Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars

[chui_]

(12-24-2019, 06:28 AM)Pckts Wrote: First off, what do you think "empty" means?
Do you think he's talking about at maximum or a cat at least that size with no additional weight added from food, which of course would make it heavier than the 130kg estimate?
This of course is why you partially quoted him leaving out the "empty" part.

I don’t get your point.

Of course his estimate for that jaguar’s weight would be with empty stomach. Why would you estimate the weight of an animal including stomach content?

Stomach content is relevant for actual recorded weights because a scale doesn’t know how much of the weight it is registering is just meat in the belly of the animal. So we need to consider stomach content in that context not with estimates.

Quote:Now in regards to larger Jaguars, Almeida quotes the at least 130kg Jaguar, Rafeal's 148kg jaguar, 120kg Jaguar and another being larger than 119kg empty Jaguar. Not to mention skulls scoring more than 21"

Again what’s your point? That there are jaguars bigger than the ones Almeida himself recorded? Of course there are, I never said there aren’t.

From Almeida’s own firsthand experience with 46 adult male Pantanal jaguars, only one was estimated at about 130kg. The point is Almeida’s own data provides us with a very reliable concise homogeneous sample which allows us to make some extrapolations. Him making reference to other big jaguars he’s heard of is besides the point.

Quote:The empty 315lb Jaguar again is far closer to empty than otherwise and unless you dissect it than how can you know for sure? The facts certainly suggest it being closer to empty than full, right?

Being closer to empty than full is not empty. That should be straightforward.

Quote:In regards to the 40 individuals quoted by you to be from the "northern pantanal" I dont recall that and I know that he hunted all over the pantanal- from Brazil to Bolivia so I'll confirm that as well.

It’s been a while since I’ve read through his books in detail but I recall reading that he hunted mostly in the northern Pantanal. Maybe you can check that.

Quote:So I suggest you leave your pompous attitude at the door, your preconceived notions on Jaguar size have been shown to be dated, you dont even acknowledge the fact that Jaguars now a days have significantly surpassed Almeidas Jaguars. Why is that, I'm curious?

I find it hard to believe these jaguars have increased in size by 30% (from 100 to 130kg) over the last few decades. The Pantanal jaguars have always enjoyed abundant prey, both natural prey and plenty of easy to kill cattle (much bigger than any natural prey!) so this sudden increase in size seems a bit far fetched.  You guys have posted a few weights and estimates from social media of some big males and are making conclusions, I’ll be convinced when I see properly published data (preferably with some info on stomach content).

6 males captured in the southern Pantanal between 2003 and 2004 averaged 99.7kg, very similar to Almeida's figure.

From the 2006 paper:"Spatial organization and food habits of jaguars (Panthera onca) in a floodplain forest" 

*This image is copyright of its original author

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