Lions of Timbavati

[Tr1x24]

(10-19-2020, 11:10 PM)TinoArmando Wrote: That's is what i said. If those sub-adults are much younger than 3 years old. Also are most likely Avoca/Giraffe sons
We don't know how hard or easy was the life of the sub-adults from the Birmingham pride. 
That's can affect the grown of the mane and size

We dont know exactly when Ross males takeover Birmingham Breakaway.. They come from the west, so they might takeover Breakeaway before the main pride.. And that would mean in early 2018, which would mean that those young males are theirs..

But lets take that those young males are 3 yrs old, that means born in late 2017,i think Ross males would kill them in takeover, because they would be at most 1 yrs old.. No?

On that video from late 2017, theres no cubs, just 5 members, it looks like 3 lionesses and 2 subadults, prob the oldest male.. Reply

[Timbavati]

(10-19-2020, 11:21 PM)Tr1x24 Wrote:

(10-19-2020, 11:10 PM)TinoArmando Wrote: That's is what i said. If those sub-adults are much younger than 3 years old. Also are most likely Avoca/Giraffe sons
We don't know how hard or easy was the life of the sub-adults from the Birmingham pride. 
That's can affect the grown of the mane and size

We dont know exactly when Ross males takeover Birmingham Breakaway.. They come from the west, so they might takeover Breakeaway before the main pride.. And that would mean in early 2018, which would mean that those young males are theirs..

But lets take that those young males are 3 yrs old, that means born in late 2017,i think Ross males would kill them in takeover, because they would be at most 1 yrs old.. No?

On that video from late 2017, theres no cubs, just 5 members, it looks like 3 lionesses and 2 subadults, prob the oldest male..

The Ross males have took-over the Birmingham pride around April 2018 (before or after) I don't remember exactly.
At that time the Birmingham pride breakaway from the main Birmingham pride with a few cubs sired by the Avoca/Giraffe males. Words by Shindzela Rangers.
Definitely,those sub-adults belongs to the previous dominant males Reply

[Potato]

(10-19-2020, 10:55 PM)TinoArmando Wrote:

(10-19-2020, 10:49 PM)Potato Wrote: "I stay behind the words of mister Chad Cocking"

I literally gave you link to his raport from the  time Mbiris were competed with Nharhus over River pride. 

"If the Mbiri male [Shaka] was on 2v1 against the Nharhu males he wasn't able live to count it. "

There haven't been any other than Nharhus male lions in the arena by that time. Shaka also had wounds to his hind quaters (as it is stated in Tanda Tulaąs raports)  which is give away for the confrontation one vs two or more. Moreover Shaka isn't neither first or second who survived such  a confrontation. 

Okay... Going through this logic the Nharhu males have beaten the Mbiri male easily. because I didn't see any scar on the three males.

That is how it is with few against one cases. Ok... Going through your logic injures on Mbiri male appeared from nowhere. Absoluse coincidence was that Nharhu males were the only male lions in the arena and absolute coincidence was that both coalitions were compate at that time for same pride and mated with same female. Reply

[Timbavati]

Birmingham breakaways cubs June 2018
Image by: Johan Smalman

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

Reply

[Timbavati]

(10-20-2020, 12:02 AM)Potato Wrote:

(10-19-2020, 10:55 PM)TinoArmando Wrote:

(10-19-2020, 10:49 PM)Potato Wrote: "I stay behind the words of mister Chad Cocking"

I literally gave you link to his raport from the  time Mbiris were competed with Nharhus over River pride. 

"If the Mbiri male [Shaka] was on 2v1 against the Nharhu males he wasn't able live to count it. "

There haven't been any other than Nharhus male lions in the arena by that time. Shaka also had wounds to his hind quaters (as it is stated in Tanda Tulaąs raports)  which is give away for the confrontation one vs two or more. Moreover Shaka isn't neither first or second who survived such  a confrontation. 

Okay... Going through this logic the Nharhu males have beaten the Mbiri male easily. because I didn't see any scar on the three males.

That is how it is with few against one cases. Ok... Going through your logic injures on Mbiri male appeared from nowhere. Absoluse coincidence was that Nharhu males were the only male lions in the arena and absolute coincidence was that both coalitions were compate at that time for same pride and mated with same female.

Ask to Chad Cocking.
I'll ask the same

Best regards Reply

[Tr1x24]

(10-19-2020, 11:42 PM)TinoArmando Wrote: The Ross males have took-over the Birmingham pride around April 2018 (before or after) I don't remember exactly.
At that time the Birmingham pride breakaway from the main Birmingham pride with a few cubs sired by the Avoca/Giraffe males. Words by Shindzela Rangers.
Definitely,those sub-adults belongs to the previous dominant males

Ok, i dont have much info on that topic, i just speculated.. 

So Birmingham breakeaway was formed to save the cubs from Ross males?

Do even Ross males control Birmingham Breakaway?? Reply

[Timbavati]

(10-20-2020, 12:11 AM)Tr1x24 Wrote:

(10-19-2020, 11:42 PM)TinoArmando Wrote: The Ross males have took-over the Birmingham pride around April 2018 (before or after) I don't remember exactly.
At that time the Birmingham pride breakaway from the main Birmingham pride with a few cubs sired by the Avoca/Giraffe males. Words by Shindzela Rangers.
Definitely,those sub-adults belongs to the previous dominant males

Ok, i dont have much info on that topic, i just speculated.. 

So Birmingham breakeaway was formed to save the cubs from Ross males?

Do even Ross males control Birmingham Breakaway??

As far I remember. the Stompie female always avoided the Ross males also her was very aggressive towards them. So most likely the Ross males didn't interacted with the pride Reply

[Timbavati]

(10-20-2020, 12:02 AM)Potato Wrote:

(10-19-2020, 10:55 PM)TinoArmando Wrote:

(10-19-2020, 10:49 PM)Potato Wrote: "I stay behind the words of mister Chad Cocking"

I literally gave you link to his raport from the  time Mbiris were competed with Nharhus over River pride. 

"If the Mbiri male [Shaka] was on 2v1 against the Nharhu males he wasn't able live to count it. "

There haven't been any other than Nharhus male lions in the arena by that time. Shaka also had wounds to his hind quaters (as it is stated in Tanda Tulaąs raports)  which is give away for the confrontation one vs two or more. Moreover Shaka isn't neither first or second who survived such  a confrontation. 

Okay... Going through this logic the Nharhu males have beaten the Mbiri male easily. because I didn't see any scar on the three males.

That is how it is with few against one cases. Ok... Going through your logic injures on Mbiri male appeared from nowhere. Absoluse coincidence was that Nharhu males were the only male lions in the arena and absolute coincidence was that both coalitions were compate at that time for same pride and mated with same female.

The five River pride males were still on their natal pride. Those five males were involved more than 1 times on a fight with the Mbiri males.
In April 2019 the Mbiri cornered and mauled to one of them. He survived the attack and later joined with their natal pride once again.
I didn't say that the Nharhu were the only males in the area. but they haven't involved on a fight with the Mbiri males until this year that 2 of the 3 Nharhu chased off the Mbiri males away.
Anyway. Don't worry I've asked to Chad Cocking and Luke Street. Let's see what they say about. Reply

[BA0701]

(10-19-2020, 10:55 PM)Tr1x24 Wrote:

(10-19-2020, 10:50 PM)Gijima Wrote: @Tr1x24 Check out the sunrise episode. The ranger definitely said “Birmingham breakaway” and 7 males (11 lions total). At this point I’m confused about how many Birmingham breakaways there are

I check it. 

Yeah lol, it looks like that every other lion pride in that area they call Birmingham breakeaway hehe.. 
But he said that he didnt see them all together for a long time, so before maybe we seen only part of Birmingham breakeaway.. 

1 male seems to be the oldest, like Injured Birmingham male, then 3 slightly younger and 3 youngest.. Those 3 youngest might be sons of Ross males..

We have seen so many recent happenings in the lion world that couldn't have been predicted. The biggest for me is why the Ross males allowed so many offspring of the former males to remain in the pride. Even if they only killed the young males, allowing the females to remain, would have still made so much more sense to me. It just goes to prove that nature will always remain unpredictable. Reply

[Potato]

"I didn't say that the Nharhu were the only males in the area."

I did.

"The five River pride males were still on their natal pride."

Ok, I should have said " there was no other males in the arena, but Nharhus of age that could be threat to Mbiri male". Do you really consider that those sub adults could injure Mbiri male. Moreover even if they could have then why would they? They were way to young to think of setting their own terriotrry. I am not even sure they were still in the arena, not moved away once River females started mating with Mbiris and Nharhus. 

"Those five males were involved more than 1 times on a fight with the Mbiri males."

One of them was once chassed, cought and mauled by Mbiris. That is all. They were just sub adults.

" but they haven't involved on a fight with the Mbiri males until this year that 2 of the 3 Nharhu chased off the Mbiri males away."

Ok so injurys on Mbiri male must have been caused by around 2-3 years old sub adults of River pride. 

"Anyway. Don't worry I've asked to Chad Cocking and Luke Street. Let's see what they say about."


Omg, men, just read their raports jesus. Reply

[Timbavati]

(10-20-2020, 12:53 AM)Potato Wrote: "I didn't say that the Nharhu were the only males in the area."

I did.

"The five River pride males were still on their natal pride."

Ok, I should have said " there was no other males in the arena, but Nharhus of age that could be threat to Mbiri male". Do you really consider that those sub adults could injure Mbiri male. Moreover even if they could have then why would they? They were way to young to think of setting their own terriotrry. I am not even sure they were still in the arena, not moved away once River females started mating with Mbiris and Nharhus. 

"Those five males were involved more than 1 times on a fight with the Mbiri males."

One of them was once chassed, cought and mauled by Mbiris. That is all. They were just sub adults.

" but they haven't involved on a fight with the Mbiri males until this year that 2 of the 3 Nharhu chased off the Mbiri males away."

Ok so injurys on Mbiri male must have been caused by around 2-3 years old sub adults of River pride. 

"Anyway. Don't worry I've asked to Chad Cocking and Luke Street. Let's see what they say about."


Omg, men, just read their raports jesus.

OK.
When you say that those sub-adults of 2-3 can make nothing to the Mbiri male. That's is very wrong. Those sub-adults male can caught a lot of damage to any dominant male.
An old example with the Avoca male [Mohawk/lamula] vs the Nkuhuma male + the Mangheni male. Those two [Sub-adults males] have beaten the northern Avoca male.
easily those injuries can be caused by those five river pride males.
Btw. I read those  two reports when were uploaded by Tanda Tula. Until now I'm not convinced that the Mbiri male can against 2 Nharhu males. when clearly on 2v2 they loss the fight and were chasing off by  the dominant males for over seven kilometers Reply

[Timbavati]

(10-20-2020, 12:51 AM)BA0701 Wrote:

(10-19-2020, 10:55 PM)Tr1x24 Wrote:

(10-19-2020, 10:50 PM)Gijima Wrote: @Tr1x24 Check out the sunrise episode. The ranger definitely said “Birmingham breakaway” and 7 males (11 lions total). At this point I’m confused about how many Birmingham breakaways there are

I check it. 

Yeah lol, it looks like that every other lion pride in that area they call Birmingham breakeaway hehe.. 
But he said that he didnt see them all together for a long time, so before maybe we seen only part of Birmingham breakeaway.. 

1 male seems to be the oldest, like Injured Birmingham male, then 3 slightly younger and 3 youngest.. Those 3 youngest might be sons of Ross males..

We have seen so many recent happenings in the lion world that couldn't have been predicted. The biggest for me is why the Ross males allowed so many offspring of the former males to remain in the pride. Even if they only killed the young males, allowing the females to remain, would have still made so much more sense to me. It just goes to prove that nature will always remain unpredictable.

That's perhaps is  because they never interacted with the Birmingham breakaway pride.
The Ross males have a reputation for their cranky boys. Especially the dark-maned one [Tyson] Reply

[Tr1x24]

(10-20-2020, 01:21 AM)TinoArmando Wrote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:@Tr1x24 Check out the sunrise episode. The ranger definitely said “Birmingham breakaway” and 7 males (11 lions total). At this point I’m confused about how many Birmingham breakaways there are

I check it. 

Yeah lol, it looks like that every other lion pride in that area they call Birmingham breakeaway hehe.. 
But he said that he didnt see them all together for a long time, so before maybe we seen only part of Birmingham breakeaway.. 

1 male seems to be the oldest, like Injured Birmingham male, then 3 slightly younger and 3 youngest.. Those 3 youngest might be sons of Ross males..

We have seen so many recent happenings in the lion world that couldn't have been predicted. The biggest for me is why the Ross males allowed so many offspring of the former males to remain in the pride. Even if they only killed the young males, allowing the females to remain, would have still made so much more sense to me. It just goes to prove that nature will always remain unpredictable.

That's perhaps is  because they never interacted with the Birmingham breakaway pride.
The Ross males have a reputation for their cranky boys. Especially the dark-maned one [Tyson]

Yes, it seems that Ross males didnt and dont control Birmingham Breakaway Pride, they would certaintly kill those cubs if they where.. 

They tolerated subadults in Birmingham pride because when they came, pride was already abandoned and subadults where 2 yrs old already and all 4 females where in estrus again (similar situation with N. Avocas and Nkuhuma subadults, Bboys offspring).. Reply

[Gijima]

So here is another Birmingham Breakaway:
https://mobile.twitter.com/WildEarth/status/1284887742711726083

As you can see the makeup of this pride is completely different, with young cubs and one male subadult who’s the Birmingham male’s age. This is the pride the Ross Males are dominant over. I don’t think they control the one with 7 males at all. Reply

[Timbavati]

(10-20-2020, 01:42 AM)Gijima Wrote: So here is another Birmingham Breakaway:
https://mobile.twitter.com/WildEarth/status/1284887742711726083

As you can see the makeup of this pride is completely different, with young cubs and one male subadult who’s the Birmingham male’s age. This is the pride the Ross Males are dominant over. I don’t think they control the one with 7 males at all.

This behavior is very common when a pride never interacted before with the male lions in this case the Ross males.
As you can see, the Stompie lioness when saw the Ross males approaching to the pride her has turned very aggressive.
A completely different behavior as the main Birmingham pride who is controlled by the Ross males
Thanks for sharing the link Reply