Bears of the Pleistocene

[peter]

brotherbear\ dateline='\'1418466976' Wrote: It appears to me that there were both tigers and brown bears in China during the Pleistocene where the brown bears are thought to have originated. Could it be that the tiger and the brown bear are ancient enemies from the beginning ?  

It's speculation all the way, but if what I saw in captive animals is typical for bears and tigers in Russia I would say yes. Many trainers would agree, I think. There's much more animosity between these two than between tigers and other big cats.   

John Vaillant wrote a great book about a male Amur tiger who got into trouble with a hunter. The hunter took the animal he had killed and shot the owner, who was wounded. This made it personal. The tiger responded by starting a psychological war. The hunter was affected. When he, mentally, was nearly done for (noticed by many), the tiger went to his house. The hunter must have seen him, as he wasn't to be missed. Nobody knows why he came out of his cabin, but he did. The tiger attacked, killed and ate him completely. The book is about the incident, the story behind it and the hunt. This happened in the nineties of the last century.

Vaillant talked to locals and those who hunted the tiger after he had killed and eaten a second man. Adult male Amur tigers are quite something, Vaillant concluded. True survivors. They will yield to a larger force, but anything within reach will have to answer for actions directed against the tiger sooner or later. The things he wrote about tigers and bears, in my opinion, underline the animosity many noticed between both animals. As Kerley said, you never know in tigers and bears. Anything is possible.

Vaillant's book is a real good one and I read many. I asked Miquelle about it. He agreed: a great book. It's in every internet bookstore and shipping costs are limited. Good books on animals and humans usually don't come cheap. This one is. My advice is to buy it when you can.

You may not like what you read on bears and tigers, but Vailliant only talked to those 'in the know'. An adult wild male Amur tiger will not confront a large bear, but anything within his reach is vulnarable. As 'large' in bears always is subject to season and shape, it isn't easy to get into details. Same for tigers, by the way. Those who hunted the tiger said he was big. They thought he must have been close to 500 pounds after a large meal, but he was nearly starved when they finally got to him. It was a very close call even then.

A male bear of 700 pounds and over definitely is out of reach, but when he is a professional extortioner who targets one male tiger in particular, chances are the tiger will remember and act when the time has arrived. When that happens, anything is possible. I know male bears do not hunt male bears, but who said anything on hunting? My guess is they meet and talk every now and then. These 'meetings' no doubt often end in dispersal, but often isn't always. Based on what I saw myself in a rescue centre and a zoo, I think an adult tiger wouldn't be bothered by a difference in size when emotions have grown to 700 pounds.

I don't think a tiger would go for the kill. My guess is he would try to make his point clear. At times at his peril and at times not. Corbett described what he heard when a professional extortioner and a big male tiger met in Kumaon. They fought for a few minutes and the engagement ended with the tiger running, closely followed by the bear, who had murder in his mind. Corbett couldn't get to the tiger, but he shot the bear. It was the fattest he had ever seen and he must have seen many in Kumaon. The bear was scalped to the bone and his nose was all but gone. It wouldn't have mattered to an animal like a bear, but the tiger did it anyhow. Then he left. When Corbett was examining the bear, he saw the tiger, to his amazement, returning to his cow.

So what really happened over there? Did the bear win the fight? Or, as Corbett thought, the tiger? I think both scored a point. The bear said he would take it all at all costs, even if his opponent was a large male tiger. The tiger said not after this. Than he ran, only to return when the bear was killed. Meaning he saw what had happened. Also meaning he wasn't prepared to go all the way. Why would he, in Kumaon? But in Russia, conditions are different. I definitely believe the reports on male tigers not hunting male bears, but I do not buy the opinion of authorities on bears winning on points or the mutual avoidance assumption. If tigers would allow for professional extortionists all the time, they would face big problems in a region with few large prey animals.  

Are large bears really immune, as many think? Are they really not bothered by injuries? If so, why is there, apart from a few incidents, no proof of male tigers consistently displaced by male bears then in nearly a quarter of a century of research? I do not doubt it happens every now and then, but why is it the brown bears I saw (large males and I mean large) where visibly very nervous when they were threatened by captive Amur tigers? The tigers couldn't see the bear, but they knew he was there. The bear was about 50 yards away, maybe a bit more. The tigers were standing on their hind legs staring at his cage wagon. They never roared, but I sensed the sounds they produced. I had never heard those sounds before and I know a bit about tigers. I was standing right between them and I could have sweared I felt something going from the tigers to the bear. It was crowded when it happened, with television crew close by (no joke), but nobody saw anything. Nobody apart from the cage hand. He was afraid and didn't want to talk. So was the bear, as his droppings showed.

I do not doubt Ursus arctos lasiotus, used to tigers, is a fierce animal, more dangerous than an average tiger. Bears are much feared over there. I do not doubt they are able to compete with tigers and I do not doubt they win fights every now and then. But I would never make a bet and I never saw something similar for animosity. And that's all there is to say about it. Reply