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ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - THE TIGER (Panthera tigris)

peter Offline
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( This post was last modified: 10-02-2016, 02:37 AM by peter )

ALTAICAN

A new member already scoring points is promising. Hope you keep it up and welcome to the forum.

The follow-up on the alleged giant man-eater was an interesting read. Here's what I saw:

1 - Many regions in India can be considered as prime habitat for both wild animals and humans.
2 - As a result of 1, competition between both has to be expected.
3 - Big cats (tigers and leopards) and humans living in close proximity is not a good idea.
4 - Those involved in protecting tigers often have to choose between two evils.
5 - Indians are doing a great job protecting wildlife. 


INDIA

India really is a beautiful country, attractive for both animals and humans. As the number of humans has increased considerably in the last century in particular, wild country has rapidly disappeared. When tigers were all but gone in the late sixties of the last century, it was decided to save them. In order to get there, laws were introduced and reserves were created. Almost half a century later, one could sat they did an excellent job. Many regions still have extended forests (the percentage has in fact increased over the last years), the number of reserves is impressive and most of them are well-stocked and healthy. The result is India still has tigers.


PROBLEMS

There are three big problems. One is many reserves are smallish. When the number of tigers rises as a result of good conditions, there is just no room to accomodate them. Two is many reserves are isolated, resulting in inbreeding. Corridors are needed, that is. Three is most reserves are surrounded by humans. Millions of them. When things go wrong, chances are there will be conflicts.

Tigers, and males in particular, need a lot of room. When the population grows as a result of good conditions, there will be conflicts between tigers with a territory and young adults trying to establish themselves. Although many seem to think these clashes are not very serious, statistics suggest they are. If we add that statistics about an elusive animal are anything but reliable, the conclusion is the struggle for space most probably has serious consequences for quite many tigers.


MAN-EATERS

Although only few tigers unable to establish themselves turn to cattle or man, cattle-tigers and man-eaters still are not uncommon in India. In this respect, India is different from many other countries that have tigers. The most important reason is India is very densely populated. As a result, tigers and humans often live in close proximity. 

In Russia, Amur tigers face tougher conditions. Crop failures, long and severe winters with deep snow, limited numbers of large prey animals and competition from both hunters and other predators not seldom result in famines and disabilities. Although not a few tigers are severely affected, the number of conflicts between tigers and humans is limited. One reason is Russia has a lot of wild country. Two is the number of people in eastern Russia is limited. I'm not saying it will happen, but Russia has enough room to accomodate a few thousand Amur tigers.        

The only long-term solution for India, assuming they would be willing to accept a few thousand tigers, is to create similar conditions. At the moment, the Himalayas (from the Terai Arc all the way to the northeastern part of Assam) probably offer the best chance. Southwestern India also is suited. The eastern part of central India could also qualify. The problem is no corridors needed to prevent inbreeding. Based on the situation today, chances are different subpopulations will develop in the near future.        

SIZE

One has to remember a few things when size is discussed:

a - An adult male big cat in good health of 200 kg. (442 pounds), no matter what they tell you, is a very large animal.

b - Captive big cats don't face tough conditions, like severe cold (Russia), famines (Russia), habitat destruction (Sumatra) and pressure from humans hunters and other predators (India, Russia and Sumatra). They also don't need to hunt and to compete. As a result, many are able to get to their potential.

This general observation is more true for lions than for tigers. Much more so, I would say. The reason is lions are social animals allowing for specialisation, whereas tigers are not. A tiger first has to learn how to survive on its own. When established, he or she needs many more years to develop the skills needed to hunt large animals and to deal with large competitors, like other tigers and bears. This is why young adults do not compare to mature and old animals. Those who manage to get to maturity, are the ones who feature in documentaries. We don't see the others, because most of them just don't make it. As this is not the case in captive animals, they, apart from Amur tigers, often are a bit smaller than wild tigers.

In India, adult male Indian tigers average 400-410 pounds (181,44-185,98 kg.) in captivity. Wild male Indian tigers today, most probably (there are no reliable data), average over 440 pounds (199,58 kg.). My guess would close to 460 (208,66 kg.), but chances are there are significant regional differences. Himalayan tigers could be the largest and heaviest wild big cats today, but I'm not sure about the Russians for lack of reliable data (the only sample available was small and had both young adults as well as 'problem' tigers).

In lions, it seems (watch that word) to be different. Most captive African lions compare to captive Indian tigers (400-410 pounds or 181,44-185,98 kg.). Captive male Amur tigers in European zoos could average 460-470 pounds (208,66-213,19 kg.). I didn't see a lot of difference between captive Indian and African lions. Those from South Africa could be a tad larger, but one has to remember quite many descend from Timbavati lions. Lions from that region produce white lions every now and then. White lions are larger than normal coloured lions. Even normal coloured Timbavati lions often are a bit larger than lions from other parts of Africa. I'm not saying captive lions dwarf their wild relatives, but they do seem a bit more robust and more often exceed, say, 430 pounds (195,05 kg.).

Amur tigers compare to lions in that captive born animals are often a bit larger than their wild relatives. Could, at least partly, be a result of the population bottleneck in the early part of the last century (smaller individuals stood a better chance to escape the attention of hunters). As it also is a fact that all captive Amur tigers descended from them, their larger size most probably is a result of better conditions. This means conditions in Russia, although improving, are not yet optimal. Wild male Amur tigers (averaging 430 pounds according to Miquelle, 420 if we follow the table posted by Guate and about 390 if we use the WCS-table, which had both young adults and 'problem' animals) more or less compare to wild male Kruger lions (400 pounds in the southern part of the park an close to 440 in the northern part - this because many lions in the southern part were affected by a disease). In head and body length, the difference is very limited as well. As Amur tigers have slightly longer tails, they most probably have a few inches on Kruger lions in total length.                

c - Tigers in northern India and, especially, Nepal could be the longest and heaviest big cats today. As the information on size of tigers today is both limited and not always, if not seldom, reliable, we have no option but to use the old samples collected by big game hunters again. A century ago, adult wild males averaged 8.7 in total length (measured 'between pegs') in Nagaland (average of two males 340-350 pounds (154,22-158,76 kg.), 9.0 in southeastern India and the Deccan (average of 11 males 402 pounds or 182,35 kg.), 9.3 in the Central Provinces (average 420 pounds or 190,51 kg.) and Cooch Behar and Assam (average 461 pounds or 209,11 kg.), 9.5 or a little over in northern India (the average of the male tigers shot by Sir J. Hewett was 435-440 pounds, but he couldn't weigh many large animals because the machine he had made in Calcutta broke down time and again - my estimate was closer to 470 pounds or 213,19 kg.) and 9.6-9.8 in Nepal (average of 7 males weighed in Royal Chitwan 488 pounds adjusted (221,36 kg.) and 520 pounds unadjusted (235,87 kg.) according to Sunquist, who was there, and 400 according to Kitchener and Yamaguchi, who were not, but assumed every male had swallowed a complete cow before he was captured in spite of that). Based on what I have, I got to 475-490 pounds (215,46-222,26 kg.) for northern India and Nepal, with Nepal closer to the upper limit.

As a result of the problem mentioned above, I'm unable to get to an average of tigers today. If we use a few reliable reports, however, tigers seem to be a bit (5-8%) heavier. The most probable reasons are well-stocked reserves, protection and severe competition. If an adult male averaged, say, 9.3 and 420 pounds (190,51 kg.) a century ago, I propose to use 9.3 (281,94 cm.) and 440-460 (199,58-208,66 kg.) for today. This is without Sunderban tigers.

The upper limit is a bit of a mystery, but more than one forest officer reported about individuals well exceeding 600 pounds over a century ago. One of these, estimated at 700 pounds or better, was described as a perfect mountain of fat (see below - k2 and k3). Non-obese males only very seldom exceed 550 pounds (249,48 kg.), but there is no question some did. If tigers today really are a bit heavier, 600 pounds (272,16 kg.) empty can't be excluded. At least two researchers reported about a male exceeding a 600-pound scale in the last decades of the previous century. This in a region (Nepal) that had well below 200 tigers in the days these two were captured and weighed. At least one of them had a collar when he was captured, meaning there was no need to bait him.

What I'm saying is tigers in northern India are large animals, with males often exceeding 200 kg. (442 pounds). Even those unable to compete as a result of a disability, a disease or a lack of size often exceed 400 pounds (181,44 kg.). If you, however, read a report about a tiger of 300 kg. (662 pounds), I propose to read it again and contact a few people. 


WILD TIGERS EXCEEDING 550 POUNDS
 
Although rare even in northern India and Nepal, male tigers reaching or exceeding 9.8 in total length ('between pegs') and 550 pounds have been recorded so often, that many think they are quite common. Not so. Each of the tigers below was exceptional.

a - Ajanti, India.

This male, fully loaded as you can see, at 10.1 'between pegs', was estimated at 600 pounds. Even if we deduct the cow he had eaten, he most probably was close to 550 pounds empty. It was a very robust male who had killed and eaten more than one villager:   


*This image is copyright of its original author


b - Northeastern India, close to the Bhutan border. The longest Bengt Berg shot in the twenties and thirties of the last century was 9.7 'between pegs' (292,10 cm.) and 565 pounds (256,28 kg.). Many posters who saw the photograph below thought the tiger was not as large as a decent modern Assam tiger, but Bengt Berg had a lot of experience and he was convinced this tiger was by far the biggest he had seen. He had to be well over 565 pounds, that is. He didn't go for an estimate, but Berg was so impressed that he decided to let him go. Instead of shooting the tiger, he took a few photographs. Meet 'The Killer of Men' from Bhutan:


*This image is copyright of its original author


c - Northern India. The male below, also known as 'The Bachelor of Powalgarh', was much sought after by many experienced hunters. All of them failed, but Jim Corbett, convinced he might become dangerous, didn't. Measured three times after he was shot, the Bachelor was 10.7 'over curves', or just over 10 feet straight in total length. He didn't say anything about the weight, but there's little doubt a robust tiger of this size exceeded 550 pounds:  


*This image is copyright of its original author


d - Northern India. This photograph was posted by Rofl about a year ago. Reliable observers all think Himalayan tigers are larger than anywhere else. Although weights are very difficult to assess from photographs, I'm quite sure this male, very large in all respects, is close to the mark mentioned above, meaby even well over:


*This image is copyright of its original author


e - Nepal. Royal Chitwan, to be precise. Prem, a tiger expert, shows the skull of the Sauraha male tiger, who accidentally drowned just after he was darted. A freak accident in which a freak tiger was involved. The Sauraha tiger is one of two Nepal tigers who exceeded a 600-pound scale. Sunquist, after a lot of calculations and deductions, concluded 261 kg. would be close to the mark, but it is a fact the Sauraha tiger had a collar when he was darted the last time. There was no need to bait him, that is. So why was he adjusted? Perhaps Sunquist was thinking of Kitchener and Yamaguchi when he decided to buy a book on wild big cats and deductions? 

Anyhow. It had no effect, as they were not impressed and decided to write a new one. Using it many years after the Sauraha tiger was weighed, they proudly presented 218 kg. as the most probable weight. This monster deduction (from > 272,16 kg. to 218 kg. = at least 55 kg. or 122 pounds) was followed by a number of firm remarks on the alleged weight of some tigers shot in the past. 

Apart from the fact they openly doubted not just a beginner, but a peer loaded with experience and quite a reputation (Sunquist), there's a bit more to say about their new, albeit secret, book on deductions and the consequences of what seems to be very close to something Steven-Hamilton considered as 'misinforming the public'.

One is the Sauraha tiger bottomed a 600-pound scale, not one of 450 pounds. He was over 272,16 kg. when he was weighed, that is. Not 218 kg. Two is they could and should have known about the difference between gorged tigers and other tigers of similar size, as the Maharajah of Cooch Behar was clear in his book: the difference was a bit over 60 pounds (27,22 kg.), and not a bit over 120 pounds (54,43 pounds). Three is we don't know if the Sauraha tiger was loaded or empty. We do know he had a collar when he was darted, meaning there was no need to bait him.

Four is I saw hundreds of lions and tigers myself. Although I weighed and measured 20 captive animals only, it was enough to get an idea about the correlation between length and weight. It also enabled me to learn a bit about optical illusions (referring to the effect of black vertical stripes in tigers and the mane and the upright position of many male lions). The heaviest I weighed (a male Amur tiger) was 9.5 (287,02 cm.) in total length straight and 211 kg. (466 pounds). Apart from that, I saw four adult male lions and tigers who had been weighed in a facility just days before I visited the place. I also saw all tables. A male Amur tiger, a direct descendant of a wild male, was 203 kg. (448 pounds); a white male tiger was 249 kg. (550 pounds); one of the two Timbavati male lions was 230 kg. (508 pounds), and his white brother was 273 kg. (603 pounds). All four were far from obese. I watched them for a long time. Same for the photograph of the Sauraha tiger below. The conclusion was the Sauraha tiger and the monster white Timbavati lion could have been close. The Sauraha tiger seemed a bit longer, but the Timbavati male definitely compared for robustness. I could be wrong, but if the Sauraha tiger really was 218 kg. (482 pounds), even a visit to an eye-doctor would be pointless. 
             
Sunquist also was targeted by posters not that long ago. The reason was they wanted to know a bit more about the method used to measure Chitwan tigers. I agree his description of the method used was a bit, ehh, slippery, but his peers also struggled, not to say one of them turned the world upside down.

I wasn't surprised, because the method used by biologists today (many measure big cats 'over curves') was considered unreliable a century ago. It still is. I tried it myself more than once and couldn't make head or tails of it. If different people measure a big cat in this way ('over curves'), the outcome of the attempts, without moving the animal, often is close to unpredictable, whereas straight line measurements time and again yielded very similar results. I wouldn't say the differences between different attempts, as Dunbar Brander suggested, were within a quarter of an inch, but it was less than an inch. The reason is the method is easier to apply: you place a marker at the point of the nose, another one at the insertion of the tail and the last one at the end of the last bone of the tail; you then remove the animals and measure the distance in a straight line with a steel tape. 

I'm not saying easy does it, but it is much easier than running the tape over the skull, neck, shoulders, depressions and other ungulations of the spine and making sure the tape touches the body at all places, as that is asking for trouble. Furthermore, it takes a lot of time as well as different people assisting. All present also need to pay attention all the time.   
  
Anyhow. This is Prem with the skull of the Sauraha tiger. Tiger skulls of that size are not seen in natural history museums. I know, because I visited more than one and measured close to 400 big cat skulls. Tiger skulls of that size are in private collections. The second photograph is from 'Tiger Moon' (written by the Sunquists). It shows the Sauraha tiger lying next to a number of people: 


*This image is copyright of its original author



*This image is copyright of its original author


f - Central India. No info on this one, but the hunter who shot him, although positioned up front, is dwarfed by the tiger. Could have been a shortish man, but the head of the tiger is mighty impressive anyhow. Also have a look at the shoulder. There's no question that he was a very robust animal:


*This image is copyright of its original author


g - Meet Madla (top) and his opponent Hairyfoot (bottom) from Panna, central India. Hairyfoot didn't feature in the documentary that impressed many, but Madla did. He allegedly was 250 kg. (just over 550 pounds), but the one who had seen both said Hairyfoot could have been a bit larger: 


*This image is copyright of its original author



*This image is copyright of its original author


h - Northern India. This male, a man-eater, was shot in 1937. At nearly 600 pounds, he was as big as they come:  


*This image is copyright of its original author


i - Southern India before 1910 (the book was published in 1910). Two men employed by H. Wiele, who walked the extended forests in that part of India for weeks without seeing a soul. Watch the size of the rifle:


*This image is copyright of its original author


j - Same rifle and big tiger. Wiele didn't say anything about his size, but he was impressed. Those who knew him said he was well over 20 when he was shot. The Luckvalley tiger was real big, but not big enough to displace the big wild boar who had taken his gaur. The boar must have been an immense animal. Over a century ago, India still produced giants of all kinds: 


*This image is copyright of its original author


k - Three scans from the book of Capt. J. Forsyth, published in 1889. He roamed the forests of central India for many years. In that part of India, big cats were measured 'between pegs'. One of the tigers he shot was 10.1 in total length straight. Forsyth wrote he must have touched 700 pounds. At least. As he really knew about the size of tigers, we have to take him very seriously. The tiger, however, was a mountain of fat.  

Those who hunted in the Central Provinces well over a century ago (1800-1870 or so), and forest officers in particular, agreed a male tiger in that part of India was 9.4-9.6 in total length straight and 450-500 pounds in those says. Half a century later, Dunbar Brander got to 9.3 and 420 pounds.

One could say the old boys didn't know how to measure a tiger. One could also say Dunbar Brander was an accurate observer. My guess is the loss of size was a result of overhunting in a period wild country was quickly disappearing. If we use data from Nepal collected half a century later (male tigers lost about 4 inches in total length in a period of about a decade only), the conclusion is it is more than likely that hunting had an effect on the average size of tigers in the Central Provinces. Hewett, regarding Nepal, agreed. Here's the title page and the two pages about the 10.1 tiger:       


*This image is copyright of its original author



*This image is copyright of its original author



*This image is copyright of its original author


l - Central Provinces. I can't get to the details of this tiger right now, but it was a very large and robust male with quite a reputation:


*This image is copyright of its original author



m - Southwestern India. As a result of his size, Old One Eye was known all over India. Many had a go at him, but he was able to outwit them for a long time. Then this American Army officer had a try. He succeeded. The tiger was 11.0 'over curves' and estimated at 700 pounds. Judging from the circumference of his belly, the tiger hadn't been shot after running a marathon. As he was not only estimated but baited as well, I propose to deduct 100 pounds right away. But tigers of that length have been shot in that period and he also was robust. Definitely over 550 pounds empty:


*This image is copyright of its original author


n - Northeastern India. This male featured in a shortish documentary. I saw it and also saw the pictures more than once. I was amazed. If Ngorogoro lions top the list of Africa for robustness, Kazirangha tigers do so in India. They also have large and very wide skulls:  


*This image is copyright of its original author



*This image is copyright of its original author



*This image is copyright of its original author


o - If Kazirangha tigers are hulks, Himalayan tigers are athletes. Big athletes, though. A century ago, male Himalayan tigers had 2-4 inches on them (total length, measured 'over curves'). They also were 10-30 pounds heavier than male tigers from Cooch Behar and Assam. The Assam tigers averaged 461 pounds. The photographs and documentaries I saw suggest nothing has changed in the last century. In India, length and weight are strongly correlated.

This photograph was posted before, but it's one that illustrates what I mean best. Rajaji National Park, northern India:


*This image is copyright of its original author


His pugmarks:


*This image is copyright of its original author


p - Northeastern India (Assam), 1954. This tiger also was well over 500 pounds:


*This image is copyright of its original author


q - To finish the post, two photographs of male Indian tigers exceeding 200 kg. close to a human. This to illustrate that a tiger (or a lion) of that weight is a very large animal. I'm not sure about the first one (I do know he was killed in a fight), but the second one is a captive male tiger from Dreamworld (Australia). In his prime, he was 440-445 pounds:


*This image is copyright of its original author



*This image is copyright of its original author
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Messages In This Thread
RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - peter - 09-23-2016, 02:36 AM
Demythologizing T16 - tigerluver - 04-12-2020, 11:44 AM
Tiger Data Bank - Apollo - 07-28-2014, 09:54 PM
RE: Tiger Data Bank - Apollo - 07-28-2014, 10:02 PM
RE: Tiger Data Bank - Apollo - 07-29-2014, 12:56 AM
RE: Tiger Data Bank - peter - 07-29-2014, 07:05 AM
Tiger recycling bin - Roflcopters - 09-04-2014, 01:36 AM
RE: Tiger recycling bin - Pckts - 09-04-2014, 02:22 AM
RE: Tiger recycling bin - Roflcopters - 09-05-2014, 01:01 AM
RE: Tiger Data Bank - Apollo - 11-15-2014, 10:07 PM
RE: Tiger Data Bank - Apollo - 11-15-2014, 10:57 PM
RE: Tiger Data Bank - Apollo - 11-15-2014, 11:33 PM
RE: Tiger Data Bank - Apollo - 02-19-2015, 11:25 PM
RE: Tiger Data Bank - GuateGojira - 02-23-2015, 11:36 AM
Status of tigers in India - Shardul - 12-20-2015, 03:23 PM
RE: Tiger Directory - Diamir2 - 10-03-2016, 04:27 AM
RE: Tiger Directory - peter - 10-03-2016, 06:22 AM
Genetics of all tiger subspecies - parvez - 07-15-2017, 01:08 PM
RE: Tiger Predation - peter - 11-11-2017, 08:08 AM
RE: Man-eaters - Wolverine - 12-03-2017, 11:30 AM
RE: Man-eaters - peter - 12-04-2017, 09:44 AM
RE: Tigers of Central India - Wolverine - 04-13-2018, 01:17 AM
RE: Tigers of Central India - qstxyz - 04-13-2018, 08:34 PM
RE: Size comparisons - peter - 07-16-2019, 05:28 AM
RE: Amur Tigers - peter - 05-20-2021, 07:13 AM
RE: Amur Tigers - Nyers - 05-21-2021, 08:02 PM
RE: Amur Tigers - peter - 05-22-2021, 08:09 AM
RE: Amur Tigers - GuateGojira - 04-06-2022, 12:59 AM
RE: Amur Tigers - tigerluver - 04-06-2022, 01:08 AM
RE: Amur Tigers - tigerluver - 04-06-2022, 09:08 AM
RE: Amur Tigers - tigerluver - 04-06-2022, 11:30 PM
RE: Amur Tigers - peter - 04-08-2022, 07:27 AM



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