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Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Printable Version

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RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Dark Jaguar - 06-14-2020

(06-14-2020, 01:24 AM)OncaAtrox Wrote: I've said it before not to sleep on the Bolivian Chaco jaguars! Let's not forget Panthera claimed one jaguar from the San Miguelito area weighed 130 kg, and when I asked the about the weight of Aries male who was poached this is what they told me:


*This image is copyright of its original author


Aries was huge!


*This image is copyright of its original author

*This image is copyright of its original author

Amazing, theres a male jaguar from Aurora you regularly post that is very robust I am sure he is around 120kg as well. I don't remember where you last posted him otherwise I would show you now but in case I see him again I will let you know.


RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Dark Jaguar - 06-14-2020

(06-14-2020, 01:44 AM)OncaAtrox Wrote: @Dark Jaguar you probably mean Tote or Caricare

Tote:


*This image is copyright of its original author


Caricare:


*This image is copyright of its original author


One last one I posted a while ago who I also think is quite big is Pajarote:


*This image is copyright of its original author

No its neither of those, its one that the picture is during the day, you can see his body in details.


Anyways There's good news coming, new captures made by Reprocon in Pantanal and IOP team as well as Richard Rasmussen were guests and accompanied the captures.

As far as I know it was a male and a female captured


Female












Male (skip to -10 sec)








No weight statements from them ( as usual ) but I am sure Richard will post it on his channel just like he did with Richard cerrado male and his visits in IOP Sanctuary. So my hopes are all on Richard now to know these Pantanal jaguars captured by Reprocon.


and speaking of Richard check out his new video about an aggressive captive jaguar from brazilian zoo they weighed him, compare the jaguar with domestic cat and much more. check it out.







RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Dark Jaguar - 06-14-2020

(06-14-2020, 03:31 AM)OncaAtrox Wrote:
(06-14-2020, 02:50 AM)Dark Jaguar Wrote:
(06-14-2020, 01:44 AM)OncaAtrox Wrote: @Dark Jaguar you probably mean Tote or Caricare

Tote:


*This image is copyright of its original author


Caricare:


*This image is copyright of its original author


One last one I posted a while ago who I also think is quite big is Pajarote:


*This image is copyright of its original author

No its neither of those, its one that the picture is during the day, you can see his body in details.


Anyways There's good news coming, new captures made by Reprocon in Pantanal and IOP team as well as Richard Rasmussen were guests and accompanied the captures.

As far as I know it was a male and a female captured


Female












Male (skip to -10 sec)








No weight statements from them ( as usual ) but I am sure Richard will post it on his channel just like he did with Richard cerrado male and his visits in IOP Sanctuary. So my hopes are all on Richard now to know these Pantanal jaguars captured by Reprocon.


and speaking of Richard check out his new video about an aggressive captive jaguar from brazilian zoo they weighed him, compare the jaguar with domestic cat and much more. check it out.





This one? This is Caricare :)


*This image is copyright of its original author


And yes, I also saw those captures by IOP, they're always so secretive with releasing the weights but let's hope we can get them to do it eventually.

Yup thats the one, on your first pict he was on the other side.

Don't sleep on this dude he means business.

Haven't I already said he is impressive on a different pic? I recall calling one Aurora male really impressive it was possibly him.




IOP wasn't the ones that captured those jaguars, it was Reprocon, IOP were guests and followed the process ( despite they already captured jaguars in pantanal in the past ) with Richard in Pantanal and I completely agree with you they won't say the weight unless its in a study ducument or something or you ask them personally I already tried to get weights many times with Reprocon too but with no success either.


Anyways Cerrado and Caatinga jaguars weights and measurements are the hardest to get specially the latter.


RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Pckts - 06-18-2020


*This image is copyright of its original author


*This image is copyright of its original author



RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Balam - 06-18-2020

Paw lengths of 14 cm by Argentinian Chaco jaguars, how well do these compare to Pantanal pugmarks? 14 cm in length represents a big cat:




RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Pckts - 06-21-2020

(06-18-2020, 05:57 PM)OncaAtrox Wrote: Paw lengths of 14 cm by Argentinian Chaco jaguars, how well do these compare to Pantanal pugmarks? 14 cm in length represents a big cat:


Huge, any pugmark over 5'' is a 100kg+ cat easy.


RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Balam - 06-21-2020

@Pckts I do believe these jaguars are among the biggest as well. The ones from the San Miguelito area seem particularly large.


RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Pckts - 06-21-2020

(06-21-2020, 01:45 AM)OncaAtrox Wrote: @Pckts I do believe these jaguars are among the biggest as wells and even your book talla about that. The ones from the San Miguelito area are tanks.


*This image is copyright of its original author


*This image is copyright of its original author



RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Richardrli - 06-21-2020

In terms of averages, would the Sumatran tiger still be larger than even the largest subspecies/population of jaguars? I would have thought so, as Sumatrans despite being the smallest living tiger subspecies still have larger skulls than jaguars from the Pantanal.


RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Balam - 06-21-2020

(06-21-2020, 08:02 PM)Richardrli Wrote: In terms of averages, would the Sumatran tiger still be larger than even the largest subspecies/population of jaguars? I would have thought so, as Sumatrans despite being the smallest living tiger subspecies still have larger skulls than jaguars from the Pantanal.

I'm wary of using skull measurements to determine the overall size of an animal because oftentimes skull lengths might be proportionally larger in a certain species than in another one, while the one with the shorter skull may present similar or larger overall body sizes. A clear example of this is cougars and leopards.

Based on the weights that I have seen of Sumatran tigers from different sources, their averages go from 110 kg to 120 kg, and the heaviest Sumatran confirmed in the wild weighed 148 kg. All of these weights are within the largest jaguars' ranges. But I think @peter who has studied the skulls of both species in person and is well versed in tiger anatomy could give us a better perspective on the subject.


RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Dark Jaguar - 06-21-2020

@Richardrli

I wouldn't rely only on skull sizes to set the sizes here, when it comes to males despite I think Sumatran male Tigers is slightly larger than Pantanal male Jaguars on average the modern pantanal jaguars need proper detailed study on their average sizes since we can't rely only on datas of more than 40 years ago, many things have changed since then.

With that being said when it comes to overlapping Pantanal male jaguars and large Cerrado male jaguars do overlap with sumatran male tigers.


RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - peter - 06-22-2020

(06-21-2020, 08:18 PM)OncaAtrox Wrote:
(06-21-2020, 08:02 PM)Richardrli Wrote: In terms of averages, would the Sumatran tiger still be larger than even the largest subspecies/population of jaguars? I would have thought so, as Sumatrans despite being the smallest living tiger subspecies still have larger skulls than jaguars from the Pantanal.

I'm weary of using skull measurements to determine the overall size of an animal because often times skull lengths might be proportionally higher in a certain species than in another one, while the one with the shorter skull may present similar or larger overall body sizes. A clear example of this are cougars and leopards.

Based on the weights that I have seen of Sumatran tigers from different sources, their averages go from 110 kg to 120 kg, and the heaviest Sumatran confirmed in the wild weighed 148 kg. All of these weights are within the largest jaguars' ranges. But I think @peter who has studied the skulls of both species in person and is well versed in tiger anatomy could give us a better perspective on the subject.

I think you, Richardrli and Dark Jaguar (referring to his last post) just about covered it. A major problem is a lack of recent information from Sumatra. As a result of the efforts of you and Dark Jaguar, we now know a bit more about Pantanal jaguars, but recent info on Sumatran tigers isn't there. 

A few years ago, I made a few tables based on the skulls I measured in natural history museums. I'll post them when I have time. 

By the way. The new thread on large wild pumas is a nice one, Onca. I saw a few documentaries on pumas recently. Experienced trackers and biologists were quite impressed by some of the males in Patagonia and Chili. Most unfortunately, they have not been measured and weighed.


RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Balam - 06-22-2020

@peter thanks for your valuable input! Lately I've been studying a lot about the ecology of cougars in different areas and I've come across some very interesting findings. For one it's very likely that Patagonia cougars are the largest of their species with mature males probability surpassing 100 kgs more often than not, as I continue to gather data I will update that thread. These cougars are feeding predominantly on guanacos and wild horses (I posted about their interactions with wild horses with more detail on the predation thread in case anyone's interested), combined with the fact that they have no competition and live in cold areas, you get the perfect recipe for large cats to occur. It'll be very interesting to see how that thread develops as we find more information.

We will also be expectant on new data on Sumatran tigers, indeed they are very understudied and I personally think some large males should have no problem surpassing 150 or even 160 kgs in weight. Likewise there are some jaguar populations that are also understudied that appear to produce large specimens, most specifically the Chaco and los Llanos. This comparatively I had made some time ago actually depicts a Chaco jaguar known as "Aries" and recently some of the biologists who tracked him said his weight should've been between 120 to 130 kg. We also have the large pugmarks of slightly above 14 cm, so we know these jaguars are also quite big. Aries and a Sumatran tiger:
*This image is copyright of its original author



RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Balam - 06-23-2020

Patrizia Pantanal female, 81 Kgs



Here they had estimated her weight to have been 70 kg before finding out is was 81



Hopefully they'll post the weight of the male soon.


RE: Modern Weights and Measurements of Jaguars - Richardrli - 06-23-2020

What do you guys make of the theory that the large jaguars of the Pantanal and Llanos are so noticeably bigger than other jaguars populations because they feed on the easy prey of cattle in those areas? The point would be that prior to European colonization they were not so big as their natural prey (or indeed the natural prey of all post Pleistocene jaguars) are relatively small.