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+----- Thread: The Birmingham Males (/topic-the-birmingham-males)
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RE: The Birmingham Males - Tr1x24 - 01-06-2023
(01-06-2023, 02:36 AM)Musa15 Wrote: Unfortunately it wouldn't be the first time a Birmingham male vanishes without closure.
Well, if Nhenha doesnt show up, i think its pretty clear what happened, he was killed by PC males that night, unlike disappearence of Tinyo or Mfumo, where we dont know what happened to them.
RE: The Birmingham Males - afortich - 01-06-2023
(01-06-2023, 04:00 AM)Tr1x24 Wrote:(01-06-2023, 02:36 AM)Musa15 Wrote: Unfortunately it wouldn't be the first time a Birmingham male vanishes without closure.
Well, if Nhenha doesnt show up, i think its pretty clear what happened, he was killed by PC males that night, unlike disappearence of Tinyo or Mfumo, where we dont know what happened to them.
Agree, at least we know what happened buddy. Now you reminded me that Tinyo actually just disappeared.
RE: The Birmingham Males - Mapokser - 01-06-2023
I'm still somehow skeptical of Nhenha's "apparent" death unless some good recent photos of PCM shows some actual injuries.
I remember when the 2 Mapogos killed the 5th Majingilane, they left the fight with some nasty injuries. Even when Mr.T was killed by 4 Selatis, the face of one of the Selatis after the fight was a mess.
So it strikes me as weird that PCM apparently got rid of Nhenha without sustaining any cuts to their faces, no injuries to their legs ( maybe just a very light limp in the smaller PCM ). As for his disappearance, as already mentioned the Mangheni subadult wasn't seen for weeks but was still alive ( though not anymore unfortunately ).
Maybe an even better example was that Iirc after the last clash between the 2 old Mapogos and the 2 KNP males in 2012, Makhuku vanished while the 2 KNP were seen alive and in great condition ( same scenario as now ), but some weeks later Makhulu showed up alive and well.
For these reasons I won't rule Nhenha out so easily.
RE: The Birmingham Males - Tr1x24 - 01-06-2023
(01-06-2023, 05:51 AM)Mapokser Wrote: I'm still somehow skeptical of Nhenha's "apparent" death unless some good recent photos of PCM shows some actual injuries.
There might not be "bigger" injuries, except few new cuts on faces and front legs/body.
Once 2 powerful males, who know what they are doing, "lock" down their victim, its hard for him to put any significant damage.
One male grabs him by his back neck area, locking him in place, other one is free mauling his legs and groin area.
In that position, locked male cant bite anyone, he can only try use his claws, which are far less dangerous and can only produce insignificant damage aka cuts.
Example of this are Ginger and HB vs Fourways male :
Poor male couldn't do nothing.
RE: The Birmingham Males - afortich - 01-06-2023
(01-06-2023, 05:51 AM)Mapokser Wrote: I'm still somehow skeptical of Nhenha's "apparent" death unless some good recent photos of PCM shows some actual injuries.
I remember when the 2 Mapogos killed the 5th Majingilane, they left the fight with some nasty injuries. Even when Mr.T was killed by 4 Selatis, the face of one of the Selatis after the fight was a mess.
So it strikes me as weird that PCM apparently got rid of Nhenha without sustaining any cuts to their faces, no injuries to their legs ( maybe just a very light limp in the smaller PCM ). As for his disappearance, as already mentioned the Mangheni subadult wasn't seen for weeks but was still alive ( though not anymore unfortunately ).
Maybe an even better example was that Iirc after the last clash between the 2 old Mapogos and the 2 KNP males in 2012, Makhuku vanished while the 2 KNP were seen alive and in great condition ( same scenario as now ), but some weeks later Makhulu showed up alive and well.
For these reasons I won't rule Nhenha out so easily.
I agree with you @Mapokser my friend in that the lack of injuries in the PC boys may suggest that Nhenha basically didn't defend himself, which is a very unusual situation.
In addition to your examples above, as far as remember the Red Road male RRM was seen right after the fight with the Tintswalo boys, then, disappeared for about a month or so.
RE: The Birmingham Males - afortich - 01-06-2023
(01-06-2023, 06:04 AM)Tr1x24 Wrote:(01-06-2023, 05:51 AM)Mapokser Wrote: I'm still somehow skeptical of Nhenha's "apparent" death unless some good recent photos of PCM shows some actual injuries.
There might not be "bigger" injuries, except few new cuts on faces and front legs/body.
Once 2 powerful males, who know what they are doing, "lock" down their victim, its hard for him to put any significant damage.
One male grabs him by his back neck area, locking him in place, other one is free mauling his legs and groin area.
In that position, locked male cant bite anyone, he can only try use his claws, which are far less dangerous and can only produce insignificant damage aka cuts.
Example of this are Ginger and HB vs Fourways male :
Poor male couldn't do nothing.
This video is a great example. However, this lion was out of combat immediately, which could be different from Nhenha that so far has vanished.
Anyway, this could be a similar situation if Nhenha never appears.
RE: The Birmingham Males - BA0701 - 01-06-2023
(01-06-2023, 06:14 AM)afortich Wrote:(01-06-2023, 05:51 AM)Mapokser Wrote: I'm still somehow skeptical of Nhenha's "apparent" death unless some good recent photos of PCM shows some actual injuries.
I remember when the 2 Mapogos killed the 5th Majingilane, they left the fight with some nasty injuries. Even when Mr.T was killed by 4 Selatis, the face of one of the Selatis after the fight was a mess.
So it strikes me as weird that PCM apparently got rid of Nhenha without sustaining any cuts to their faces, no injuries to their legs ( maybe just a very light limp in the smaller PCM ). As for his disappearance, as already mentioned the Mangheni subadult wasn't seen for weeks but was still alive ( though not anymore unfortunately ).
Maybe an even better example was that Iirc after the last clash between the 2 old Mapogos and the 2 KNP males in 2012, Makhuku vanished while the 2 KNP were seen alive and in great condition ( same scenario as now ), but some weeks later Makhulu showed up alive and well.
For these reasons I won't rule Nhenha out so easily.
I agree with you @Mapokser my friend in that the lack of injuries in the PC boys may suggest that Nhenha basically didn't defend himself, which is a very unusual situation.
In addition to your examples above, as far as remember the Red Road male RRM was seen right after the fight, then, disappeared for about a month or so, after the fight with the Tintswalo boys.
Nhenha and Tinyo left with rather minor injuries when they killed Othawa Male as well, Nhenha had a couple of superficial holes in the side of his stomach and a slightly swollen face, and Tinyo had no observable injuries and only a slight limp for a few days. I was equally shocked by this, but then @Tr1x24 reminded me of these tactics. Same example would be when Mr T and KT killed fifth Majin, same scenario happened then as well. Another story for another thread and another day, but I still cannot believe that lion actually stood up after that mauling.
RE: The Birmingham Males - sik94 - 01-06-2023
(01-06-2023, 06:31 AM)BA0701 Wrote: I still cannot believe that lion actually stood up after that mauling.
Exactly my thoughts but you could tell he was fatally injured.
RE: The Birmingham Males - Mapokser - 01-06-2023
(01-06-2023, 06:04 AM)Tr1x24 Wrote:(01-06-2023, 05:51 AM)Mapokser Wrote: I'm still somehow skeptical of Nhenha's "apparent" death unless some good recent photos of PCM shows some actual injuries.
There might not be "bigger" injuries, except few new cuts on faces and front legs/body.
Once 2 powerful males, who know what they are doing, "lock" down their victim, its hard for him to put any significant damage.
One male grabs him by his back neck area, locking him in place, other one is free mauling his legs and groin area.
In that position, locked male cant bite anyone, he can only try use his claws, which are far less dangerous and can only produce insignificant damage aka cuts.
Example of this are Ginger and HB vs Fourways male :
Poor male couldn't do nothing.
I remember this video but the Matimba was so much bigger, stronger, and more experient that even while it was Ginger attacking him alone he couldn't even react.
I mean I guess it can happen, but it's not common.
RE: The Birmingham Males - Duco Ndona - 01-06-2023
Absence of wounds is not proof of absence of fight.
Obviously something must have happened. Otherwise Nhenha would have shown himself by now. Its rather out of character for him and Nym to leave eachother like that.
I think we are also lacking good footage of the PCmales and Nym to conclude they were unharmed.
RE: The Birmingham Males - afortich - 01-06-2023
Quote:I think we are also lacking good footage of the PCmales and Nym to conclude they were unharmed.
I think is true @Duco Ndona.
RE: The Birmingham Males - BigLion39 - 01-06-2023
(01-06-2023, 05:51 AM)Mapokser Wrote: So it strikes me as weird that PCM apparently got rid of Nhenha without sustaining any cuts to their faces, no injuries to their legs ( maybe just a very light limp in the smaller PCM ). As for his disappearance, as already
Perfect example, and most rescent, in the Mara.... 3 Offbeat males killing Logol. In the 2 very short videos, 1 videos shows how 1 of the males attack and lock Logol down. He grabs his back and Logol is unable to do absolutely anything. It gives the misconception, to me atleast, that he is not even defending himself, but it is just Logol is unable. So that's clearly how males can kill another without sustaining any injury. It is ezlxtremely hard to watch. Thay said, hope Nhena is still alive and I won't count him out. IMHO Nhena was in remarkably better condition than Logol and much older.
RE: The Birmingham Males - criollo2mil - 01-06-2023
(01-06-2023, 10:52 AM)Duco Ndona Wrote: Absence of wounds is not proof of absence of fight.
Obviously something must have happened. Otherwise Nhenha would have shown himself by now. Its rather out of character for him and Nym to leave eachother like that.
I think we are also lacking good footage of the PCmales and Nym to conclude they were unharmed.
PCMS are w ximunghwe today. Video and pics from roger rusley. They look flawless
https://www.instagram.com/tv/CnEVCs7u9mR/?igshid=MWI4MTIyMDE=
https://www.instagram.com/reel/CnEXaw_o_rf/?igshid=MWI4MTIyMDE=
RE: The Birmingham Males - afortich - 01-06-2023
(01-06-2023, 12:09 PM)BigLion39 Wrote:(01-06-2023, 05:51 AM)Mapokser Wrote: So it strikes me as weird that PCM apparently got rid of Nhenha without sustaining any cuts to their faces, no injuries to their legs ( maybe just a very light limp in the smaller PCM ). As for his disappearance, as already
Perfect example, and most rescent, in the Mara.... 3 Offbeat males killing Logol. In the 2 very short videos, 1 videos shows how 1 of the males attack and lock Logol down. He grabs his back and Logol is unable to do absolutely anything. It gives the misconception, to me atleast, that he is not even defending himself, but it is just Logol is unable. So that's clearly how males can kill another without sustaining any injury. It is ezlxtremely hard to watch. Thay said, hope Nhena is still alive and I won't count him out. IMHO Nhena was in remarkably better condition than Logol and much older.
I'm like you bro @BigLion39 , I need more time to accept Nhenha's dead.
In those examples of instant dead the corpses were found close by the attack location. Right now, he could be recovering as RRM did after the fight with the Tintswalo.
RE: The Birmingham Males - Mapokser - 01-06-2023
@criollo2mil Tbf I've the impression the smaller PCM has an injured right paw. Maybe I'm wrong but in the video where they attack Gingerella it seems he is not forcing the paw and has a limp. He also doesn't chase the female with his brother.