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+--- Thread: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - THE TIGER (Panthera tigris) (/topic-on-the-edge-of-extinction-a-the-tiger-panthera-tigris)
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RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - peter - 04-24-2014
I didn't take your post as 'rude', Guate. I agree my post can be explained in more than one way. So no offence taken and my apologies for being unclear.
As for the two versions of the book. Maybe Lofdahl and Shevlakov translated the original, 1987, edition. The second, 2012, edition of the monograph is " ... in nearly all but a few ways identical to the first ... " (Editors foreword to the English language edition, pp. 5).
There could be a difference regarding the study periods, though. The full title of the second (2012) edition is: 'Winter Ecology of the Amur Tiger based upon Observations in the West-Central Sichote-Alin Mountains, 1970-1973, 1996-2010', whereas the full title of the (2004) Lofdahl-Shevlakov translation is 'The Ecology of the Amur Tiger based on Long-Term Winter Observations 1970-1973 in the Western Sector of the Central Sichote-Alin Mountains' (from your post).
It seems the difference between both editions is in the addition 1996-2010. I will get back to that one when I've finished the book.
RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - Richardrli - 04-24-2014
It seems that for this 2012 new edition there's a chapter at the end devoted to the status of Amur tigers in the period 1996-2010.
RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - Pckts - 04-24-2014
Thanks for the link, Gaute.
In that book, the chapter about fights between male tigers. It talks about the "lazy tiger" who was killed in a fight with the "powerful tiger" and says the were surprised with how much blood was lost throughout the tigers tracks and when they weighed him, he was 192kg. So if we assume they weighed him once he finally died he was probably around 200-210kg (no idea how much blood a tiger holds) and lets assume the Powerful tiger is more than the lazy tiger, that seems to fight right in with these tigers averages.
RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - GuateGojira - 04-25-2014
(04-24-2014, 06:30 PM)'Richardrli' Wrote: It seems that for this 2012 new edition there's a chapter at the end devoted to the status of Amur tigers in the period 1996-2010.That is why I want to buy this book in the future. The information of 1996-2010 is very relevant for our knowledge.
I hope to that in the future, the Monograph of 2005 could be translated to the English. Dr Miquelle told me that a translation was in process but there is one year now and no translation has been presented yet. [img]images/smilies/sad.gif[/img]
RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - GuateGojira - 04-25-2014
(04-24-2014, 10:09 PM)'Pckts' Wrote: Thanks for the link, Gaute.I remember a case of a Bengal tiger that weighed 437 lb but lost a lot of blood, it was estimated that most be added about a galon and the real weight whould be of 447 lb. If they add 10 lb (4.5 kg) in this case, then "Lazy tiger" probably weighed c.197 kg when normall. This is a pretty normal figure for an Amur tiger even in these days. What interest me is that probably "Powerful tiger" was a larger tiger, no less than 200 kg, but this shows that these low weights were present since the days of this investigation (1970-1990).
In that book, the chapter about fights between male tigers. It talks about the "lazy tiger" who was killed in a fight with the "powerful tiger" and says the were surprised with how much blood was lost throughout the tigers tracks and when they weighed him, he was 192kg. So if we assume they weighed him once he finally died he was probably around 200-210kg (no idea how much blood a tiger holds) and lets assume the Powerful tiger is more than the lazy tiger, that seems to fight right in with these tigers averages.
RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - Pckts - 04-25-2014
Indeed, it does show that siberians are very similiar in body size to those from the past till the present.
RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - peter - 04-25-2014
WINTER ECOLOGY OF THE AMUR TIGER 1970-1973, 1996-2010 (second edition, 2012)
The death of male tiger 'Lenivyi'
Male tiger 'Lenivyi' ('Lazy') had a pad width of 11,5 cm. He often used roads as travel corridors and often bedded while walking. Maybe he was, as his name indicated, not as active as other males. Lazyness most probably wasn't a reason: when he was examined after they had found him, pathological deformations were observed on his limb bones. These deformities could have impeded walking.
His tracks were first encountered on November 25, 1972. Yudakov and Nikolaev tracked this male for about 290 km. They found Lenivyi crossed a significant portion of the territory of another male tiger (with a pad width of 10,5 cm.) in the 1972-1973 winter. Although they were close to each other at times and Lenivyi even used the same bed as this tiger ('Khozyian', or 'Master'), they never met.
Lenivyi met another large male ( 'Moguchyi' or 'Mighty'). This tiger had a pad width of 12,0 cm. They fought. Yudakov and Nikolaev noted the fight happened at the place where the territories of both 'Khozyain' and 'Moguchyi' overlap. For this reason, they thought the fight had " ... the characteristics of a border dispute ... " (pp. 82).
A fight between 'Moguchyi' and 'Lenivyi' at a place where the territories of 'Moguchyi' and 'Khozyain' overlap? Why wasn't 'Khozyain' involved? Well, 'Khozyain' wasn't there. Tiger 'Lenivyi' was. But what was 'Lenivyi' doing at the boundary of two territories that belonged to other male tigers?
Yudakov and Nikolaev wrote tiger 'Lenivyi' didn't have a territory (pp. 82). This means he was a transient. Why didn't he have a territory? I don't know, but it could be his impediment didn't enable him to establish and hold a territory. Not fit enough.
Anyhow. Tiger 'Moguchyi', maybe because tigress 'Miniatyurnaya' was nearby (pp. 72), reacted extremely aggressive when he met 'Lenivyi'. The fight took place on a mountain slope along a wild boar trail. He drove Lenivyi back and, after some rounds, finally " ... knocked him off the trail. There was a 20-meter strip of bloodied snow, where clumps of fur were found clinging to the bushes. Mortally wounded, Lenivyi fell over a brush pile covered by snow. Holding a postition above him on the slope, Moguchyi turned around and moved past this brush pile along the trail. Lenivyi lay behind the brush pile for a long time, then got up, returned to the trail, and moved along it following Moguchyi (the same direction he was going before encountering Moguchyi) ... " (pp 82-83).
Lenivyi laid down quite often, leaving blood stains in the snow. Finally, he moved to a Korean pine, where he lied down on a bed made by a wild boar. It was at this bed that he died 12 days after the fight with 'Moguchyi':
*This image is copyright of its original author
His front paws " ... had deep lateral wounds inflcited by Moguchyi's claws. Major hemorrhaging was discovered later on the muscles of the front portion of the body. Lenivyi weighed 192 kg. and was 9-10 years old ... " (pp. 83).
The things I remember are 'pathological deformations of the limb bones' (1), 'no territory' (2) and " ... Then, shoving Lenivyi onto a small, open, treeless area, Moguchi knocked him off the trail ... " (3).
I concluded tiger 'Lenivyi' probably was anything but fit. That's why he often rested, that's why he had no territory and that's why he followed other tigers. Perhaps he was hoping for left-overs and a female here and there. The fight with Moguchyi, judging from what I read, wasn't even close to a contest. Moguchi probably knew, as he just left after he had knocked Lenivyi off the trail.
If Lenivyi suffered from pathological deformities of his limb bones, it's likely he had them as a young tiger as well. In spite of this problem, he made it to adulthood. As it's likely he would have been unable to establish and defend a territory at any given time, one has to assume he probably always was a transient. A tiger surviving on what he finds or takes. A bit like a male 'satellite' brown bear perhaps. They follow tigresses with cubs and rob her when possible. Maybe Lenivyi acted in a similar way and maybe he learned to stay away from trouble over the years, in this way surviving for quite a long time. One day, however, he didn't pay attention.
RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - peter - 04-25-2014
RECENT PHOTOGRAPHS OF WILD AMUR TIGERS
3 - Unknown tigress (TOSHIJI-fUKUDA)
Great photographs of a tigress close to the beach
*This image is copyright of its original author
*This image is copyright of its original author
4 - Male tiger 'Murzin' (close-up)
*This image is copyright of its original author
RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - peter - 04-25-2014
BART SCHLEYER
I selected a few pages of this article written after his premature death:
*This image is copyright of its original author
*This image is copyright of its original author
*This image is copyright of its original author
RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - Richardrli - 04-25-2014
Just ordered this book from WCS. [img]images/smilies/smile.gif[/img]
RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - peter - 04-27-2014
Richardrli\ dateline='\'1398405730' Wrote: Just ordered this book from WCS. [img]images/smilies/smile.gif[/img]
When you order the book, you could ask Miquelle about the WCS-project on Amur tigers.
RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - peter - 04-30-2014
THE AIM OF THIS THREAD
There are two boards on big cats in Wildfact and tigers feature in different threads in both. One could wonder about the purpose of this thread. In order to prevent problems, I decided to write this post.
The aim of this thread is to concentrate anything on evolution, taxonomy, habits, habitat, prey and data on body dimensions and weight. This also is the place where you will find information about the recent past, say a century ago or thereabout. I will post a lot of photographs I found in old books in some time. This thread is about humans and tigers as well. I will post a number of authentic stories written by hunters. If you combine the information in this thread with what you'll find in Apollo's thread (Big Cats news), you'll get an idea about the way both interact now and about a century ago.
For now, the focus is on evolution and taxonomy. The reason is new research in the last fifteen years. Guate (in post 6) wrote a great summary. It will be used to get to another I will post in a few days. This will allow for some insight in tiger evolution at a glance.
Although information on all subspecies will be posted every now and then, you're adviced to visit specific threads on tiger subspecies in the other board on big cats if you're interested in one subspecies in particular. These threads will have more recent information and photographs.
RE: ON THE EDGE OF EXTINCTION - A - TIGERS (Panthera tigris) - GrizzlyClaws - 05-05-2014
FOSSILS
Some interesting neolithic big cat fossils from Japan.
http://blogs.yahoo.co.jp/masa1908/53092342.html
http://blog.goo.ne.jp/tommz_1938/e/144aaa3a0f2c70297b373fabcfa959ea
http://www.city.sano.lg.jp/kuzuufossil/kaseki/html/h21_01.html
The tiger genome and comparative analysis with lion and snow leopard genomes - sanjay - 05-13-2014
This is wonderful reseacrh article.
I Request @peter, @GuateGojira And Other Expetrs to take a detail look and study the data. Please See the article at below link
http://www.nature.com/ncomms/2013/130917/ncomms3433/full/ncomms3433.html
There is also a pdf downlink on website. I Guess, this article is written by many renowed wildlife reseacrher.
RE: The tiger genome and comparative analysis with lion and snow leopard genomes - GuateGojira - 05-14-2014
Thank you for the document Sanjay. I am going to read it ASAP.
Greetings. [img]images/smilies/smile.gif[/img]