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+--- Thread: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? (/topic-can-a-male-tiger-have-a-successful-face-to-face-kill-on-a-adult-bull-gaur)
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Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - faess - 03-25-2015
Now lets have the tables turned,since there is evidence of Tigers killing adult buffalo , including gaur, lets take it up a notch and see ifthere is any record of a Tiger killing an adult gaur faceto face.
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - Siegfried - 03-25-2015
Whether there is a record of it or not, I tend to believe that it more than likely has happened.
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - sanjay - 03-25-2015
Good question, Unlike Lion habitat in Africa, Tiger lives in dense forest. Its extremely hard to film or photograph them during actions. In India there are tough laws to film and study tigers in their natural habitat when compared to African country.
I don't recall any record from past where a tiger has been filmed or photographed from start to end killing full grown male gaur. Now, there is famous video of tiger Raja killing a guar. But you can not say about the age and condition of guar.
One point to note that. There is no way to find the condition of either prey(guar, buffalo, elephant etc) or hunter(Lions, Tigers, Jaguar Leopard etc), so if you hate tiger and tiger kills a guar, you will not accept saying that the guar is not big or not in good condition. If guar chased the tiger and you are tiger fan you will say that tiger was not fully grown... so on. Same thing for Lion fan and haters.
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - GrizzlyClaws - 03-25-2015
The territorial alpha males like Charger/Wagdoh/B2/Madla definitely have a chance to kill a male gaur face to face.
But still, it would be a pretty dangerous task, and the undesired result could be somewhat fatal even to a dominant male tiger.
Tiger as a lone hunter, the primary option is always to kill its large preys via an ambush attack.
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - Pckts - 03-25-2015
Are we suppose to post all the images of Bull Gaur and stories as well?
*This image is copyright of its original author
*This image is copyright of its original author
*This image is copyright of its original author
*This image is copyright of its original author
*This image is copyright of its original author
What I recently thought impossible was a Tigress killing a bull gaur, but one account just recently shown has a tigress killed a bull gaur, older but still a bull.
Both the images above are bull gaur killed by mother tigress'.
I still have suspicions that a tigress can kill a prime bull gaur but who knows.
With the story of Odin, the massive bull gaur, he was out of his prime but still a force, he battled with a territory holding male all night, blood was everywhere but he survived the night. He was still being tracked by the male in the morning but he was alive. It is no easy task to kill a bull gaur, but its been done. But failures and death will occur as well from time to time.
Even Waghdohs scar was obtained by predation on a bull gaur or so it is claimed, so even the baddest tiger around may still have to pay a price when battling a bull gaur.
In the wild there is no guarantee, every outcome can be different even if the scenario is the same.
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - Pckts - 03-25-2015
Here is the report of Odin and the Tiger
*This image is copyright of its original author
Standing over 6 ft tall, weighing more than 1 ton in weight, Odin in his prime was the biggest bull in this area.
*This image is copyright of its original author
He must be around 12 to 13 years old now, pretty old for a Gaur out in the wild and though he has lost much of his weight, he is still a formidable animal. I have been seeing him for the last 5 years, he’d come down during the evenings, graze by the edge of the watering hole before proceeding to drink his fill, he’d then look towards the cottages, hold his gaze for a while before moving back into the jungle. He was in his prime the first time I saw him, it was such a majestic animal with rippling muscles and an imposing gait. During my sojourns into the forest, I have seen him multiple times, grazing or resting under a tree. Most of the Gaurs would turn and bolt if they see a human approach, but not Odin, he would hold his ground knowing well that he had nothing to fear from a puny human. We both would look at each other, and we would keep a respectful distance before moving on.Gaurs are not very vocal animals, that is especially true in the evenings. So when I heard the distress-filled bellow coming from the edge of the forest at 8 in the night, I knew instinctively that something was wrong. I had seen Odin grazing in the grassland in the evening, and though he was past his prime, he was still a formidable opponent for any of the carnivores. A leopard wouldn’t dare attack a male Gaur, the wild dogs would be resting by this time and the only animal brave and strong enough to take on a mature Gaur is the Tiger. Yesterday night we had heard the Tiger call from close to the farm and during the early morning trek we saw huge pugmarks of the resident male Tiger, could it be that Odin had finally met his match?Then we heard the grunts of the Tiger mixed with the bellow of the Gaur, my fear was confirmed, it was clear that the battle was on. By the time I took the night-vision camera and raced to the watchtower, a few of our resident guests who had also heard the commotion were already there. We used the torch to see if we could see anything in the night. Apart from the alarmed spotted deer, we couldn’t see anything in the grassland, but we could still hear the battle-royale from the edge of the forest. At times the grunts would turn into thunderous roars, so it was clear that the Tiger had failed to deliver the killing blow – Tigers kill their prey by breaking the neck. Now that Odin knew that the threat was upon him, it was clear that he’d be wary of another attack to the neck and as Gaur’s usually do when attacked, he himself went into the attack mode. We could hear dry bamboo getting trampled under his weight as he was having a go at the Tiger using his massive horns. The Tiger had lost the surprise element as Odin knew that the attack was on, but the Tiger was still stronger, in his prime and the bull Gaur bull had just one eye. It was too much of a handicap to give away – surely, there was only one outcome to the end of this fight. After 10 minutes or so, the noise died out as quickly as it had started – only 2 things could have happened; Odin was dead or Odin, true to his name had outwitted the Tiger. If it was the latter, we knew that he’d come out into the grasslands once again because most of the animals feel safe close to human settlements. That is why you see spotted deer near human settlements inside the forest. We waited with baited breath, hoping to see a weary Odin limp back towards the watering hole. But there was no sign of Odin, perhaps it was the end of the majestic, bull Gaur that roamed the Thirunelly forests. Roam he would no more.After talking to the amazed guests, and telling them about what would have happened, I retired to my room. I was feeling dejected about Odin’s plight – but that is nature’s way, survival of the fittest. Odin was probably no match for the big resident male. (Boy.. how wrong was I!)I knew I wouldn’t sleep well that night, and by day-break I was up and ready with my camera and my trekking kit, and thankfully it was not raining. So at first light I headed out into the forest to see first-hand what had happened during the night. I reached the edge of the forest and in no time I could see where the battle had taken place. There were pools of blood, but there was no sign of Odin or the Cat. I scoured around to see if there was a drag mark, the Tiger, if it had made the kill would have dragged the Gaur deeper into the jungle. Odin was close to 1000kg, so he was far too heavy for a Tiger to lift, so it’d have left a distinct drag mark on the ground. I went around the area hoping that I wouldn’t see the mark and I was relieved when I didn’t. I could see the ground was trampled, large bamboo clumps were broken like twigs, there were pugmarks and hoofmarks everywhere – it was clear that both the beasts had not backed out of the fight and they both had a real go at each other.
*This image is copyright of its original author
There was blood everywhere, it was a titanic battle between the Tiger and the Gaur.
I decided to see where the animals had gone and it was not hard to find the two distinct trails, one of the Tiger and then of Odin and to my dismay, I could see that Odin had bled profusely as he moved deeper into the jungle. I kept following the track for close to 500 meters and then my heart sank when I saw the pugmark of the Tiger superimposed on Odin’s hoof mark, the Tiger had come back and had started trailing Odin once again.I had to be extra careful now as I was tracking an injured bull Gaur who wouldn’t like my approach, worse still, The Tiger could have killed the Gaur at night and perhaps he was guarding the kill and he wouldn’t take kindly to my approach either. I inched forward, stopping and listening for the sounds that would give away the presence of either of these animals. The blood trail was easy to follow and soon I reached a swamp where Odin had rested, though there were chunks of clotted blood on the ground, but it looked as though Odin was not as severely injured as I had earlier believed. The Tiger had also laid down perhaps 50 feet away from Odin, and they both had again gotten up and walked deeper into the jungle. I kept after them and wanted to know how it had ended. Soon I noticed that Odin had decided that he’d take a U-turn and come towards the farm once again! The Tiger had followed him as well. By this time I would have covered close to 2 kms and with every passing step I could see that the blood trail was getting thinner and thinner, which was a good sign! We crossed some rivulets on the way and soon I passed the mota-teak tree (the big-teak tree) which is just a few hundred meters from the farm. Where was Odin heading, I wondered as I kept following the track and then I realized that it was just Odin’s track the I was following, the Tiger had stopped the chase and I couldn’t see the Tiger’s pug mark anymore. Retracing a few paces, I could see that the Tiger had taken a forest path which went deeper into the jungle, perhaps he thought that he had no chance of surprising Odin again that night.I continued on hoping to see Odin ahead of me and just as I broke cover and entered the grassland inside our farm, I could see the familiar figure, that of Odin, standing by the edge of the grassland grazing as though nothing had happened! I stood there looking at the old warrior, admiring his courage and will to live, he outsmarted and outfought the big male Tiger, the wily old Odin!
*This image is copyright of its original author
Odin was bleeding thanks to the attack last night, but the wounds weren’t life threatening
*This image is copyright of its original author
The old bull Gaur – Odin with his battle scarsI coughed so that he knew I was near. He lifted his massive head and looked at me through his good eye! He knew it was me as he held his gaze and we made eye-contact for a few seconds before he lowered his head and started grazing again. I could see the injuries he had sustained, a big piece of the muscular rump that he had on his back was bitten off and there were clear bite and claw marks on his shoulder and back. A small piece of his nose was also torn off, but the big bull had proved once again that it was not time for him to go, just yet. The Tiger had failed to get a grip on his neck and that had saved him.True to his name, he must have lost an eye, but in return he is blessed with extraordinary strength and wisdom.
So I think what this shows is, a tiger will attack a bull gaur, sometimes it will win, sometimes it will loose. No outcome is certain....
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - faess - 03-25-2015
Yeah I am asking just for at least one account of Tiger killing an adult gaur face to face, with an account. Not a predation attempt, but a face to face, even failed predation attempts will count.
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - Pckts - 03-25-2015
Ok, so you have the Odin account and this account
*This image is copyright of its original author
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - Pckts - 03-25-2015
The other images are tigers feeding on bulls that they had killed.
This is a Tigress feeding on old Bull she killed
*This image is copyright of its original author
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - Pckts - 03-25-2015
But if you're trying to find a Video of a Tiger vs Bull gaur from start to finish battle to the death, that is like looking for a needle in a haystack.
We've been viewing tigers for 15 + years with mobile cameras and obviously they prey on gaur quite often but the only video ever gotten of start to finish is Raja vs Gaur which they were extremely lucky to see. Like Sanjay said, finding a tiger in the terrain they live is incredibly hard, finding a successful predation is even harder, finding a very rare type of predation is almost impossible to view live.
But there are live guar being killed by tiger on film
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - faess - 03-25-2015
Really doesn't have to be footage of the attack, maybe a book describing the details of a Tiger taking out an adult gaur face to face would be enough.
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - Pckts - 03-26-2015
(03-25-2015, 11:52 PM)'faess' Wrote: Really doesn't have to be footage of the attack, maybe a book describing the details of a Tiger taking out an adult gaur face to face would be enough.
You have the Munna predation on a Bull Gaur Description and the odin description and Bull gaur carcasses being consumed and Bull Guar in the midst of being killed. I think those are all pretty good since its so hard to see tiger predation period.
Try to find Tiger predations from begining to end, period. Its incredibly hard and rare, doesn't mean that they don't occur daily, just means you have to be extremely lucky to view it.
It's not like viewing a pride of lions on a open plain following a massive herd. The Jungle is a diferent animal than the savanah.
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - Spalea - 03-26-2015
I have been waiting for a very long time before really viewing a video showing a lone tiger, Raja according to what you said, killing an adult gaur. Before it I really doubted than a lone tiger could achieve that. As you said this is much more difficult to watching and filming such a fact than the same facts as concerns lions in afican savannah. And we can add that the tigers are, in my opinion, more discreet than lions, than prides of lions.
Of course I cannot judge the health of the gaur killed by Raja. Nevertheless I was amazed to note how easily the tiger seemed to master the gaur's reaction defenses. More easily than a male lion killing a lone buffalo, for exemple in the movies posted by Lionness, without forgetting the gaur's weight being bigger than the african buffalo's one. Perhaps too, on the other hand, the african buffalos protect oneself more vigorously against the lions. But, of course, I cannot be categorical after having seen an only one or two videos showing a tiger killing an adult gaur. We cannot be categorical after so few examples.
But yes, I am sure of that now !
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - brotherbear - 03-26-2015
Very recently, there have been reports of a tiger which has aquired a taste for rhinoceros. This tiger has amushed and killed several mature rhino cows, which amazes me. After learning of these events, I have no doubts of the tiger's ability to kill a bull gaur.
RE: Can a male Tiger have a successful face to face kill on a Adult Bull Gaur? - Pckts - 03-26-2015
Like Bro Bear mentioned, killing a Rhino in my opinion is by far the toughest task. Even over a elephant, I think Rhinos being so massive and "armored" as well as low to the ground, its just a very hard animal to prey on. Even Lion prides more regularly prey on Elephant than Rhino, I would probably put Hippo up there as well.
Another Tiger predation animal that is amazingly impressive is the Asian Water Buffalo, its the 2nd largest Bovine and has horns larger than any other. There are a few images of tigers preying on them as well as wounds suffered by tigers.