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Asiatic Lion Reintroduction Project
Asiatic Lion Reintroduction Project
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Asiatic Lion Reintroduction Project
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~~History shows before they were slaughtered to near extinction, they thrived in that environ. Genetics are irrelevant. " Go on, lets see this PROOF.
Cut the BS Pockets. Thats common knowledge to any and all familiar with big cats. They were widespread through Europe and Asia. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asiatic_lion ~~Tigerluver and Gaute both showed great info on the true DNA of a "Asiatic Lion" and gaute specifically approved of Valmik and Packers ideas. Which of course, back what I am saying. Dna is completely irrelevant in this. As usual, you're lost and all over the place, clueless. You have a dubious theory at best, which is easily disputed with common sense. Stop wasting my time.  
I am not exactly sure what you two keep arguing about.
Is it whether or not Panthera leo persica is native to India? Earlier in this thread I said that species origination is not necessarily the same as species nativity. There is naturally occurring migration. It could be argued that jaguars are not native to South America being that the ancestors of modern jaguars came down from North America to their current range. Previous to that, their ancestors crossed the Bering land bridge which connected Asia to North America. Or, are you guys arguing the success of the asiatic lion as a subspecies? If you look at their historical range compared to what it is now, you certainly wouldn't be wrong to say that they are not doing so great. However, based on the recent growth of the population and its expansion to areas outside of the Gir Sanctuary, the subspecies would be considered to be doing very well... for the time being that is... despite the genetic bottleneck. Is there a disagreement as to whether or not there is enough genetic dissimilarity between the Asian population and their cousins in Africa to constitute their status as a subspecies? Or is it that you are just arguing??? (12-12-2014, 05:16 AM)'Siegfried' Wrote: I am not exactly sure what you two keep arguing about. ~~Is it whether or not Panthera leo persica is native to India? No. Its the claim he made that lions didn't adapt as well to the Indian terrain as did tigers. Overhunting and inbreeding are the main culprits in the status of todays Indian lion. See post #8 and subsequent posts to bring into focus 
Although there is doubt about if the lions were native from India, we can't doubt that lions found they best place in Gir. This area never had tigers, it is very dry and had a good prey base until the arise of men. However, is also interesting that there is not a single lion fossil in Gir, just a few "Panthera sp." which are no larger than a large leopard.
Lions in Gir, despite they low large-prey base and high inbreed, is practically thriving at 2014, there are simple too many lions!!! The new mentality of the Government in Gujarat have created an excellent place for lions, they actually protect them and althoug it is not perfect, it have showed good results. When the first studies with radiocollared lions in India began, they showed that almost half of they diet was based in feral cattle and domestic buffalo. Now, with good programs, the wild prey base is high and lions now mostly eat wild animals, not cattle. Under these circumstances, lions in Gir are perfectly adapted and like some alien species (if they are), they are now capable of create a sustained population with an stable level, in the absence of natural competitors. The only problem here is the low genetic variation and the possibility of a epidemic that can kill the entire population.  (12-09-2014, 11:07 PM)'Pckts' Wrote:(12-09-2014, 07:50 PM)'Amnon242' Wrote:Quote:Thats cute coming from you two. Oh My God. (12-12-2014, 05:16 AM)'Siegfried' Wrote: Or, are you guys arguing the success of the asiatic lion as a subspecies? If you look at their historical range compared to what it is now, you certainly wouldn't be wrong to say that they are not doing so great. Yes, the success of asiatic lions is the issue. Well, asiatic lions are exinct in almost all asia, but this was caused by men. Tigers are also not doing so great...the guilt lies on men again...
And once again, Never said they are not adapted to gir.
They are not as adapted. They are smaller, smaller manes, smaller prides. They are purely a weaker version of their relatives in Africa. Since of course, they are the same sub species. While sharing the same prey base as tigers, they still don't reach their prime specifications while Tigers, whether living in Ranthabhore(very similiar prey base to Gir) or Kahna, Tigers are usually still able to reach their maximum sizes. Kaziranga may have the largest tigers, but until we see measurements, we won't know for sure. (12-12-2014, 03:40 PM)'Amnon242' Wrote:(12-11-2014, 10:06 PM)'chaos' Wrote: ...As usual, you're lost and all over the place, clueless. You have a dubious theory at best, which is easily disputed with common sense. Stop wasting my time. Let me know when you two use common sense. That will be a glorious day.
Seems your view on this topic has little to no support and I'm being kind. "Little" already left town.
While there is some disagreement regarding the number of African subspecies of lion there are, Panthera leo persica is generally accepted as a definite distinct subspecies.
In fact, Asiatic and African lions are so genetically different that this occurred. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4101049.stm
Tigers on the other hand, seem to be able to breed between subspecies without the same type of resulting health problems. Perhaps this indicates LESS genetic differences between the subspeciation of Panthera tigris than there are between Asiatic and African lion populations.
A caveat I find with the alleged weak hybrids of P.l. persica and the African lion is that as the Asiatic is genetically identical to the Barbary lions, why have alleged Barbary hybrids not shown problems?
No more arguing and attacking personalities, please. Only debate ideas respectfully. I'll delete any future posts that deviate toward posters. 
I don't know about Sanjay, Guate and Apollo, but I think I know the answer to the last sentence in your post, Tigerluver. You have my permission to delete anything deviating towards posters right away and don't omit anything posted in the recent past.
To debate is to respect first and foremost. No respect is no debate is no post. |
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