shorter tail, but was about the same length overall. It was longer than Apatosaurus, but its skeleton was less robust.[4]"

Thus Barosaurus seemed to be built like an diplodocus: very long body but light frame.

Argentinosaurus would have been 35 meters long and weighed 80 tons. Bruhathkayosaurus 34 meters long and 90 tons. Built like the apatosaurus they seemed to be more robust animals. Other dinosaurs seemed to enjoy the same frame: brachiosaurus, paralititan, sauroposeidon... Als were titanosauridae.

I know that, mostly of you don't like wikipedia but we are just speculating from a few bones discovered. Thus no reason to get excited about them and drag some definitiv judgments.

Diplodocus was a "slight" sauropod, but if he could use its tail like a whip, the blow could be fatal for any predator. If I say that for a diplodocus, as concerns the bigger sauropods it was even more true. I truly think that adult sauropods couldn't fear any predator, except perhaps if they hunted in pride, but even so they should have prefered to attack a juvenile one or a wounded adult...

I personally think those robust sauropods are much heavier than gracile sauropods such as diplodocids. It's like comparing elephants to giraffes.

Not quite. Barosaurus and Supersaurus are 'gracile' sauropods, and they are pretty big (35-40 and 100 tons)

@Spalea 
Well, not quite. Mamenchisaurus is actually quite a robust animal; it weighs about 3.5 times as much as Diplodocus at length parity, and in fact outweighs a 34-37 meter Argentinosaurus by 2 tons (35 meters, 75 tons). So yes, I think we can put it as robust
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