Maximum size of prey that a single male lion or tiger can kill

[Pckts]

(03-17-2020, 12:44 AM)peter Wrote:

(03-16-2020, 11:33 PM)Pckts Wrote:

(03-16-2020, 11:30 PM)GuateGojira Wrote:

(03-16-2020, 10:55 PM)Pckts Wrote: I'm probably more strict on my stance than most others here but as I've said before, I don't believe either a Tiger or Lion has a very good chance of taking down a Large, Alpha Cape or Gaur Bull unless some unusual circumstance is in play. 
But everyone should remember that these animals come in many different sizes and shapes, taking down a Bull isn't the same as taking down a big, alpha one.

In fact, if you check the document of Dr Karanth and Dr Sunquist of 1995 "Prey selection by tiger, leopard and dhole in tropical forest", in table 5, you can see that the percentage of adult male gaurs hunted by tigers is of 14.6, which is the third one after young adults and adult females. The average weight of the gaur killed by tigers in Nagarahole is 287 kg, biased toward young specimens, but this sample includes several males of 1,000 kg.

So yes, tiger can and do kill big alpha adult male gaurs in several ocations, interestingly those are in face to face combats and most of them are in open areas, where the tiger have the advantage of the speed and space.

*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

The weights claimed are estimates and Gaur predation wasn't witnessed, only scat and carcasses observed.
I'm well aware that Tigers hunt Gaur, they do so often but a Big Bull Gaur is in a different league than just a standard Bull Gaur. 
And a 1000kg Bull would be a totally different monster IMO.

During the last 13 months, I've been reorganising everything I have. The reorganisation is needed, as I want to find what I need in minutes, not weeks or months. Or not at all. 

Did I find good information on tigers and gaurs when working? Most certainly. There are many letters in the Journal of the Bombay Natural History about tigers and gaurs. One of the last I saw was written by a man who was very involved in hunting and good information in his day: R.C. Morris (from the Honametti estate in southern India). He often reported about unusual incidents and produced the evidence needed.

Example. In a letter of January 3, 1935, he wrote about three bull gaurs killed by tigers in six months. All 3 were " ... fine solitary bull bison ... " and all carried " ... good and old heads ... ". In the 20 previous years, however, he knew of 4 bulls killed by tigers only. 

In another letter, he disagreed with a very experienced hunter who wrote tigers are no match for a large bull gaur. That statement also attracted the attention of others. One of them was a man who visited the scene of a battle that had resulted in the death of a bull gaur and a tigress. 

Based on everything else I have, I'd say incidents of this nature are rare, but not as uncommon as many seem to think. Large bulls no doubt are formidable opponents. Tigers not seldom perish in fights, but there's no question bulls have been killed by tigers in lengthy fights. 

To finish the post, one more letter of R.C. Morris:

" ... Mr. W.S. Thom is mistaken in thinking that a tiger is no match for a full-grown bull buffalo. I have known at least six cases of solitary bulls having been killed by a tiger; about as many instances of unsuccessful attacks, including that of an old bull which had been severely mauled on its head, neck and shoulders and the near hind leg bitten through, the bone being completely severed. How this bull had managed to shake off the tiger after such a terrific mauling is difficult to imagine ... " (R.C. Morris in a letter from July 12, 1935).

Finding a carcass and witnessing an attack are different things.
I'm not saying he's wrong but there is a definite grey area missing between the two.
I'd have to read his books where he makes such claims and who actually told him of these alleged accounts.
Hunters can sometimes make assumptions that tend to be missing some facts.

Let's look at from a different perspective.

Today we have more eye witness accounts than ever before and still these accounts of Bull Capes or Gaur being preyed upon by a lone Lion and Tiger are slim to non existent. We also have 0 video evidence of it being accomplished.
I'm in no way saying it can't happen, I've seen firsthand how hard it is to see a kill in the jungles, all you can do is smell them most of the time and assume what the Mahout tells you is fact since the Elephant can go in many places the Gypsie cannot.
I truly believe that when one of these "Kills" happen, it's probably due to some unexpected luck and most likely hamstringing at that. Reply