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+----- Thread: The Mighty Mapogos (/topic-the-mighty-mapogos)
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RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Gabriele - 04-09-2022
I could immediately spot Makhulu among his brothers. With his world weary, melancholic and almost contemplative look. Almost like he'd seen it all and had the weight of the whole world on his shoulders.
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Gabriele - 04-10-2022
Makhulu was unstoppable and side by side with Dreadlocks... a force nobody could deal with. Absolutely huges.
It seems to me, when they are close, Makhulu is slightly bigger, he certainly has the blackest mane, but I am not surprised that while he was on patrol, it was Dreadlock who dominated the coalition.
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Mapokser - 04-11-2022
Makhulu's mane was darker, but I think old Dreadlocks had the overall most impressive mane. This is from Rob the Ranger's video I believe, it's from the second half of 2010, after the deaths of Shaka and Rasta.
*This image is copyright of its original author
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Mapokser - 04-11-2022
He also strikes me as bulkier and longer, his forelimbs were full of muscles when he was at his prime:
*This image is copyright of its original author
Also as mentioned before, Rob the Ranger claims that both Dreadlocks and Makhulu were weighed, and Dreadlocks was a bit heavier when considering both in their primes:
*This image is copyright of its original author
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Hairy tummy - 04-11-2022
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - sik94 - 04-11-2022
(04-11-2022, 06:10 AM)Hairy tummy Wrote:
That's some amazing footage, you can feel the tension and see the intentions of Mr. T. Gave me goosebumps if I'm honest.
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Mapokser - 04-11-2022
Very interesting video. Mapogos have a history with killing their own coalition's cubs. The 5 younger ones killed Makhulu's cubs in 2007 too. Does anyone even know why? Maybe because Makhulu was the only one who mated with the lionesses? Iirc it maybe have been even another occasion of Mapogos killing cubs besides the 2007 and the 2010 occasions.
But on Mr.T's case, it's interesting because he clearly sees that the others are protecting the cubs and won't even allow him to get close to the kill. I wonder if his intentions were to kill them to mate with the lionesses himself ( and he didn't mind killing his nephews for that ), or he was just instinctively killing them because from his POV they are foreigner cubs and he was confused for why the brothers were protecting them? In this case he couldn't realize that they were their brothers cubs or he couldn't know/be sure since he wasn't there when they were mating.
It's hard to know his reasons exactly since, well, he's a lion, he doesn't have human reasoning and acts more on instinct. But my point is, it's normal behaviour for a lion to kill his brother's cubs if he think there's no chance the cubs are his? If he knows he didn't mated with the lioness and only his brother did, would the lion consider killing the cubs if he gets the chance? If he suddenly becomes the dominant of the two, if the other dies and he's the only dominant one, or some similar situation, or would he be ok having nephews around? Or if anything, he would kill them to be able to mate with the lionesses faster?
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Mapokser - 04-11-2022
Another thing to consider is that the other Mapogos were very aware that Mr.T was a threat to the cubs and probably knew he was the one killing them, but they didn't treat him as an outsider, it's a very unique situation.
There're videos from the first half of 2009 where Mr.T is hanging out with the western Mapogos, but I wonder how long exactly they were separated, like, when was the last time the Mlowathis met the western Mapogos? If it was around January-March 2009 ( since it's the dates of the videos I saw with them together ), when Mr.T showed up again on June-July it'd have been more than a year since the western Mapogos saw him for the last time.
It must have been pretty weird for the 4 when Mr.T rejoined them for good and despite them seeing him as a coalition partner like he always was, they were seeing their cubs dying by Mr.T's own paws. They even followed Mr.T back to his previous territory to try to find the Majingilane, which ended up with Rasta dying ( regardless if killed by Majingilane or not, if he wasn't there, he wouldn't have died ). Perhaps, for them, it'd really have been better if they have refused Mr.T and chased him out, though as I said, it was probably very weird from their POV since they recognized Mr.T as their coalition brother and coalitions members don't chase or kill each other.
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Tr1x24 - 04-11-2022
@Mapokser as for killing cubs in coalitions, it usually happens in big coalitions when males are separated between the prides, and some males are unfamiliar with certain pride of his brothes or didnt mate with them.
Small recent example would be Nhenha and Tinyo with Tsalala female, Nhenha hanged with them, but to Tinyo they are strangers, he doesnt know that Tsalala cub was sired by his brother, he would definitely kill the cub if he had a chance.
As for mr T, same example, that was unfamiliar pride for him, he prob doesnt care that these cubs are his brothers, lions look for themselves , he didnt mate with those females, thats the reason why females in pride mate will all males in a coalition.
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Gabriele - 04-11-2022
(04-11-2022, 09:22 AM)Mapokser Wrote: Very interesting video. Mapogos have a history with killing their own coalition's cubs. The 5 younger ones killed Makhulu's cubs in 2007 too. Does anyone even know why? Maybe because Makhulu was the only one who mated with the lionesses? Iirc it maybe have been even another occasion of Mapogos killing cubs besides the 2007 and the 2010 occasions.
But on Mr.T's case, it's interesting because he clearly sees that the others are protecting the cubs and won't even allow him to get close to the kill. I wonder if his intentions were to kill them to mate with the lionesses himself ( and he didn't mind killing his nephews for that ), or he was just instinctively killing them because from his POV they are foreigner cubs and he was confused for why the brothers were protecting them? In this case he couldn't realize that they were their brothers cubs or he couldn't know/be sure since he wasn't there when they were mating.
It's hard to know his reasons exactly since, well, he's a lion, he doesn't have human reasoning and acts more on instinct. But my point is, it's normal behaviour for a lion to kill his brother's cubs if he think there's no chance the cubs are them? If he knows he didn't mated with the lionessand only his brother did, would the lion consider killing the cubs if he gets the chance? If he suddenly becomes the dominant of the two, if the other dies and he's the only dominant one, or some similar situation, or would he be ok having nephews around? Or if anything, he would kill them to be able to mate with the lionesses faster?
Of course we are sorry, but he did not do it for 'malice', when he returned to his brothers he could not recognize the cubs as grandchildren, and generally lions do not mind killing their grandchildren and sometimes even their children if they think that are not their children. It's a real shame that so few Mapogo descendants survived, yes. But I like to see mr T with his ears down, intimidated by his brothers, some praise him too much, while he was probably the smallest and least dominant, albeit with the most aggressive behaviors. He remains the great merit of having remained to fight against the 4 selati, allowing the elders Makhulu and Pretty Boy to escape, the selati gave him a more honorable death than the one that the maginjilane gave to KT, and they also tried with the huge hairy belly in 4v1, but it kept them at bay.
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Gabriele - 04-11-2022
(04-11-2022, 09:35 AM)Mapokser Wrote: Another thing to consider is that the other Mapogos were very aware that Mr.T was a threat to the cubs and probably knew he was the one killing them, but they didn't treat him as an outsider, it's a very unique situation.
There're videos from the first half of 2009 where Mr.T is hanging out with the western Mapogos, but I wonder how long exactly they were separated, like, when was the last time the Mlowathis met the western Mapogos? If it was around January-March 2009 ( since it's the dates of the videos I saw with them together ), when Mr.T showed up again on June-July it'd have been more than a year since the western Mapogos saw him for the last time.
It must have been pretty weird for the 4 when Mr.T rejoined them for good and despite them seeing him as a coalition partner like he always was, they were seeing their cubs dying by Mr.T's own paws. They even followed Mr.T back to his previous territory to try to find the Majingilane, which ended up with Rasta dying ( regardless if killed by Majingilane or not, if he wasn't there, he wouldn't have died ). Perhaps, for them, it'd really have been better if they have refused Mr.T and chased him out, though as I said, it was probably very weird from their POV since they recognized Mr.T as their coalition brother and coalitions members don't chase or kill each other.
Regarding Rasta, the Mapogo fans exclude a priori that he was killed by the Maginji, but I think it is possible, it is not said that they were poachers. Rasta was the twin of Pretty Boy, and Pretty Boy was seen injured, a sign that he had fought. Makhulu, Mr T and Dreadlock had no wound marks, it seems. But we cannot think that a coalition is always together 24 hours a day, especially a large coalition. Makhulu used to go away for weeks alone, there is a nice video in which the 5 Mapogos siblings still sub-adults are without protection have to escape in front of two big lions (whose name I don't remember). Considering the Maginji's way of acting, I wouldn't be surprised if the Rasta colossus was also attacked in 4 and mauled.
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Potato - 04-11-2022
Males in general do kill cubs which they do not consider as potentially their own so it is quite simple why Mr T killed cubs in 2011. Case from 2006 might be different, but in the end we can only speculate what went through the heads of those males when they dicided to kill cubs. Intresitngly Matimba males in around 2011/2012 killed cubs in Mbiri pride even through they were the ones who sired them and we can definitelly say so as they were accepting of the only 2 survivors of the slother. Again we can only speculate as to why certain thinks has happened, but probably Matimbas were confused seeing cubs and at the moment did not recognize them. Same think could happend in Othawa pride in 2006.
(04-11-2022, 01:01 PM)Tr1x24 Wrote: Small recent example would be Nhenha and Tinyo with Tsalala female, Nhenha hanged with them, but to Tinyo they are strangers, he doesnt know that Tsalala cub was sired by his brother, he would definitely kill the cub if he had a chance.That Tinyo hasn't been seen mating with Tsalala female doesn't mean he did not mate with her. Tinyo was seen in company of Tsalala pride and wasn't aggressive towards her at all.
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Tr1x24 - 04-11-2022
Just as we talk about mr T and killing cubs in his return, here is new video of him after KT death, as he returned to his brothers, Dreadlocks and Pretty Boy didnt like his presence near the cubs:
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Gabriele - 04-11-2022
(04-11-2022, 06:28 PM)Tr1x24 Wrote: Just as we talk about mr T and killing cubs in his return, here is new video of him after KT death, as he returned to his brothers, Dreadlocks and Pretty Boy didnt like his presence near the cubs:But it's the same video as before
RE: The Mighty Mapogos - Tr1x24 - 04-11-2022
(04-11-2022, 06:39 PM)Gabriele Wrote: But it's the same video as before
Yea? I didnt saw this before.